MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 2383 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Fanfic and copywrite issues. by GryphRaptor 2) Re: thanks, Tayledras, magic by GryphRaptor 3) Fan-art by Brentie 4) Enough With The FanFic!!! by "Li'nia Stormdancer" 5) Re: Enough With The FanFic!!! by Kerowyn73-+AT+-aol.com 6) Geyr - the "G" man in Kero's Company by Kerowyn73-+AT+-aol.com 7) Re: Enough With The FanFic!!! by Brentie 8) Gifts by Brentie 9) Children, Pets and assorted odds and ends... *G* by Kerowyn73-+AT+-aol.com 10) Re: thanks, Tayledras, magic by Natetoact-+AT+-aol.com 11) another fan-fic question (i have a curious mind) a comment about Piers Anthony, and *drumroll* something actually possibly worth discussing (I hope) by "L. J. Thompson" 12) more nitpicking, myths by Abby Normal 13) Re: Children, Pets and assorted odds and ends... *G* by "Dan Halford" 14) Re: Children, Pets and assorted odds and ends... *G* by Robert Martin 15) Re: Children, Pets and assorted odds and ends... *G* by MDennis460-+AT+-aol.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2000 13:33:09 -0700 (PDT) From: GryphRaptor To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Fanfic and copywrite issues. Message-ID: <20000815203309.2151.qmail-+AT+-web3901.mail.yahoo.com> Originally i wasn't going to add to this thread, but i thought i'd add in my 2 cents (or equivelent coin of the realm). Please note, i'm not entirely sure of all the details here, but i'm pretty sure i read the reason behind Mercedes Lackey's restrictions on using her characters and creations...what follows is waht i remember of it... if i'm wrong, please correct me here... I'm pretty sure this was from one of ML's offical pages...since it told about the problem she had with the diane tregarde books...and some of what happened...unfortunatly i can't double check as i've lost the bookmark to the page where i think i got this info... but one reason i believe ML has decided what she has on fanfics and so on is something that happened to Marrion Zimmer Bradley (it may have been another author, and sorry if my spelling's off...i've been up for quite awhile...)) apparently someone sent MZB a manuscript, or short story, which she read, later on in one of her books, a similar situation to the story that was sent her showed up. She was then taken to court for stealing the other person's idea, even though she didn't consciously realize it...Thus Mercedes Lackey decided to make sure it would never happen to her, by completely restricting anyone using her works... Now this may be totally off from the real story, i'm not sure as it's been awhile since i read the reasoning... GryphRaptor __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2000 13:50:50 -0700 (PDT) From: GryphRaptor To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: thanks, Tayledras, magic Message-ID: <20000815205050.21451.qmail-+AT+-web3905.mail.yahoo.com> when did we hear that? far as i knew Tarma and Warral were still around? in regards to Van's abilities...i seem to remember the reason he was so powerfull was because the full energy of a gate was blasted through every single magic channel in his mind?body?whatever...opening all the abilities to their fullest... i also seem to remember it being explained that most of those with abilities only had one or two channels open, if they had more channels each was more restricted. But that's not saying that someone with three partially open ability channels isn't as powerfull as someone with only a single channel fully open... it's all a mater of how the abilities are used... now a question, besides, Mage, Healing, Bardic, Empathy, Mind-Speak, Fire-Starting, Fore-sight, Far-Sight and Fetching what other gifts have shown up in ML's books? i know there're probably a few i've forgotten... The above question relates to the channels i mentioned earlier...would each gift be a seperate channel in a person, or would some gifts be lumped in the same channel..assuming i'm remember correctly i mean... GryphRaptor --- Eeyore9051-+AT+-aol.com wrote: > Misty mentions the aging think with Kethy and Tarma > too. Somewhere in their > stories Kethy mentions how dealing with nodes makes > her age slower. Which > may explain why we've heard about Tarma and Warral's > deaths but not > Kethy's...she may have out lived them both though > that may be kinda lonly. > > Amanda __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2000 17:56:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Brentie To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Fan-art Message-ID: <20000816005601.27753.qmail-+AT+-web4103.mail.yahoo.com> ya i know not possed it on the list i meant is fan-art ok in general like on a diffrent webstie __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2000 18:48:03 -0700 (PDT) From: "Li'nia Stormdancer" To: List Subject: