MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 250 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Heralds and Healers, Companion fertility by Mat Timmerman 2) HH&H by Mat Timmerman 3) Re: Shavri as King's Own, gender pairings, and more... by Ashke 4) Re: Shavri as King's Own, gender pairings, and more... by Alison Schiff 5) Re: Heralds and Healers by CHONNI 6) companion stats by KEBAS-+AT+-vaxsar.vassar.edu 7) Re: Heralds and Healers by mealink-+AT+-syd.au.swissbank.com (Kerry Mealing) 8) Re: Heralds and Healers, Companion fertility by Jennifer Broekman 9) Re: settling an old dispute by Jennifer Broekman 10) Re: Heralds and Healers, Comp... by AliFarr-+AT+-aol.com 11) Re: Shavri as King's Own, gender pairings, and more... by Jennifer Broekman 12) Re: companion stats by Jennifer Broekman 13) Companions... a thought by "James T. Yardley" <73201.745-+AT+-compuserve.com> 14) Re: Companions... a thought by Jennifer Broekman 15) Re: Shavri as King's Own, gender pairings, and more... by Alison Schiff 16) Re: Companions... a thought by Alison Schiff 17) Re: Companions... a thought by Rosario Holsen-Baker 18) Re: Companions... a thought by Putty Tat 19) Re: Companions... a thought by Wendy Hill 20) Re: settling an old dispute by s003yms-+AT+-desire.wright.edu 21) order of writing by s003yms-+AT+-desire.wright.edu 22) Re: Companions... a thought by s003yms-+AT+-desire.wright.edu 23) Hi! by scp6-+AT+-po.cwru.edu (Stacy Pyett) 24) Shavri and Companions by "Katherine M. Brielmaier" 25) Re: Companions... a thought by mealink-+AT+-syd.au.swissbank.com (Kerry Mealing) 26) Re: companion stats by mealink-+AT+-syd.au.swissbank.com (Kerry Mealing) 27) Re: settling an old dispute by mealink-+AT+-syd.au.swissbank.com (Kerry Mealing) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:06:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Mat Timmerman To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Heralds and Healers, Companion fertility Message-ID: <01HY6KJ95AMA94FYWU-+AT+-vaxc.hofstra.edu> From: Sanna Koulu > >I was just leafing through old postings, and started thinking of >Shavri's bonding. WHY was it weaker than other H-C bonds? After all, >Shavri was an accomplished Mindspeaker. Is it because she was a >Healer? But why would that mean her bonding is weaker? After all, >Empathy is a Healing Gift, and Talia's bonding was strong. Is it >because Taver (?) knew Shavri would follow her lifebonded to death, >and therefore didn't bond as strongly... the same as unbonded >Choosings, only not so extreme... I have a thought on why Healers usually Heralds. In Talia's Orientation class (my, what a font of information it is -- it almost seems that any imaginable topic was covered there :) ) Teren mentions that there is some Gift that makes the Herald-Companion Bond possible. It's possible that most Healers just don't have this Gift. Shavri might not have had this Gift, or only had it very weakly. >So, I came up with a question: why don't the Companions choose >Healers or people with Gifts from the Healing family? It's been >stated that it's because Healers are needed too much to waste them as >Heralds... but think how useful a Herald-Healer would be! Heralds get >bashed all the time, sometimes seriously injured; a Herald-Healer >would understand those crazies much better, and so would be more >efficient in healing both body, and soul and mind. And a Herald- >Healer would have the Companion -> better mobility, stabler of mind, >and it would strengthen the Gifts. So why not? Healers might not need the Gift boosting power of the Companions. I think it was Ylsa who said something like, "For some reason that we don't know, the really strong Gifts tend to be associated with those who become Healers." (really paraphrased). This could happen so that Healers don't _need_ the Companions to have strong Gifts. Mat accmjt-+AT+-vaxc.hofstra.edu http://ada.hofstra.edu/~mtimme47/ VAX is the source of all evil. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:12:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Mat Timmerman To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: HH&H Message-ID: <01HY6L1ZRTTK94FYWU-+AT+-vaxc.hofstra.edu> I just got Heralds, Harpers, & Havok last night. I haven't been able to listen to it enough to really comment on it though. One thing that I have to say is that I agree with the rest of you: Misty should definitely stick to writing. Whenever "Her Father's Eyes", or "Musings" comes on, I shudder. :) Mat accmjt-+AT+-vaxc.hofstra.edu http://ada.hofstra.edu/~mtimme47/ VAX is the source of all evil. