MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 287 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Queen's Own by Mat Timmerman 2) Re: hello! by Mat Timmerman 3) Re: Queen's Own by Mat Timmerman 4) Re: Need's Story by Lee Bromberger 5) Trainees flunking by dbackhau-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl 6) Re: Need's Story by dbackhau-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl 7) Re: Need's Story by mel (Melanie Dymond Harper) 8) Re: Tylendel by "Sanna Koulu" 9) Re: Tylendel by "Sanna Koulu" 10) Re: Questions about LHM by "Sanna Koulu" 11) Re: Tylendel by Rosario Holsen-Baker 12) Re: Questions about LHM by Gyrfalcon 13) Re: Savil by Gyrfalcon 14) Re: Trainees flunking by Gyrfalcon 15) Re: Need's Story by Gyrfalcon 16) Re: Need's Story by Joan Ferguson 17) Re: Tylendel by dbackhau-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl 18) Re: Tylendel by Tammy Harris 19) Re: Trainees flunking by Tammy Harris 20) Re: Queen's Own by be248-+AT+-scn.org (SCN User) 21) Re: Trainees flunking by be248-+AT+-scn.org (SCN User) 22) Re: Tylendel by SCN User 23) Re: Tylendel by EGLESTON-+AT+-GROVER.BPL.ORG 24) Re: Need's Story by Rosario Holsen-Baker 25) Re: Tylendel by Gyrfalcon ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 03 Jan 1996 00:53:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Mat Timmerman To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Queen's Own Message-ID: <01HZJZGGXUYQ91VYEM-+AT+-vaxc.hofstra.edu> From: Becky Anne Christensen > >Okay, the book says that when the current queen's own dies, the companion >goes out and usually picks another herald to be the new queen's own. BUT >aren't the herald/companion bondings for life? Wouldn't the new queen's >own old companion die? Do companions die of old age? Or only if their >herals does? Because if the queen's own died, and the companion picked a >new one, then that one died, and the companion didn't, it could be >hundreds of years old. Or, if the queen's own companion dies, would the >queen's own die as well? > As others have said already, the Monarch's Own Companion (MOC) is a special case. As far as we've seen, only the MOC rebonds after his Chosen's death. He is always a he, and never ages. Non-Groveborn Companions do grow old, though we don't know about Groveborn, non-MOC's (ala Gwena). Mat accmjt-+AT+-vaxc.hofstra.edu VAX is the source of all evil. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Jan 1996 00:56:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Mat Timmerman To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: hello! Message-ID: <01HZJZKWQLQG91VYEM-+AT+-vaxc.hofstra.edu> From: Catherine Osborne > >Well, as earlier noted, I'm back from holidays. Happy new year, everyone! > >I have a recommendation to make: a woman named Janny Wurts is in the >process of writing a five-book sequence called The Wars of Light and >Shadow. > >Anyway, if ;you have $5 to spend, go find "Curse of the Mistwraith" and >its sequel "Ships of Merior" ("Warhost of Vastmark" is coming in January. >How will I make it?) Are you sure they're that good? I bought _Curse of the Mistwraith_ and I couldn't get past the part where the brothers get out of the place that they start out in (that neatly avoids spoilers and my extremely shoddy memory :) ). Mat accmjt-+AT+-vaxc.hofstra.edu VAX is the source of all evil. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Jan 1996 01:01:58 -0400 (EDT) From: Mat Timmerman To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Queen's Own Message-ID: <01HZJZP02L0U91VYEM-+AT+-vaxc.hofstra.edu> From: Becky Anne Christensen > > One more question It does say in Arrows >of the Queen that the new Monarch's Own is usually already a Herald, >right? So if he/she was already a Herald, then he/she would already have >a Companion. Would they give up their first Companion to bond to the >Monarch's Own Companion? That doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Heralds >have a deep bond with their Companions, how could a Herald just give up >his first Companion? Can I hear a collective moan of anguish from the list at large? :) Sorry about that Becky, I just had to get that off of my chest. A few months ago, we spent a looong time debating this one. IIRC, the general consensus was that a trainee who would be the next Monarch's Own would get an unbonded Choosing, as Vanyel suggests about Jisa in MPrice (or it could be MPromise). Then, when he/she gets Chosen as MO, the other Companion probably goes on to Choose his/her "real" Chosen. Mat accmjt-+AT+-vaxc.hofstra.edu VAX is the source of all evil. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 01:49:22 -0500 (EST) From: Lee Bromberger To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Need's Story Message-ID: Hello!! My name is Lee and I just subscribed to your list. I was very excited to find your address on the Internet and discover there are others out there (wherever there is?) that enjoy Mercedes Lackey's works as much as I do. Can someone please tell me when the list got started? Where are most subscribers from? Have you always believed in magic or are you a recent convert? It's great to see that science is not conquering the world and that magic (and fantasy) still have a chance. Would you compare this writing on the Internet, what I'll call WriteSpeech as similar to MindSpeech? I have read quite a few of ML's books but I can't recall which book reveals to us the story of Need, the sword. And do we ever get all of her story or only part of it?. How old is she and what is her real name? I only remember vague bits and pieces. Maybe I'm still asleep too, please just don't drop me down a well! Lee ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Jan 96 10:24:53 +0100 From: dbackhau-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Trainees flunking Message-ID: <9601030924.AA00518-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl> >> Can Herald trainees flunk? >> >> Cindy D. >I suppose that it depends on if they were ready to be a herald. Herald >trainees probably COULD flunk, but wouldn't just because of the very >nature of Heralds. > > (:*BECKY*:) But they can't really can they - I mean what do their companions, that they've just spent 3 or more years bonding with, do? Say "sorry about that, it was fun knowing you" and go find someone else? I reckon that if you're chosen, that's it. The very fact of being selected by your companion ensures that you're going to be a herald - all this passing of your intern (?) year is just a formality. That's possibly why Kero and Daren get straight into whites - they have no need of 'training' - they've spent a large chunk of their lives doing just that. It's just a matter of experience as to when you get your whites. And (I don't know if my english teacher would even notice I'd started with an 'and') if being a herald was not a foregone conclusion of being chosen, why were Selenay and Talia so estatic when Elspeth got chosen - they knew she'd get to be a herald. 's e do bheatha, Debbi (whose car got crunched yesterday - and I wasn't even it the flaming thing - it was minding it's own business in the car park - heigh hoh, such is life) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Jan 96 11:13:31 +0100 From: dbackhau-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Need's Story Message-ID: <9601031013.AA00556-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl> Lee (fellow newbie, altho' I made it on a week before him) asks: > Hello!! My name is Lee and I just subscribed to your list. I was very >excited to find your address on the Internet and discover there are others >out there (wherever there is?) that enjoy Mercedes Lackey's works as much as >I do. Can someone please tell me when the list got started? Nope - need the old-timers for that >Where are most subscribers from? All over I think - mainly the US and UK - altho I'm in The Netherlands. >Have you always believed in magic or are you a recent convert? I don't - I just like the escape ML's books offer and have since AoQ first appeared back in '87. Lordy how the years fly by - that's nearly 10 years! >It's great to see that science is not conquering the world and that magic (and >fantasy) still have a chance. Would you compare this writing on the Internet, >what I'll call WriteSpeech as similar to MindSpeech? Errrm, ..... nope. Mind speech is instantaneous, and specific. Anyone subscribing to the list can read this, but not as I write it, and not necessarily for hours/days after it's sent. I think mindspeech is just heard - you wouldn't be aware of spelling/grammar/punctuation/editor cock-ups and so on. I can spend time polishing this into erudite elegance before I expose it to the world's cruel eyes - mindspeech is less considered, IMHO ;-). >I have read quite a few of ML's books but I can't recall which book reveals to >us the story of Need, the sword. And do we ever get all of her story or only >part of it?. How old is she and what is her real name? I only remember vague >bits and pieces. You get all there is from the Winds books - her history from the first two (including her name, but it escapes me at the moment) and some hints about her "status" for want of a better word in the last. I don't think we find out how or when Dawnfire and oojamaflip (the avatars) contact her, but she meets .... aargh my brain hurts, you know, whassisname, thingummy - YES! - Adeshena, on the moonpaths so, is she on a par with the ka'l'endal or however they spell themselves? My two pennies worth, 's e do bheatha Debbi ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 10:36:53 GMT From: mel (Melanie Dymond Harper) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Need's Story Message-ID: <9601031036.AA03294-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk> > Hello!! My name is Lee and I just subscribed to your list. I was very > excited to find your address on the Internet and discover there are others > out there (wherever there is?) that enjoy Mercedes Lackey's works as much as > I do. Can someone please tell me when the list got started? Where are > most subscribers from? Have you always believed in magic or are you a > recent convert? It's great to see that science is not conquering the > world and that magic (and fantasy) still have a chance. Would you > compare this writing on the Internet, what I'll call WriteSpeech as > similar to MindSpeech? > *grin* I'll answer the boring admin stuff. The list started in early 1994 (I don't have a date immediately to hand -- May, perhaps?), switched sites in early 1995, and is still plodding along to date. Out of the ~270 current subscribers (we've lost quite a few over the break, I imagine some of 'em will be back fairly shortly), the majority are probably from the US