Enough With The FanFic!!! Message-ID: <20000816014803.25007.qmail-+AT+-web1206.mail.yahoo.com> Heyla List-Sibs!! Well, we've heard every possible viewpoint on what is thought about copyrights, Misty's rights, and our rights. We know what we can and can't do on the List, and if there was anyone out there with a question in their heads about what is and isn't allowed on the List, I think we've pretty much clarified it for them! I think we've pretty much dried that subject up. Anyone who still has questions should talk about it off-list. Remember: When in doubt, consult a Councilor or the List-Mistress! (Although I advise against bothering Auntie Mel too much! lol) Could we please move on? Ob-Misty: Could someone please help me with a question here, since I don't have BTS with me? There was a dark-skinned man that was a member of Kerowyn's Company; I'm sorry, but I can't remember his name, though think it started with a "G". I've been trying to remember his name what country he's from; all I remember is that it was somewhere way south. Does anyone remember? Thanks! ===== ---<---<---<----+AT+- Li'nia Stormdancer -+AT+---->--->--->--- Peon to the Powers That Be, (Hopeful)Goddess of All Things Possessed, & Caretaker of the Arena of Discussion and Dissention __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2000 22:36:35 EDT From: Kerowyn73-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Enough With The FanFic!!! Message-ID: The name you are looking for is Geyr. (text ref BTS pg 352 Sci Fi Book Club Edition) As far as the country... "...and Geyr, a native of some land so far to the south that Kero had never ene heard of it before he told her his story, a true _black_ man from his hair to his feet." (same text reference works *G*) He's the one that had the greyhound type dogs as well as the mastif ones later. Zhai'helleva! Sionen In a message dated 08/15/2000 9:04:34 PM US Eastern Standard Time, lady_stormdancer-+AT+-yahoo.com writes: << Ob-Misty: Could someone please help me with a question here, since I don't have BTS with me? There was a dark-skinned man that was a member of Kerowyn's Company; I'm sorry, but I can't remember his name, though think it started with a "G". I've been trying to remember his name what country he's from; all I remember is that it was somewhere way south. Does anyone remember? Thanks! ===== ---<---<---<----+AT+- Li'nia Stormdancer -+AT+---->--->--->--- >> ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2000 23:14:07 EDT From: Kerowyn73-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Geyr - the "G" man in Kero's Company Message-ID: <50.99b51c6.26cb60ff-+AT+-aol.com> Just wanted to apologize for sending this to the list with the old Subj line and not changing it to the new one. ~humbly offers sheep shaped glasses filled to the brim with ice cold coke!! ~yum~ Sionen In a message dated 08/15/2000 10:02:33 PM US Eastern Standard Time, Kerowyn73-+AT+-aol.com writes: << The name you are looking for is Geyr. (text ref BTS pg 352 Sci Fi Book Club Edition) As far as the country... "...and Geyr, a native of some land so far to the south that Kero had never ene heard of it before he told her his story, a true _black_ man from his hair to his feet." (same text reference works *G*) He's the one that had the greyhound type dogs as well as the mastif ones later. Zhai'helleva! Sionen In a message dated 08/15/2000 9:04:34 PM US Eastern Standard Time, lady_stormdancer-+AT+-yahoo.com writes: << Ob-Misty: Could someone please help me with a question here, since I don't have BTS with me? There was a dark-skinned man that was a member of Kerowyn's Company; I'm sorry, but I can't remember his name, though think it started with a "G". I've been trying to remember his name what country he's from; all I remember is that it was somewhere way south. Does anyone remember? Thanks! >> ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2000 22:05:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Brentie To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Enough With The FanFic!!! Message-ID: <20000816050505.1263.qmail-+AT+-web4102.mail.yahoo.com> i think with this list things kinda hafta work themselves out and gradually work int another topic so if you want to stop this talk your probally jst gonna hafta ad a new topic __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2000 22:14:16 -0700 (PDT) From: Brentie To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Gifts Message-ID: <20000816051416.29960.qmail-+AT+-web4106.mail.yahoo.com> http://DRAGONLORDS.dragonfire.net/danmag1.htm this site will tell you all gifts and some other cool stuf as well like spells used by mages and just plain ole wacky stuff __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2000 01:55:29 EDT From: Kerowyn73-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Children, Pets and assorted odds and ends... *G* Message-ID: <27.9b486bf.26cb86d1-+AT+-aol.com> New topic? Well... AHHCHOOO!!!! ~a _very_ dust covered figure stands up, shaking to rid herself of the accumulated filth. She grins, green eyes flashing with delight at the number of members seated about the room on various cushions, couches and blankets. Chewing her lip for a moment, the woman decides to wait for just a _few_ minutes before she joins those soaking in the hot pools just out of sight.. but not hearing!