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:16:06 -0500 (EST) From: Ashke To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Shavri as King's Own, gender pairings, and more... Message-ID: > > I was just leafing through old postings, and started thinking of > > Shavri's bonding. WHY was it weaker than other H-C bonds? > > I always thought Shavri's Choosing was a weaker bond because of the > reasons she was Chosen to be Monarch's Own, i.e. she was a healer as > well as Randi's lifebonded. Talia, in contrast, was Chosen (I > assume, this could be waaay off) partially because she could tame > "the Brat," but also because she made a good confidant and advisor. > Shavri, with her penchant for hysterics towards the end of Randi's > reign (see the scene after Jisa gets married in Magic's Price) struck > me as quite un-King's Own-like. Granted, viewing the situation > dispassionately would have been difficult as it was her own daughter > involved. But as King's Own, she should have at least made an > attempt at neutrally viewing the situation as it impacted *Valdemar*, > not just Randale. That's basically why she was -- Vanyel says something at one point of having expected Taver (Shavri's Companion) to Choose him, but he was fearing Shavri was Chosen because she was a Healer. The MO is generally chosen because of some need in Valdemar. Talia was needed at that time, and Shavri was needed for her purpose in Vanyel's time. Although healers in their own way are supposed to be as unselfish as Heralds. :P > I may be treading dangerous waters here, but I didn't think Shavri > made a very good King's Own at all. She seemed to serve more > to keep Randi stable and functional, both emotionally and physically. > But she didn't seem to keep Valdemar's interests as her first > priority. Her focus was very narrow: keeping Randale functioning as > King as long as possible. Don't get me wrong: her Lifebonded was dying > and she had no idea why; it's very understandable that she was a > little preoccupied. However, it did seem as though Van was carrying > out more of the King's Own advising duties than Shavri was. He could Exactly. He was basically being MO, yet the way it was, they got the best of both worlds -- Vanyel, and a healer for Randale. > true. We see lots of male Herald/mare Companion (Skif and Cymery) and > female herald/stallion Companion pairings (Talia and Rolan, Keren and > [*blank on name*]) Dantris? -- Ashke ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Which guise shall I wear today, my dears? | The laughing mask or the one of tears? | Kh'rys -+AT+- DF Well, since my heart is blithe and gay | Namire -+AT+- HT This sober one I shall wear today. | Kalanthe -+AT+- VP -- Zula Hall | ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:17:28 -0500 (EST) From: Alison Schiff To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Shavri as King's Own, gender pairings, and more... Message-ID: Someone wrote: ... >> Another thought: is it all the GB who are super- fertile, or just the > > MOC? Well, either way, the MOC is the only GB around most of the > > time. Why is he super-fertile? After all, it doesn't make much > > difference on the Companion birth rates, so is it just a side effect?) > ... I'm thinking of the three *original* (grove born) companions. Aside from the very rare 'other' grove born companions like Gwena (and I think a few more came along in their time? could someone check?) they were the _only_ ones around. Wouln't they need to be sure that if a new herald was to be chosen, there would be a foal to choose him/her? Since they were so few, they would have to be sure that every attempt at breeding "took" (sorry, 'couldn't think of a better phrase). Thus the super-fertility. Alison schiff-+AT+-trenton.edu ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:45:15 -0800 (PST) From: CHONNI To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Heralds and Healers Message-ID: On Tue, 28 Nov 1995, Jerry Cullingford wrote: > Interesting - I *think* a friend of mine (in the UK tang soo do (sp?) team) > once said that a big skill difference can compensate for a size difference, > but that size will dominate given similar skill - but it was some considerable > time back, so I may have garbled it or got it backwards :-). I suspect a > trained fighter would tend to beat an untrained civilian most of the time, > regardless, but I'd hate to guess what would happen if both had at least the > basic training to avoid "sucker" moves; I guess power and endurance become > more significant when a quick conclusion is unlikely. Hmmm... when I was taking tai chi, my instructor, a six-foot tall man was telling us about his teacher, a very, very old man, around five-three. The teacher told my instructor to hit him, and when he tried, he found himself flying over the little old man's shoulder and slamming into the wall. Not to one to believe in luck, he tried it again a couple of times; each time he ended up flying into the wall! Now, if a tiny, 80ish year old man can beat the pulp out of a fit adult without even half trying, I suspect a well trained woman could do the same. Also, couldn't it be possible that the women in Misty's world be stronger than ours? It's just an idea, that other writers use; Elizabeth Moon's women seem to pretty much equal the men... *********************************************************************** * Why would I want my mind back? Who