but there are several other countries represented (most notably the UK, perhaps not too surprisingly as that is where the list is run from). As for believing in magic, this now wanders off into the realms of personal opinion rather than fact :) I have to admit that I don't actually believe in magic within the 'real world'. I mean, I'd _like_ to, but I've never yet seen or experienced anything that would cause me to believe in its existence. (Yes, I am a boring scientific type.) But I'm more than happy to read it and believe in its existence in a fantasy setting, and I adore the Di Tregarde books, but Di's 'real world' is not my 'real world', much though I sometimes wish it were. > I have read quite a few of ML's books but I can't recall which > book reveals to us the story of Need, the sword. And do we ever get all > of her story or only part of it?. How old is she and what is her real > name? I only remember vague bits and pieces. Maybe I'm still asleep > too, please just don't drop me down a well! I don't think we ever find out her name (I may be wrong on this). If I remember correctly she is fairly old when she goes in to the sword, having been a blacksmith for some considerable while before this -- she decides this is the best way to help the student. (OK, I realise this is vague, I can't remember which book it's in either.) Cheers Mel ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 14:14:43 EET From: "Sanna Koulu" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Tylendel Message-ID: <461CE3E6AA1-+AT+-otdk.helsinki.fi> Becky wrote: > On Tue, 2 Jan 1996 EGLESTON-+AT+-GROVER.BPL.ORG wrote: > > > Just to add my two cents -- I think that Tylendel was also buried with > > honors because the Death Bell rang for him when he died. I can't find > > the reference at the moment, but I'm pretty sure that the bell rings of > > its own accord when a Herald dies. And if the bell rang for Tylendel, > > then he was -- when he died -- a Herald. It wasn't a judgement made by > > a human judge. > > You're right, it does ring all by itself, because there is > nothing attached to it to make it ring. It does make sense now. Thanks! > Questionmark? Isn't it the Companions who make the Bell ring? I don't think it's stated straight out anywhere, but that's the image I've got. And the Companions are kinda human... :) -Seanna ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 14:24:34 EET From: "Sanna Koulu" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Tylendel Message-ID: <461F87549D3-+AT+-otdk.helsinki.fi> Becky wrote: > On Tue, 2 Jan 1996 EGLESTON-+AT+-GROVER.BPL.ORG wrote: > > > It also raises another interesting question. Skif says "Every Herald > > knows when another one dies and whether or not it was from natural causes. > > You start to get the sensing of it around about your third year--" etc. That's different, no? That's the Web. The knowledge (of a Herald's death) comes through the Web a moment before the bell rings, but they are separate things. Vanyel somehow created the instant information effect, but the Bell rang even in Valdemar's times. I think. > > If you aren't a full Herald, but a trainee just starting, (i.e. before > > your third year) and something gets you killed, does the Death Bell ring? I don't think that has anything to do with it. It might be that a Herald-trainee only gets fully into the Web after a few years of Companion-bonding, so one would only sense the deaths of other Heralds when close to "graduation". There's two different questions there: 1) does the death bell ring for trainees? Yes, since it rang for Lendel. 2) Does the Web transmit knowledge of a trainee's death (before the 3rd year, about)? That's more in doubt, since they aren't really in the Web yet, it seems. All IMNSHO, of course ... -Seanna ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 14:43:27 EET From: "Sanna Koulu" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Questions about LHM Message-ID: <46248FD3A71-+AT+-otdk.helsinki.fi> Becky wrote: > One thing I've noticed, the books all say lifebonding is rare, > and even rarer among heralds. Actually, not so. It's more common (though still rare - a fact that seems to have been totally forgotten after being stated in AQueen) among Heralds than among the general populace. Apparently the higher concentration of Gifted people in Heralds (remember, there's some Heralds who aren't really Gifted) and possibly their more self- sacrificing nature account for the difference. -Seanna ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 07:50:05 -0500 (EST) From: Rosario Holsen-Baker To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Tylendel Message-ID: Cindy wrote: > Can Herald trainees flunk? > Tylendel was expelled, wasn't he? |--------------------------------<>------------------------------| | I would there were no age between sixteen and three-and-twenty | | or that youth would sleep out the rest, | | for there is nothing in the between but | | getting wenches with child, wronging the ancientry, stealing, fighting | |------------------------------------------------------------------------| ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 08:26:52 -0500 (EST) From: Gyrfalcon To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Questions about LHM Message-ID: On Wed, 3 Jan 1996, Becky Anne Christensen wrote: > One thing I've noticed, the books all say