MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 2225 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Role Playing Games... by HeraldMageJao-+AT+-aol.com 2) MIST: Re: Role Playing Games... by "Eleonora Scoseria" 3) Re: Role Playing Games... by "John Anthony Kazos Jr." 4) Looking to get back into ML (long) by Erin Lewy 5) Re: Error Condition Re: Re: MIST: Re: Role Playing Games... by HeraldMageJao-+AT+-aol.com 6) Bad Judgment call/annoying things the characters did by moonshadow-+AT+-startrekmail.com 7) A review-sparked rant by Erin Lewy 8) Re: Bad Judgment call/annoying things the characters did by Erin Lewy 9) Off-Topic: Kiersey by "Phoenix, Guardian of Harmony" 10) A review-sparked rant by Emzodie-+AT+-aol.com 11) Re: Bad Judgment call/annoying things the characters did by Kerowyn73-+AT+-aol.com 12) Re: A review-sparked rant by PsionicElf-+AT+-aol.com 13) Re: A review-sparked rant by "Lindsay" 14) Re: A review-sparked rant by Erin Lewy 15) Re: A review-sparked rant by Leeranii-+AT+-aol.com 16) Re: A review-sparked rant by MDennis460-+AT+-aol.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2000 11:46:01 EST From: HeraldMageJao-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Role Playing Games... Message-ID: <72.1ce44e5.25e95d49-+AT+-aol.com> I would really like to get involved in a RPG. I have never played before, and I have no clue how to play, but I want to. Does anyone know of any online sites or AOL/Yahoo! chats that focus on Velgarth? I would prefer live action role playing, but if online is all I can get, then I'll take that. And if anyone can explain how to play, I would really appreciate it. Thanx a bunch... Jao ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2000 14:32:50 -0300 From: "Eleonora Scoseria" To: Subject: MIST: Re: Role Playing Games... Message-ID: <000201bf807f$9a5dbe60$0300a8c0-+AT+-Eleonora> Hi, all this is your friendly Councilor on duty, hating to have to say this, but....RPing in Misty's world is a definite nono. I decided to send this to the list instead of privately, in case we have too many newbies/lurkers. Jao wrote: > I would really like to get involved in a RPG. I have never played before, and > I have no clue how to play, but I want to. Does anyone know of any online > sites or AOL/Yahoo! chats that focus on Velgarth? I would prefer live action > role playing, but if online is all I can get, then I'll take that. And if > anyone can explain how to play, I would really appreciate it. Thanx a bunch... This is not meant as a flame AT ALL. Just as a reminder that Misty does not allow RPing in her worlds. Misty's very emphatic about this and her lawyers are very protective of their client's copyrights. The NewbieFest has a bit more about both the fanfic issue and the RPing. http://www.ling.udel.edu/hyde/pers/misty/newbiefest.html And yes, I admit I am one of the people who would've loved to RP in Misty's world, but for now at least it's a definite nono. Cheers, Ele High Priestess of Karma Councilor of Mist ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2000 13:51:12 -0500 From: "John Anthony Kazos Jr." To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Role Playing Games... Message-ID: <000d01bf808a$738d3760$803a52c6-+AT+-campus.vt.edu> Unfortunately, Misty has decided that she doesn't want any misinterpretations (at least, that's my guess) of her worlds, so she's made it completely illegal to do any sort of Fan Fiction or RPGs at all. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, February 26, 2000 12:13 PM Subject: Role Playing Games... > I would really like to get involved in a RPG. I have never played before, and > I have no clue how to play, but I want to. Does anyone know of any online > sites or AOL/Yahoo! chats that focus on Velgarth? I would prefer live action > role playing, but if online is all I can get, then I'll take that. And if > anyone can explain how to play, I would really appreciate it. Thanx a bunch... > > Jao ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2000 16:04:44 -0500 (EST) From: Erin Lewy To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Looking to get back into ML (long) Message-ID: Okay... well... it's been a long time... but, as an English major, being trained my whole life to look only at the literary merit of things, sometimes I just NEED some FANTASY dammit... ;) I even wrote an essay about this for class and got good discussion going. I said that I respected Misty the most out of anyone I'd read. fantasy wise. (pretty weird to say in the middle of college English class). Why, I don't know. She