knows where it's been! * *---------------------------------------------------------------------* **************************** Chonni Brightwolf************************* ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:37:53 -0400 (EDT) From: KEBAS-+AT+-vaxsar.vassar.edu To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: companion stats Message-ID: <01HY6JSKGU7M005R8V-+AT+-vaxsar.vassar.edu> Hi, i'm new to this list, so I thought I'd intoduse myself then address one of the posts. My name's Keri, I'm a first-year student at Vassar College, and I'm hopelessly addicted to Misty! Several people have commented on a post saying that since the heralds were 2/3 males the companions were too. I don't remember the exact wording of the post, so if I misunderstood, sorry... but I read it as a reference to the reincarnation issue- if 2/3 of the heralds are male, then 2/3 of the available "souls" (or whatever) for new companions must be as well. Well, that's my 2 cents... Anybody agree/disagree? Keri :) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Nov 95 10:02:00 EST From: mealink-+AT+-syd.au.swissbank.com (Kerry Mealing) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Heralds and Healers Message-ID: <9511282302.AA23096-+AT+-syd.au.swissbank.com> 91 Jerry writes: > Mel writes: > > Whether men would have an advantage in physical fighting probably depends on > > how down&dirty it gets. Back when I was still doing karate, the second- > > highest grade within our club (second dan) was female, and quite slightly > > built. You tangled with her at your peril, however :) Hmm, I didn't see the original post.. > Interesting - I *think* a friend of mine (in the UK tang soo do (sp?) team) > once said that a big skill difference can compensate for a size difference, > but that size will dominate given similar skill - but it was some considerable > time back, so I may have garbled it or got it backwards :-). I suspect a > trained fighter would tend to beat an untrained civilian most of the time, > regardless, but I'd hate to guess what would happen if both had at least the > basic training to avoid "sucker" moves; I guess power and endurance become > more significant when a quick conclusion is unlikely. >From my own martial-arts background (taekwondo / hapkido), size is fairly important - the way I've heard it put is "A good large/strong person can usually take a smaller/weaker person of equivalent skill." (The large / strong dichotomy depends on what form of martial art you're talking about). I'd say it's pretty strongly held as an axiom in the m-arts world - most competitions are split by weight and sex categories. In terms of Misty's universe though, note that most combat is *not* unarmed combat and a sharp sword is still a sharp sword regardless of the size of the wielder. In this situation I can envisage that different fighting styles might favour different builds / sizes / strengths. (Witness Vanyel's style vs Jervis' style). Kerry. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:14:16 -0500 (EST) From: Jennifer Broekman To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Heralds and Healers, Companion fertility Message-ID: On Tue, 28 Nov 1995, Sanna Koulu wrote: > I was just leafing through old postings, and started thinking of > Shavri's bonding. WHY was it weaker than other H-C bonds? After all, > Shavri was an accomplished Mindspeaker. Is it because she was a Pardon my memory, but can someone give me a reference to Shavri being an accomplished MindSpeaker? I've always had the feeling that she was marginal at best and didn't really *want* to use what Gift she had. > Healing Gifts than men on Velgarth? It's said in AotQ that 2/3 of the > Heralds are male, and 2/3 of the Healers female (well, basically). So > (Among other things, this means that two thirds of the Companions are > male, too. And since the size of the female population is a much more Why would the percentage of male Heralds have any bearing on the percentage of male Companions? We've certainly seen enough cross-gender Choosings for that not to be a reason, we have no evidence that souls must retain their gender when reincarnating, and (even if they had to) we have no information on the ratios of souls choosing if and when to reincarnate... -jenneke, who truly despises househunting jsb-+AT+-phantom.com new .sig in development ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:27:00 -0500 (EST) From: Jennifer Broekman To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: settling an old dispute Message-ID: On Tue, 28 Nov 1995, Heather Mina wrote: > Not to mention that this all happened in the middle of the night. Going for > a ride with a 14-year-old niece in the middle of the night is probably not > something the menfolk at Forst Reach would be too happy about. I don't think making friends around the Reach or riding alone in the middle of the night would be smiled upon, either.:-) Seriously, I took it as a list of suggestions for the next few days/weeks, not a