~ Heyla, listsibs... Been a while since I posted... well I guess I _did_ earlier today, but the first time in a while that I posed a question and not just answered one. *g* (And heck of a long time before today regardless!) Now... I'm certain that there are those of us out there that have named a pet (cat, dog, horse, bird, etc) after a persona in one of ML's books. I personally have a cat named after one. (Her sister would have been named after one as well if an adorably cute kid hadn't wanted to name her...) Has anyone named a child after a character? I heard once about a girl with the name Talia... that was her given name. I was _told_ (and you know how that can be) that she was given some grief by ML lawyers for using her name as her persona's name in the club she was in. No clue on the truth of the comment. *g* Oh, and a quick question/request... Does anyone have the email addy for sending a question to Misty (ie her assistants *G*)? I know we have one of her assistants (I'm sure there are more than one *G*) on this list, but I'm not sure if he'll catch this. so... anyone got it? Trust me.. this isn't a FAQ or anything of the sort, I'm sure. It's a bit unusual, I'd think...then again I don't get Misty's questions so who knows! Anyway... Zhai'helleva! Kero ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2000 02:14:59 EDT From: Natetoact-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: thanks, Tayledras, magic Message-ID: <68.6780d72.26cb8b63-+AT+-aol.com> Well, Kyril has Far-speaking, but I've never gotten what the distinction between that and mind speaking was.... any enlightenment? Thanx! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2000 01:02:20 -0700 From: "L. J. Thompson" To: Subject: another fan-fic question (i have a curious mind) a comment about Piers Anthony, and *drumroll* something actually possibly worth discussing (I hope) Message-ID: <000001c00758$4dd69980$39d2fea9-+AT+-basil> First off, I want to pre-apologize for most of this message. I know many of you are sick and tired of hearing about fan-fic, but anything having to do with law and communications intrigues me to no end, and so I just keep coming up with questions to ask... --- begin section about copyright stuff --- Everyone keeps saying "as soon as you write it..." what about oral presentations? I know that this is irrelevant to the list, but I'm curious. I assume similar rules apply about spoken things, but it caught my eye. Someone mentioned Piers Anthony. I don't know his opinion on fan-fic, but he's always been pretty pro-roleplaying. Currently, he has a list of links to various Xanth online fan-created games on his website. http://www.hipiers.com , in the newsletter section ) He seems to be more laid-back about the whole thing. Of course, it seems that all of his past negative publishing-related issues have been with publishing companies, not fans, and that would tend to color his perceptions differently. To each their own. Personally, what I tend to like about the books is the way the story unfolds and makes me think, rather than the specific setting or characters, so the whole fan-fic thing hasn't really affected me much. However, I wish the RP stuff were different....bah. Understanding the reasoning behind the rules and liking the way reality works are two different things. I've always thought that Valdemar was a particularly good example of a setting where magic and psionics (mind-magic) were blended together nicely.......but it's Misty's choice what to do with that world, and I'm just glad she's chosen to share her visions of it with the rest of us. (And I dream that something'll work itself out with a RPG company someday... it could happen. I wonder if they've ever talked to the GURPS people, they do a lot of official licensed-world stuff... anyway.) --- end section about copyright stuff --- on a completely different topic, I have sort of a weird question. It makes perfect sense in my head, but I'm not sure I'll phrase it right. Anyway. Heralds and companions are, obviously, well-matched to each other. Of all of the heralds and companions in the book, which would have been the worst match you could think of, if they were thrown together? (that is, a different companion had ended up with that herald). I just thought it'd be an interesting topic, and not one I remember being brought up before. I haven't anything to add to it at the