sticks to her guns (copyright stuff), she tackles "taboos" (gay characters), and SHE IS NOT TRYING TO BRAINWASH ME WITH "literature." ;) Well, anyway, as I said, sometimes I just need some fantasy, and I really haven't had time or money for it. I don't know what makes me think that I will just by sending this mail (hee), but... well this is why I am asking. I want to know you guys' recommendations to get back into her writing. :) What I have read (some I forgot in my intro post) WoC (whole thing) Black Gryphon (I own White but I did not like it and stopped...) LHM (whole thing) AoQ (whole thing) The first of the Mage Wars trilogy (I stopped. Ew. I didn't like it, either.) Sword of Ice. (YUM. Need more of THAT stuff). Oh and BTW I hope that my very small comment yesterday about it didn't count as a spoiler! I claim newbie ignorance. I have now read the Newbie Fest.) CotN (Diana T. novel) Sacred Ground (THAT WAS GOOD!) Jinx High (Another Diana T. Um. I just couldn't get into it.) I am wondering if I should go with starting the V. books again (I don't know the spelling of the new world name;) or... what about her books with Larry Dixon... or...I don't know. I enough gift certificate money to buy a few PAPERBACKS at Amazon.com (I don't like them but gift certificate money is what it is). Need...suggestions. :) My problem is this: I am hopelessly stuck on the older characters and am very bitter they're dead/gone (V. chars that is). I have probably reread LHM ten times. I am pissed that Talia gets about 3 lines per book now. Rawr. So... call me an embittered oldbie or something but the newer characters just didn't do it. (I loved the Hawkbrothers, but Elspeth...*yawn*) This is not a flame for anyone who LIKES Karal/Elspeth/whatever. I actually read WoC first (I THINK) even tho I forgot to mention it yesterday so I saw Elspeth first and it DID inspire me to read more, but she wasn't much special to me. This is why I have problems with the later books. *sigh* So maybe it is hopeless but I hope not. :) Erin (Wow. That is a LOT of writing. For what it's worth, I am called "Rambler" on my other lists... ;) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2000 16:28:37 EST From: HeraldMageJao-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Error Condition Re: Re: MIST: Re: Role Playing Games... Message-ID: oh dayam! according to the rules, i can't even use my screen name on the list! oh well, so much for fantasy...i meant no harm, and i definetly don't want this to be a problem for other list members, or the person who runs the list, so I will unsubscribe this e-mail address from this list. bye y'all ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2000 19:38:46 -0500 (EST) From: moonshadow-+AT+-startrekmail.com To: Misty List Subject: Bad Judgment call/annoying things the characters did Message-ID: <00022619384618.29046-+AT+-weba8.iname.net> Heyla, all! I was just curious...did any of the characters ever do anything that just REALLY annoyed you, or you thought was a bad judgment call? My number one pet peeve would be the fact that Talia didn't tell Kris that she was losing control over her Gift. I thought that was a SERIOUS mistake on her part. A rouge Gift is dangerous--everyone knows that-- and especially a powerful, volatile Gift like hers. It also surprises me that Rolan would keep her secret as well. I can understand not wanting it to become public knowledge, because of how it would shake the Kingdom, but I could never really figure out WHY she didn't tell Kris as soon as she knew. Anyway, I thought it was an extreme error in judgment on her part. WTTW, Herald Jacquelle ------------------------------- Beam to http://www.StarTrek.com Now featuring the Star Trek Store and the official site for Star Trek: Insurrection. ------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2000 20:29:14 -0500 (EST) From: Erin Lewy To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: A review-sparked rant Message-ID: Wow. I didn't actually think I'd have a lot to post on this list since I haven't read any Lackey in a good long time. Well..I went to amazon.com to look at some stuff there by her and, since I really wasn't impressed by SW the first time, I wanted to read some reviews before I picked up the trilogy again. Argh, they really didn't help. :( In fact, I am rather insensed right now by one stupid comment. I quote: "And there's not enough on one person's life. Half on Karal, quarter on the Empire, and the rest on Elspeth, An'desha and FireSong [sic]. Didn't quite like the fact that FireSong and An'desha were homos,man." ARGH. You know, maybe I am a spoiled brat because I have surrounded myself with accepting people. WHAT is the deal? Why do you have to put homophobia in a BOOK REVIEW? Okay, it was sorta an off-hand comment, but.... it really bothers me. (I think of "homos" as derrogatory. He could have said, "I didn't like that Firesong and An'desha were a gay couple," no, he had to involve a derrogatory word and act unintelligent. I admit it could have been a lot worse, like, "Oh my god, there were fags in this book!" but it still stung.) I have always admired Lackey for her integration of homosexual characters in her work as *normal people.