list of things to be done immediately (other than the go to bed part). > I always assumed that this was Tashir's Companion's name, too. I always assumed it was the niece's name. As for it not being the type of name associated with human females, how can anyone tell? Savil, Treesa, Kylla, Melenna, Roshya, Serina, Ria, and Lissa are all names associated just with the Ashkevron family. Why not Nerya? Also, Tashir's Companion is male (_MPromise_, pg 148, "A *Herald*, with a heavy carter's whip, *beating* the stallion until his skin came away in strips and blood striped bright on the snowy hide, trying to separate him from the boy."). Nerya *certainly* doesn't sound like any Valdemaran or Companion male name that we've seen anywhere else... -jenneke jsb-+AT+-phantom.com new .sig in development ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:35:47 -0500 From: AliFarr-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Heralds and Healers, Comp... Message-ID: <951128193543_37259440-+AT+-mail02.mail.aol.com> Heather wrote: I think that the fertility issue only comes in with respect to Rolan, but doesn't Talia say something to the effect of "Cymry forgot about the amazing fertility of Grove-Born Companions, especially the Companion of the Monarch's Own." << This is not a direct quote - can someone look it up for me? >> Close, sorry I don't have it at hand at the moment either, but having read it top my son just the other night, the comment close to it (same conversation) alluded to Companion Mares generally being able to conceive or not as they chose - and that the MOC's fertility overrode that ability. Also, as companions don't chose until they are generally at least 10, and unpartnered companions foal far more often than partnered ones; I'm paraphrasing Talia explaining why trainees are on foal watch, companion mares could have several foals before they choose a Herald, then never foal again, except at great need or a "Whoops" like Cymry.....future plot line here???? Who is Cymry's foal and what is he up to ten years in the future? Ideas anyone? AliFarr ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 19:55:21 -0500 (EST) From: Jennifer Broekman To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Shavri as King's Own, gender pairings, and more... Message-ID: On Wed, 29 Nov 1995, Alison Schiff wrote: > I'm thinking of the three *original* (grove born) companions. Aside from > the very rare 'other' grove born companions like Gwena (and I think a few > more came along in their time? could someone check?) they were the _only_ > ones around. Wouln't they need to be sure that if a new herald was to be > chosen, there would be a foal to choose him/her? Since they were so few, > they would have to be sure that every attempt at breeding "took" (sorry, > 'couldn't think of a better phrase). Thus the super-fertility. >From _AotQ_, page 124 (DAW paperback): [...] By the time Valdemar died, there were twenty-one Heralds, including himself, his Heir, and his Heir's second son. You have a good memory, Davan, thank you," Teren concluded. "Where did all those Companions come from?" Edrik wanted to know. "At first they all came from the Grove in the middle of what we now call Companion's Field, like the first three; other than that, no one knew. After a while, though, the mares began foaling, and now all Companions with a single exception are born right here at the Collegium." This, IMO, means that the herd was built up to a reasonable level through Groveborn Companions, and the population didn't rely on the mares until later. This makes plenty of sense since, regardless of fertility, it still takes nine months to make a Companion any other way (plus ten years to get to adulthood), and I have the feeling that only one (Ardatha) of the original three (Ardatha, Kyrith, and Steladar) was a mare, and she Chose King Valdemar, who died not all that long after. Even if Ardatha had twins every nine months, she'd've needed 81 months or almost 7 years to produce the necessary additional Companions herself, and personally, not only would I not want to do that myself, but that would leave her neither time nor energy to help Valdemar with the laws he needed to make *and* I don't think Valdemar lived that long after he summoned the Companions. -jenneke jsb-+AT+-phantom.com new .sig in development ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 20:06:10 -0500 (EST) From: Jennifer Broekman To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: companion stats Message-ID: On Wed, 29 Nov 1995 Keri (KEBAS-+AT+-vaxsar.vassar.edu) wrote: > Hi, i'm new to this list, so I thought I'd intoduse myself then address one > of the posts. My name's Keri, I'm a first-year student at Vassar College, and > I'm hopelessly addicted to Misty! Hello and welcome. Try to spend some time sleeping and studying your first year. SimCity addictions (what I indulged in my first year) are hard enough to control. Internet addictions aren't really curable.:-) > the reincarnation issue- if 