moment, but if others do I'd have fun reading it. May squirrels never take a liking to your teeth, L.J. Thompson ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2000 01:06:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Abby Normal To: MLML Subject: more nitpicking, myths Message-ID: <20000816080648.14622.qmail-+AT+-web4705.mail.yahoo.com> Heyla Listsibs, Continuity Director checking in again. This is in response to Dan's post; the quotes are from him. >Looking their age, or looking old? There's a >difference. By "looking their age," I meant looking old. The difference in terminology is in this case irrelevant, as it is clearly stated that Tayledras mages (or at least Adepts) do not age nor change in appearance until their death. >I think you'll find that the comment was something >like WORKING with node magic bleached hair within two >years. Just living with it took longer. As a matter of fact, the quote I used is: "They lived amid a constant flow of node-derived magic, magic that touched even the non-Gifted, whether born or raised among them, bleaching their hair and eyes to silver and blue in a matter of two years." (MPrice, 178-179 pb) >The Palace heartstone is described in the book in >which it's created as being small. It also was in a >very heavily shielded room, so shielded that >Firesong could not detect it through magic alone... >they had to measure the palace to find the "lost" >space it was in. I will concede this point. >No - but it was clear from reading other books that >use of nodes was a trait peculiar to the Tayledras or >those hwo had been Tayledra-trained. Kethry is never >mentioned as using it, although she was an Adept, and >in the Storm trilogy, the empire Adept mages don't >seem to use it. Different training, different ways of >cracking the egg. Sounds perfectly reasonable to me. Actually, this is untrue. The mages of the empire clearly use magic in this way, as the explanation of magic that I used in my post was given by Sejanes, an empire mage. It seems clear from that passage that this is an accurate description of magic in Velgarth; as for your mention of scientific achievements on Earth, we have come up with different ways of harnessing energies, but the nature of the energies themselves do not change. There are many ways of collecting and using solar power, but nothing we do affects the properties of light itself. If, in Velgarth, "magic" is an energy that is given off by living things, collects and flows in ley-lines, and intersects at nodes, then those are its natural properties. It is never said ~how~ Vanyel and the Tayledras access the nodes, simply that they do. If other forms of accessing magic do not involve nodes or reservoirs, then the power they can use is thusly limited, by the laws governing that world. >One thousand years ago, the inhabitants of western >Europe were often found living in mud-huts... and a >thousand years before that, many of the world's >civilised people inhabited stone- or brick-built >houses with modern-ish conveniences like central >heating, hot and cold running water, and advanced >sewerage facilities. Times change. No reason why the >Tayledras couldn't. These changes were not improvements, merely differences. Many peoples incorporate modern "conveniences" into their culture while retaining their customs and basic way of life. If the Tayledras wish to change their customs and culture, they may, though it is not inevitable. >I cannot even THINK about the complexities of >inventing a whole universe, numerous cultures, >physical and "magical" therories and a raft of >religions. What Misty has done is admirable. >Considering that people still have problems using >their own mother-tongue in the real world, let alone >grapsing things like quantum mechanics, I think that >these SMALL discrepencies are worth enduring, don't >you? >I agree - read the book for its story, not to see if >Misty's description of the hair-bleaching aspect of >node-magic exactly matches the time-scale expressed in >another book. Do you think I'd have thought about this so much, and gone to all the trouble of writing such a long and involved piece on it, if I didn't like the books? I enjoy them very much, but this issue still bothers me. It is in fact possible to write a series without these discrepancies, as I can name several authors who do. With that, I have obviously decided that the inconsistencies do not detract enough from the story for me not to like it. However, I still have the right to be annoyed. And I must agree with those who have criticized your comment on Nicole's poem. On the list there are many differences of opinions, and no-one is asked approve of everything others say, but we do expect common courtesy. It is a small thing, and it keeps the list someplace we like to be. To David H. Tiffany, god of typos: The Companion idea for mages is an