* She does not sit there and wag a finger at you and say, "Look, here are these HOMOS, aren't they really *cool*? They are just people. That is why, though she is mass market fantasy, her writing is very mature--it tackles taboos and brings up issues that she is obviously passionate about and that don't necessarily HAVE to be there, yet are integrated well. There's no explicit sex (Okay, so 'Lendel hinted to Savil in one scene in LHM. Okay, so Vanyel slept in Tylendel's room and there was one sentence pretaining to naughty goings-on (sorry, guys, my books are at home or I'd type it out). I don't know or remember what was said about Firesong and An'desha (I honestly barely remember An'desha at all), but I doubt it was anything explicit. Why can't a person just say, "I didn't like this book," without making it an issue of morality? Why do people have to press their morality on other people? *sigh* Okay, I need to calm down. It's just I really could have done without the little declaration of this disapproval and all the risidual stuff that goes along with it. Erin (who knows many "homos," and likes it that way.) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2000 21:05:41 -0500 (EST) From: Erin Lewy To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Bad Judgment call/annoying things the characters did Message-ID: > Anyway, I thought it was an extreme error in judgment > on her part. At one time or another I've probably been annoyed with all of them. I wanted to break 'Lendel's head open and feed his brains to rodents--but I still loved him. I think that's why all of her characters are (usually) compelling. They are not perfect. They are quite human. I really can't remember a whole lot about the rogue Gift issue, but I do agree that the issue of Companions and their reactions to their Heralds baffles me at times. Is it that they are complex (just as humans) or that Lackey is being inconsistant, I'm not sure, but at different times they seem to react completely differently to similar circumstances... (again I have no books... I'm sorry.) I think they're just really individuals and it depends on the Companion what they'd do if they didn't approve of a Herald's actions. Some might tell other Companions in confidence, some might cut off mental communication with their Herald as a sign of disapproval, some might go along with the Herald because, of course, they see into their Herald's mind and can't help but sympethize. I'm not saying any particular way is always the way to go, but Companions are as complex as humans even if they are supposed to be the best of the best (as are Heralds). I'm really excessively PO'ed at Kris for dying, though. Does that count as an answer to your question? ;) Erin ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2000 20:25:39 -0600 From: "Phoenix, Guardian of Harmony" To: Subject: Off-Topic: Kiersey Message-ID: <001801bf80c9$f0c09d00$070ba33f-+AT+-tzarius> I had to take that for a class, I'm an ENFP. It fits me. Sorry for the one-liner Fireheart k'Vala God of New Homes ----- Original Message ----- From: Val To: Sent: Saturday, February 26, 2000 8:19 AM Subject: [ML] OT: Re: A newbie arrives (uhoh. :) > [MD] > >Please enlighten me -- what is INFJ? > > It's Introvert, Intuitive, Feeling, and Judgemental respectively. > > Just on a side note, I'm INTP. T = Thinking. P = Perception > > In case anyone's interested, you can take an online test that'll tell you > yours. It's at the following addy. > > http://www.keirsey.com/ > > > Have a nice time! > Val > > > § « § « § « § « § « § « § « § « § « § « § « § > > Age is a very high price to pay for maturity. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2000 22:19:54 EST From: Emzodie-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: A review-sparked rant Message-ID: <42.22458db.25e9f1da-+AT+-aol.com> i am with you 100% i like the fact that she has all differant kinds of people in her books. that is the way i live my life full of people who are differant and that is the way i like it also. chelby << Why can't a person just say, "I didn't like this book," without making it an issue of morality? Why do people have to press their morality on other people? *sigh* Okay, I need to calm down. It's just I really could have done without the little declaration of this disapproval and all the risidual stuff that goes along with it. Erin (who knows many "homos," and likes it that way.) >> ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2000 23:23:57 EST From: Kerowyn73-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Bad Judgment call/annoying things the characters did Message-ID: <86.10fdb0b.25ea00dd-+AT+-aol.com> I think the reason she didn't tell anyone was because she could sense the doubts and things that Kris' uncle had gotten him to start thinking about. She _couldn't_ tell him... remember, she was a strong Empath. His doubts and such were like physical blows to her. Would _you_ want to confess you were losing control to someone beating up on you? (Yes, I know he wasn't meaning to but still to her it seemed like it...) Anyway, my marks worth! Sionen In a message dated 02/26/2000 7:49:13 PM US Eastern Standard Time, moonshadow-+AT+-startrekmail.com writes: << My number one pet peeve would be the fact that Talia didn't tell Kris that she was losing control over her Gift. I thought that was a SERIOUS mistake on her part. A rouge Gift is dangerous--everyone knows that-- and especially a powerful, volatile Gift like hers. It also surprises me that Rolan would keep her secret as well. I can understand not wanting it to become public knowledge, because of how it would shake the Kingdom, but I could never really figure out WHY she didn't tell Kris as soon as she knew. >> ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 06:33:09 EST From: PsionicElf-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: A review-sparked rant Message-ID: <4c.22a465d.25ea6575-+AT+-aol.com> Heyla everyone! I can't believe someone could come out with something so moronic. Actually, wait I do beliece it! As a someone who is shay'a'chern, I am really happy to see that fellow list members are not identified to us as shaych are not happy with this. I've always liked Misty because how well she portrays different people. She is not focussed on some big macho man running around saving helpless women! (As if women are sooo helpless!) She shows women of strength, people of different cultures getting along, and yes, positive shaych characters. How can anyone read her books and not be cool with that! Wind to thy wings, Jao Rap'cher ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 7:20:19 -0600 From: "Lindsay" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: A review-sparked rant Message-ID: <186920002027132019140-+AT+-xfilesfan.com> A general comment about 'A review-sparked rant': Since I am young, only 13 years old, and many of Ms. Lackey's readers are in their teen years, I think that it helps a lot. Before I read her books perhaps I would've looked down to homosexuals but reading them I think helped. They're people with different tastes, and that's all there is to it. For some reason I suppose younger readers have an easier time grasping such, as opposed to older ones who perhaps had bad influences that encouraged them to be homophobic or prejudiced. Not a preaching, just a comment. Sincerely, Herald-Trainee Milena Blair of Valdemar Leilazel Samarah of Tortall Milena Blair of Tortall Lindsay Fundakowski F. of Maryland "I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it!" http://elfwood.lysator.liu.se/lothlorien/artists/lfeldman/lfeldman.html http://www.geocities.com/veralidainev/index.html _____________________________________________ Free email with personality! Over 200 domains! http://www.MyOwnEmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 08:40:54 -0500 (EST) From: Erin Lewy To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: A review-sparked rant Message-ID: On Sun, 27 Feb 2000, Lindsay wrote: > A general comment about 'A review-sparked rant': > > Since I am young, only 13 years old, and many of Ms. Lackey's readers are > in their teen years, I think that it helps a lot. Before I read her books > perhaps I would've looked down to homosexuals but reading them I think > helped. They're people with different tastes, and that's all there is to > it. For some reason I suppose younger readers have an easier time grasping > such, as opposed to older ones who perhaps had bad influences that