2/3 of the heralds are male, then 2/3 of the > available "souls" (or whatever) for new companions must be as well. > Well, that's my 2 cents... Anybody agree/disagree? Ah, but who says that gender is an inherit attribute of a soul? Yes, Savil/Sayvil and Jaysen/Jasan would be same-gender examples, but they're only two. Certainly Gifts vary (see Tylendel/Stefen), and names are likely to vary (do you really think that Florian used 'Florian' every one of his multiple times around?). Why not gender? Also, in our RL world, there are people whose body doesn't match the gender they feel their soul is. They tend to want to change their bodily gender to match their 'inner' gender, but I could certainly see the souls who become Companions being able to deal with a body of the opposite gender. I mean, you'd have to be able to hang with wearing a saddle and not having hands, having new and different genitals doesn't sound like all that big a deal to me. -jenneke jsb-+AT+-phantom.com new .sig in development ------------------------------ Date: 28 Nov 95 20:13:47 EST From: "James T. Yardley" <73201.745-+AT+-compuserve.com> To: Mercedes Lackey Mailing Subject: Companions... a thought Message-ID: <951129011346_73201.745_JHE68-1-+AT+-CompuServe.COM> just another idea for you all to ponder: what would happen if a Companion mated with a regular horse? - Meg ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:31:41 -0500 (EST) From: Jennifer Broekman To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Companions... a thought Message-ID: On Wed, 29 Nov 1995, Meg wrote: > just another idea for you all to ponder: what would happen if a >Companion mated with a regular horse? What would happne if a kyree mated with a wolf? What would happen if you mated with a chimp? Why would a Companion *want* to mate with a regular horse? We've seen that even Shin'a'in battlemares have a low opinion of the average horse, so what would a Companion possibly see in one? -jenneke jsb-+AT+-phantom.com new .sig in development ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:27:20 -0500 (EST) From: Alison Schiff To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Shavri as King's Own, gender pairings, and more... Message-ID: On Wed, 29 Nov 1995, Jennifer Broekman wrote: > On Wed, 29 Nov 1995, Alison Schiff wrote: > > I'm thinking of the three *original* (grove born) companions. Aside from > > the very rare 'other' grove born companions like Gwena (and I think a few > > more came along in their time? could someone check?) they were the _only_ > > ones around. Wouln't they need to be sure that if a new herald was to be > > chosen, there would be a foal to choose him/her? Since they were so few, > > they would have to be sure that every attempt at breeding "took" (sorry, > > 'couldn't think of a better phrase). Thus the super-fertility. > > >From _AotQ_, page 124 (DAW paperback): > [...] By the time Valdemar died, there were twenty-one Heralds, > including himself, his Heir, and his Heir's second son. You have a good > memory, Davan, thank you," Teren concluded. > "Where did all those Companions come from?" Edrik wanted to know. > "At first they all came from the Grove in the middle of what we now > call Companion's Field, like the first three; other than that, no one > knew. After a while, though, the mares began foaling, and now all > Companions with a single exception are born right here at the Collegium." > > This, IMO, means that the herd was built up to a reasonable level through > Groveborn Companions, and the population didn't rely on the mares until > later. This makes plenty of sense since, regardless of fertility, it > still takes nine months to make a Companion any other way (plus ten years > to get to adulthood), and I have the feeling that only one (Ardatha) of > the original three (Ardatha, Kyrith, and Steladar) was a mare, and she > Chose King Valdemar, who died not all that long after. Even if Ardatha > had twins every nine months, she'd've needed 81 months or almost 7 years > to produce the necessary additional Companions herself, and personally, > not only would I not want to do that myself, but that would leave her > neither time nor energy to help Valdemar with the laws he needed to make > *and* I don't think Valdemar lived that long after he summoned the > Companions. > > -jenneke > > jsb-+AT+-phantom.com > new .sig in development > Yes...well I knew I didn't write out what I was thinking of very clearly. Thank you for the quote, so there were other grove-born around that time... I agree that the herd would have been built up the way you said, but I still think that the "super-fertility" of that grove-born herd would have been, not necessary, but certainly helpful in ensuring future offspring, The companions could not be sure that all "liasons" would bring foals and the fertility just about garanteed(sp) conception. I am *not* implying that all of the mares were pregnant all of the time, only that they (the companions) were provided with a sure[er] way to