lifebonding is rare, > and even rarer among heralds. Selenay & Daren, Talia & Dirk, Elspeth & > Darkwind, Vanyel & 'Lendel, Vanyel & Stefan, Randale & Shivra, Jisa & > I forgot his name, Keren & Sherril, Keren & Ylsa, and that's all I can > remember, are all lifebonded and are all Heralds (excluding Stefan). And > Amberdrake & Winterhart are bonded too, my guess is tht they WOULD have > been heralds, but were born in the wrong time. IIRC, lifebonding in "normal" people is rarer than those who are Heralds or have herald potential. One of the things that forces a couple to LB is their emotional stability. An unstable person is likely to LB with one who is stable and sure of themselves etc. Example: Van & Tylendel, Kerren & Sherril, Talia and Dirk. Also, IIRC Elspeth and Darkwind are NOT lifebonded, and neither are Kerowyn and Eldan(?), they are love bonded, which is less rare but more.... Enjoyable? I do have to disagree that both Amberdrake and Winterhart would have been Heralds. They both were healers, and had that peculiar healer mindset... "A little selfishness is good for the spirit. That's why healers make lousy Heralds" (Paraphrased from one of the Arrows books) Fair winds and skies, --Gyrfalcon =======================msowers-+AT+-menger.eecs.stevens-tech.edu=================== Magic still exists. We have only to reach out and touch it, it is a part of the very fabric of the world. When our belief of magic completely dies this universe shall die. Because that magic; Hope, Dreams, Love, Beauty, Wonder, Belief, and Discovery are what make us a people. They are all part of a great Art whose workings are still a mystery but whose applications can be seen every day. If we ever lose the Art mankind shall not last the day. Let the magic that is in us roam free in our work, play, in each other, and most of all in ourselves. Let it roam free or it will die. ============================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 08:31:56 -0500 (EST) From: Gyrfalcon To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Savil Message-ID: On Wed, 3 Jan 1996, Becky Anne Christensen wrote: > If Heralds Do come back as Companions, would Kero's Sayvil really be > VAnyel's Aunt, Herald-Mage Savil? If I recall right, that is what Kero's > Companion's name is, they seem to have similar personality traits..... I seem to remember this thread before. Does anyone have a FAQ of the compiled information? I do seem to remember somebody either mentioning one or the intention to make one... (Or maybe it was the necessity of such a document, I can't remember.) I do believe, that that was the general conclusion we had reached at somewhere in the past. --Gyrfalcon =======================msowers-+AT+-menger.eecs.stevens-tech.edu=================== Magic still exists. We have only to reach out and touch it, it is a part of the very fabric of the world. When our belief of magic completely dies this universe shall die. Because that magic; Hope, Dreams, Love, Beauty, Wonder, Belief, and Discovery are what make us a people. They are all part of a great Art whose workings are still a mystery but whose applications can be seen every day. If we ever lose the Art mankind shall not last the day. Let the magic that is in us roam free in our work, play, in each other, and most of all in ourselves. Let it roam free or it will die. ============================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 08:41:59 -0500 (EST) From: Gyrfalcon To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Trainees flunking Message-ID: > That's possibly why Kero and Daren get straight into whites - they > have no need of 'training' - they've spent a large chunk of their lives > doing just that. It's just a matter of experience as to when you get your > whites. Hmmm... How can I put this... Bzzzzt! Wrong! Kero and Daren didn't just "get straight into whites" they still had to go through certain classes, mostly about Valdermarian history IIRC (It's at the end of BTS, where Kero offers to give up her captains position of the skybolts, again.) But they didn't have to spend as much time as the avgerage trainee. Maybe 5/6 months (This is a guess, don't quote me.) But their Internship was waived in the light of the circumstances. (The war, the necessity of having them around etc.) --Gyrfalcon =======================msowers-+AT+-menger.eecs.stevens-tech.edu=================== Magic still exists. We have only to reach out and touch it, it is a part of the very fabric of the world. When our belief of magic completely dies this universe shall die. Because that magic; Hope, Dreams, Love, Beauty, Wonder, Belief, and Discovery are what make us a people. They are all part of a great Art whose workings are still a mystery but whose applications can be seen every day. If we ever lose the Art mankind shall not last the day. Let the magic that is in us roam free in our work, play, in each other, and most of all in ourselves. Let it roam free or it will die. ============================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 08:48:41 -0500 (EST) From: Gyrfalcon To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Need's Story Message-ID: On Wed, 3 Jan 1996, Melanie Dymond Harper wrote: > I don't think we ever find out her (Need's) name (I may be wrong on this). You're wrong on this. In the second Winds book, Nyara has a "dream" about when Need killed