Exactly. That is EXACTLY how I feel about it. I began reading Misty at a really young age and her books were my first encounter with homosexuality (knowingly, anyway. My uncle was gay but I was never told a word about that). I think I pondered it for about five seconds, "Oh, Vanyel and Tylendel are in love? Hmm. Okay." I honestly give Misty credit for helping me grasp that concept so easily, while the rest of my family remained relatively biggoted. This is why she is still one of my favorite authors. :) Erin ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 09:57:12 EST From: Leeranii-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: A review-sparked rant Message-ID: <3b.18c086e.25ea9548-+AT+-aol.com> Hi, all...lurker here delurking after an eternity of sitting the shadows. I had no idea cobwebs were so hard to get off... Misty was also my first real experience with homosexuality. (I'd read Anne MaCCaffrey before and most of her books only hinted at it) I started reading Misty at a time in my life when I needed to know that heroes and loyal friends could still be found. (Side note here: I know they are characters but they gave me courage to step outside my door everyday) Anyway...before I read her books I was slightly homophobic...too busy drinking and partying and being chased by guys (I'm female) to really look beyond your classic stereotypes of severely butch women and men in leopard print dresses. I have always prided myself on the fact that I had an open mind. After I read Misty, and met Vanyel, Firesong, 'Lyndel and the rest, I realized it wasn't as open as I would like it to be. Anyway, my dad told me that one of his friends was gay. A man who rides horses, drives a Jeep (a beat up, no-door one at that), has a beard, and does not in the least bit act like the classic stereotype. So, I thought about my views on them. I certainly did not want to offend a friend of my father. That's when it dawned me, that the stereotypes are the exception and not the rule. I discovered (and whacked myself on the head for not seeing the obvious) that gay and lesbian people are exactly the same as heterosexuals..we all bleed the same, we all cry the same, and we all love the same and we are all the same human beings. Anyway, seeing as how I just woke up, this probably makes no sense whatsoever. I just had to get this off my chest. I certainly hope I have not offended anyone. Cheers, Stormlight Pusher Of All Things Paper In a message dated 2/27/2000 9:10:27 AM Eastern Standard Time, elewy-+AT+-mail.slc.edu writes: << Exactly. That is EXACTLY how I feel about it. I began reading Misty at a really young age and her books were my first encounter with homosexuality (knowingly, anyway. My uncle was gay but I was never told a word about that). I think I pondered it for about five seconds, "Oh, Vanyel and Tylendel are in love? Hmm. Okay." I honestly give Misty credit for helping me grasp that concept so easily, while the rest of my family remained relatively biggoted. This is why she is still one of my favorite authors. :) Erin >> ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 10:00:12 EST From: MDennis460-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: A review-sparked rant Message-ID: I would like to say this-- I have all ready read a number of these responses to the review sparked rant, and understand everyone's point of view. Fine. This is becoming repetitive. The original poster of this thread of discussion is entitled to his/her view as is the reviewer, let's let them both have their say and then move on. i also like misty for her willingness to use characters from all persuasions and races, and to treat subjects that not always treated in fantasy. i also understand that everyone is going to react to what she writes differently according to their own personal views. i respect their right to express their thoughts, but not necessarily agree with them. sometimes the best response to some peoples views is simply silence no response at all. But that may be misinterpreted as well, in some circles silence means assent. So I am speaking up and asking that now that people have expressed their opinions, can we please move on to another topic? Proposed topic -- why would Companions come in the shape of horses, why not as an another animal? Can anyone suggest another useful shape (Besides a firecat) for a companion? This should allow us some interesting and entertaining speculation. ------------------------------ End of MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 2225 **********************************