maintain their number while serving Valdemar (-indangering their lives). They were a new "race" and I would think that at a point that the GB herd was established the grove births stopped. We don't know the conception rate (?) of normal companions. It could be very uncertain. The super fertility of the grove born _would_ mean that they had to be extra careful about their 'liasons' anyway, so they might have maintained/increased their number very conciously and deliberately (in other words they mated when they wanted a foal, period.) anyway. Alison schiff-+AT+-trenton.edu ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:29:47 -0500 (EST) From: Alison Schiff To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Companions... a thought Message-ID: On Wed, 29 Nov 1995, James T. Yardley wrote: > just another idea for you all to ponder: what would happen if a Companion mated > with a regular horse? > > - Meg > > What would happen if a human mated with a gorrila? -Alison (not a flame, just the only response that came to mind) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:38:54 -0500 (EST) From: Rosario Holsen-Baker To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Companions... a thought Message-ID: > just another idea for you all to ponder: what would happen if a Companion mated > with a regular horse? > > - Meg I think the more relevant question here (or at least, the more probable) would be, why would they want to? The Companions are pretty much on our level in terms of sentience (Gods, is that the word for it?), and I would imagine they look on mating with horses the same as we do. Certainly it seems Yfandes wasn't too keen on it, in that little bit with Meke's so-called-Shin'a'in-stud. ...and Lavaan just gave me a *look* so, I think I'd better get off this topic now. :) |--------------------------------<>------------------------------| | Three rings for the elven kings under the sky | | Seven for the dwarves in their halls of stone | | Nine for the mortal men, doomed to die | | One for the dark lord on his dark throne.... | |---------------------http://www.sidwell.edu/~rholsen--------------------| ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:41:42 -0500 (EST) From: Putty Tat To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Companions... a thought Message-ID: ************************************** * ^0 0^ Kat Wing * * >o< wingk-+AT+-river.it.gvsu.edu * * \_/ Wind to thy wings! * ************************************** I don't think that a Companion would mate with a regular horse. Since Companions have the minds of the Heralds they once were, I think that mating with a "dumb animal" would be distasteful. I mean in our society it is considered wrong to bed a person who lacks intelligence. Saying that they would, almost seems like we are putting them on the same level as wild animals. (sorry if this seemed not to answer you idea) - Kat On Wed, 29 Nov 1995, James T. Yardley wrote: > just another idea for you all to ponder: what would happen if a Companion mated > with a regular horse? > > - Meg > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:55:33 +22303754 (EETDT) From: Wendy Hill To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Companions... a thought Message-ID: On Wed, 29 Nov 1995, James T. Yardley wrote: > just another idea for you all to ponder: what would happen if a Companion mated > with a regular horse? > > - Meg > Urk. How disgusting. No really. Think how annoyed they get being mistaken for a horse. Remember, Yfandes put the big ugly stallion at Forst Reach in his place. I can't think of any Companion who would be interested in a horse. It's not like they're Gryphons or Kyrees that a Companion could have a conversation with. Or be remotely interested in. And, they're not going to have babies. It would probably turn out something like a mule. Not a good idea. Wendy ***************************************************************** _________________ T T T T T T T T Wendy Hill I I I I I I I I W.Hill-+AT+-nla.gov.au I I I I I I I I National Library of Australia T T T T T T T T Phone: +61 06 262 1214 =================== Fax: +61 06 273 1180 ***************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:04:21 -0500 (EST) From: s003yms-+AT+-desire.wright.edu To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: settling an old dispute Message-ID: On Mon, 27 Nov 1995, Catherine Osborne wrote: > does anyone remember the argument as to the identity of Tashir's > Companion, referred to by all as Ghost or Lesh'ya? > > Guess what? While rereading Magic's Promise, I happened to notice what > I think is the one reference in all three books to the true name: it's > Nerya. This is when Tashir comes to Van in the proverbial middle of > the night and asks him to make love. At the end of their (long) > conversation, Vanyel tells him to (approximate quote): "Go have > another talk with Jervis, go riding with Nerya, [do something else]." > > Oops. Bell rang. Physics class. Argh. Talk later ;) > > (Oh