interesting one, but wouldn't the mages know they had more power than they could explain? If you're using the power of a small node when you can only access ley-lines, wouldn't you think something was amiss? It's interesting to consider, though. I forget who compared retelling legends to fan-fic, but I disagree. Myths and faery stories, such as the Arthurian legends, belong not to a single person but to a culture. There is no set telling of a legend They belong to all of us, they're our heritage, and so each can interpret them for him- or herself. Works that authors have created on their own, however, from their own mind, do belong to that person, not the general public. I actually started reading fantasy because of my love of myths; the first fantasy books I found were Lloyd Alexander's "Chronicles of Prydain," based on the Welsh myths. That was when I was eight; I still love retellings of old stories, as well as imaginary worlds. Ambermoon Singer of Fire Royal Defender of the Brat __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2000 12:04:56 +0100 From: "Dan Halford" To: Subject: Re: Children, Pets and assorted odds and ends... *G* Message-ID: <001701c00771$d229fd80$6102a8c0-+AT+-dch> Talia is actually a traditional hebrew / Jewish girls name. Elspeth is a very old English name ... I believe, actually, that there was a Princess Elspeth in about 1180. Vanyel, as far as I know, is original. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 7:29 AM Subject: Children, Pets and assorted odds and ends... *G* > New topic? Well... > > AHHCHOOO!!!! ~a _very_ dust covered figure stands up, shaking to rid herself > of the accumulated filth. She grins, green eyes flashing with delight at the > number of members seated about the room on various cushions, couches and > blankets. Chewing her lip for a moment, the woman decides to wait for just a > _few_ minutes before she joins those soaking in the hot pools just out of > sight.. but not hearing!~ > > Heyla, listsibs... Been a while since I posted... well I guess I _did_ > earlier today, but the first time in a while that I posed a question and not > just answered one. *g* (And heck of a long time before today regardless!) > > Now... I'm certain that there are those of us out there that have named a pet > (cat, dog, horse, bird, etc) after a persona in one of ML's books. I > personally have a cat named after one. (Her sister would have been named > after one as well if an adorably cute kid hadn't wanted to name her...) Has > anyone named a child after a character? > > I heard once about a girl with the name Talia... that was her given name. I > was _told_ (and you know how that can be) that she was given some grief by ML > lawyers for using her name as her persona's name in the club she was in. No > clue on the truth of the comment. *g* > > Oh, and a quick question/request... Does anyone have the email addy for > sending a question to Misty (ie her assistants *G*)? I know we have one of > her assistants (I'm sure there are more than one *G*) on this list, but I'm > not sure if he'll catch this. so... anyone got it? Trust me.. this isn't a > FAQ or anything of the sort, I'm sure. It's a bit unusual, I'd think...then > again I don't get Misty's questions so who knows! > > Anyway... Zhai'helleva! > Kero > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2000 08:50:00 -0400 From: Robert Martin To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Children, Pets and assorted odds and ends... *G* Message-ID: On Wed, 16 Aug 2000 12:25:43 +0100 (BST), "Dan Halford" stomped through my brain with: >Talia is actually a traditional hebrew / Jewish girls name. Elspeth is a >very old English name ... I believe, actually, that there was a Princess >Elspeth in about 1180. Vanyel, as far as I know, is original. Actually, Talia was one of the choices for my daughter's name when she was born. Tristaan Ogre-Monk, ICQ# 14668166 Assistant Librarian/Orangutan, Pedant Target, Chief Brute Husband of Amethyst, Co-Owner of The Ogre and the Elf Violinist for the ABML out-of-practice-musicians band Keyboard Martyr, Keeper of the ABML Cookbook ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2000 09:47:15 EDT From: MDennis460-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Children, Pets and assorted odds and ends... *G* Message-ID: <4e.9d6b39c.26cbf563-+AT+-aol.com> there is a "ask misty" page on the firebird website where you can ask questions of misty and she will answer them. also there was a secretary on one of the ml lists (don't remember which, sorry) that would also gather and get questions answered from misty. but i haven't' seen that person on the list lately. or you could write to high flight and see if you can get a snail mail answer. ------------------------------ End of MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 2383 **********************************