yeah. Just got my storm rising book back. It says Rolan can mindspeak > many non-gifted's at once, but it would take great effort. quote > tomorrow. *Really* late now ;) > > I\/ Catherine Osborne "After great pain, > I\/ Sundancer a formal feeling comes." > I cosborne-+AT+-sidwell.edu --Emily Dickinson > I http://www.sidwell.edu/~cosborne/ > > > I think that in this instance Van is talking about that 14 year old cousin of his that Tashir seemed interested in....but i dont have the book on me at the moment so i may be off ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:16:19 -0500 (EST) From: s003yms-+AT+-desire.wright.edu To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: order of writing Message-ID: Anyone remember which order the Velgarth books were written in? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:18:06 -0500 (EST) From: s003yms-+AT+-desire.wright.edu To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Companions... a thought Message-ID: On Wed, 29 Nov 1995, James T. Yardley wrote: > just another idea for you all to ponder: what would happen if a Companion mated > with a regular horse? > > - Meg > > somehow with the mind a companion has i think it might feel a little to them like you having sex with a sheep (no offense intendeed0 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 22:56:03 -0500 From: scp6-+AT+-po.cwru.edu (Stacy Pyett) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Hi! Message-ID: <199511290356.WAA10702-+AT+-slc5.INS.CWRU.Edu> Hi to everyone! I am new to this mailing list and fairly new to Mercedes Lackey books as well. I absolutely love the ones I have read, and I really enjoy "listening in' on the converstions, even though I haven't read enough of the books (don't worry... I'm working on it :) ) to participate much. I'm a second year student at Case Western Reserve University studying Chemical Engineering. (I guess that makes me a Chemistry person too :) ) I think this makes me the third (?) Stac(e)y who is a "Chemistry person" on this list... something about the name maybe? Hoping to know what I'm talking about soon! :) Stacy scp6-+AT+-po.CWRU.Edu ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- "Ignore the obvious for it is unworthy of the clear eye and the kindly heart." -William Saroyan -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Nov 95 23:06:57 CST From: "Katherine M. Brielmaier" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Shavri and Companions Message-ID: <92425.brie0030-+AT+-gold.tc.umn.edu> re: Shavri and her abilities. I just reread LHM, and I found Shavri to be annoying in the extreme. Her only quality for being Chosen, in my view, was her Healing. Almost everything she did was calculated to benefit first herself, then Randale, and only incidentally Valdemar. 1. She wouldn't marry Randale because she didn't want the responsibility of rule...sure Randi needed to keep his availability open, but that seems to be pretty secondary and minor in Shavri's point of view. And then she went ballistic about Jisa marrying the Heir, without stopping to consider how Jisa might feel, or that anybody could possibly *want* the chance to rule. 2. She had Jisa because she really wanted a child--it just happened to have the added benefit of keeping Randale available. 3. She opened up that full link between herself and Randale. Yes, it was to benefit him, but really it was the only way to ensure that he would live as long as possible, and then die and take her with him. She didn't want to live without him, but she didn't want to die right away either, and it seems to me this was the only way she could manage it. I am pretty surprised at her Companion for choosing such a bad herald. Thank (insert deity of your choice here) that Vanyel was around to take care of things. And speaking of which (Choosing, I mean), another question. How do Companions know whom to choose? Does the God(ess) or God(esse)s tell them directly, or do they agree among themselves, or does each Companion get programmed with their Herald from the very start, or what? Any speculations? *snip* > >|--------------------------------<>------------------------------| >| Three rings for the elven kings under the sky | >| Seven for the dwarves in their halls of stone | >| Nine for the mortal men, doomed to die | >| One for the dark lord on his dark throne.... | >|---------------------http://www.sidwell.edu/~rholsen--------------------| > Damn it Jaguar, why'd you have to go and write that? Now I'll have to re-read it. And it's Finals around here too! (*grumble grumble*) ;-) 's e do bheatha Kaatje ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Nov 95 14:37:35 EST From: mealink-+AT+-syd.au.swissbank.com (Kerry Mealing) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Companions... a thought Message-ID: <9511290337.AA24463-+AT+-syd.au.swissbank.com> James T. Yardley (Meg?) <73201.745-+AT+-compuserve.com> wrote: > just another idea for you all to ponder: what would happen if a Companion > mated with a regular horse? I get the strong impression that this would be considered declasse by the heralds, if not the Companions.. Besides, regular horses aren't intelligent.. it'd be kinda like bestiality.. This is very much IMHO, but I'd consider it kinda tacky. I'm seriously being to wonder how weird this sounds, talking about 'moral' considerations re sex between a horse and a horse-shaped being. Note that it's implied that a being's sexual attraction based on physical attributes is defined at least partly by their body.. (Eg Yfandes "He has a perfectly lovely ... nose." And Van teasing her about a stallion..) At a stretch, I could [possibly] see a Companion and some-other intelligent creature falling for each other.. but it's not really remotely possible for three reasons: 1. The other would have to be intelligent. 2. There would have to be physical similarities (for both the mechanics of the act and probably physical attraction). 3. Probably most importantly, Companions are spirits.. they have a job to do and a reputation to uphold. They also couldn't speak freely with their partner about who/what they are. (I know I won't bed someone I don't feel comfortable with and I'm damn sure Companions, especially mind-speaking ones, would be more noble / refined / fussy / whathaveyou, than I. Well, I'm rambling, probably making a complete horse's ass out of myself (sorry, couldn't resist) and definitely not getting work done. :) Cheers, Kerry. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Nov 95 14:22:35 EST From: mealink-+AT+-syd.au.swissbank.com (Kerry Mealing) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: companion stats Message-ID: <9511290322.AA24396-+AT+-syd.au.swissbank.com> Jenneke wrote: > Keri (not I) wrote: > > the reincarnation issue- if 2/3 of the heralds are male, then 2/3 of the > > available "souls" (or whatever) for new companions must be as well. > > Well, that's my 2 cents... Anybody agree/disagree? > > Ah, but who says that gender is an inherit attribute of a soul? Yes, > Savil/Sayvil and Jaysen/Jasan would be same-gender examples, but they're > only two. Certainly Gifts vary (see Tylendel/Stefen), and names are > likely to vary (do you really think that Florian used 'Florian' every one > of his multiple times around?). Why not gender? I agree. I kinda imagine that 'advanced' souls would kinda be beyond that sort of thing. Certainly Lord/Lady Death seems to be all things to all people (admittedly he/she's not human, but it might point the way perhaps..) > Also, in our RL world, there are people whose body doesn't match the > gender they feel their soul is. They tend to want to change their bodily > gender to match their 'inner' gender, but I could certainly see the souls > who become Companions being able to deal with a body of the opposite > gender. I mean, you'd have to be able to hang with wearing a saddle and > not having hands, having new and different genitals doesn't sound like all > that big a deal to me. Hmmm, wonder what happens to the shaych heralds who're reincarnated? Never mind, that's a rhetorical q. :) Kerry. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Nov 95 14:13:47 EST From: mealink-+AT+-syd.au.swissbank.com (Kerry Mealing) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: settling an old dispute Message-ID: <9511290313.AA24346-+AT+-syd.au.swissbank.com> Jenneke wrote: > I always assumed it was the niece's name. Ditto. :) > As for it not being the type of name associated with human females, how > can anyone tell? Savil, Treesa, Kylla, Melenna, Roshya, Serina, Ria, and > Lissa are all names associated just with the Ashkevron family. Why not > Nerya? Also, Tashir's Companion is male (_MPromise_, pg 148, "A *Herald*, > with a heavy carter's whip, *beating* the stallion until his skin came > away in strips and blood striped bright on the snowy hide, trying to > separate him from the boy."). Nerya *certainly* doesn't sound like any > Valdemaran or Companion male name that we've seen anywhere else... Oooh Oooh. Me, me! (Sorry, terminal case of 'pick me..') :) There seems to be a fairly consistent theme that common female names in Valdemar end in 'a'. I knew there was a reason why I assumed Nerya was the female niece and I hadn't realized it until Jenn so helpfully listed some female names. (Yes, I know Savil is the odd one out and that Keren and co don't fit the bill, but I'm only suggesting a general trend re names from the most common traditions..) Add Ylsa to the list btw.. (Even Selenay has a female ring to its ending).. Vowel sounding endings, typically 'a' type sounds. Compare these against: Vanyel, Tashir, Tylendel, Jaysen, Jervis, Dirk, Skip, Meke, Randale.. Consonent or consonant sounding endings (I hear Meke as 'Meek' but that's just me.) Comments? (Apart from 'hey, call the white-coated guys.') Kerry. "Sig? Naaah. If you need a sig they're not afraid enough." ------------------------------ End of MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 250 *********************************