herself, I do believe it was a lesson in fairness or something like that. We find out she was Sister Begins-with-L-and-I-can't-remember-the-name. --Gyrfalcon =======================msowers-+AT+-menger.eecs.stevens-tech.edu=================== Magic still exists. We have only to reach out and touch it, it is a part of the very fabric of the world. When our belief of magic completely dies this universe shall die. Because that magic; Hope, Dreams, Love, Beauty, Wonder, Belief, and Discovery are what make us a people. They are all part of a great Art whose workings are still a mystery but whose applications can be seen every day. If we ever lose the Art mankind shall not last the day. Let the magic that is in us roam free in our work, play, in each other, and most of all in ourselves. Let it roam free or it will die. ============================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 09:04:22 -0500 From: Joan Ferguson To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Need's Story Message-ID: <199601031404.JAA09489-+AT+-elmer.Harvard.EDU> >>I have read quite a few of ML's books but I can't recall which >> book reveals to us the story of Need, the sword. And do we ever get all >> of her story or only part of it?. How old is she and what is her real >> name? I only remember vague bits and pieces. Maybe I'm still asleep >> too, please just don't drop me down a well! >I don't think we ever find out her name (I may be wrong on this). If I remember >correctly she is fairly old when she goes in to the sword, having been a >blacksmith for some considerable while before this -- she decides this is the >best way to help the student. (OK, I realise this is vague, I can't remember >which book it's in either.) Well, actually, yes we *do* find out her name ... in the middle Winds book, when Nyara and Need run off into the wilderness and Need starts "training" her. At one point, when Nyara is in the middle of the "memories" that Need is using to train her, the original name is mentioned -- and darn if I can remember what that name is!!! (books-+AT+-home, computer-+AT+-work) - anyone else have the books on hand? Joan joan_ferguson-+AT+-harvard.edu Harvard University Library Preservation Office "Instead of loving your enemies,treat your friends a little better." -Edgar Watson Howe (1853-1937) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Jan 96 15:07:10 +0100 From: dbackhau-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Tylendel Message-ID: <9601031407.AA00692-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl> >Cindy wrote: > >> Can Herald trainees flunk? >> > Tylendel was expelled, wasn't he? > >|--------------------------------<>------------------------------| >| I would there were no age between sixteen and three-and-twenty | >| or that youth would sleep out the rest, | >| for there is nothing in the between but | >| getting wenches with child, wronging the ancientry, stealing, fighting | >|------------------------------------------------------------------------| I don't think so - I mean he had his brain-storm when his twin was killed, then persuaded Vanyel to help him with his revenge. Then he died and was buried in whites with heraldic honour. I don't think they had time to expel him after whatever-her-name was (Gayla??)repudiated him (when they would no doubt have had to) and his death. But your point is taken - if a trainee fails, his companion has got to repudiate him - which would probably kill the trainee, and if the companion won't do it, then the trainee can't be expelled. Ergo, (the brain lurches to it's conclusion), the humans can't decide whether a trainee makes a herald, the companions do - just as they choose the trainees in the first place. I suppose one could stay a trainee for ever?? Debbi (whose found a quote) **************************************************************************** * In fact, the mere act of opening the box will determine the state of the * * cat, although in this case there were three determinate states the cat * * could be in: these being Alive, Dead, and Bloody Furious. * * -- Schrodinger's Moggy explained (Terry Pratchett, Lords and Ladies) -- * **************************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Jan 1996 09:43:17 -0500 From: Tammy Harris To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Tylendel Message-ID: <2717ABE5A96-+AT+-medicine.dmed.iupui.edu> Heyla, all! It sure is nice to have people back from the holidays and vacations (hope they were great)! It was pretty lonely here! On Jan 3, Becky wrote: > > You're right, it does ring all by itself, because there is > > nothing attached to it to make it ring. It does make sense now. Thanks! On Jan 3, Seanna replied: > Questionmark? Isn't it the Companions who make the Bell ring? I don't > think it's stated straight out anywhere, but that's the image I've > got. And the Companions are kinda human... :) IIRC, there was a conversation (Kris and Talia?? Tylendel and Vanyel??), in which someone said that if you went into the Grove while the Bell was ringing, you would see all the companions gathered around the tower, staring up at it. Sorry to be so vague; blame it on my little pea brain and seive-like memory (if only I could install a hard drive in my head!). Happy '96! Tammy "It's time to ask yourself what you believe" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Jan 1996 10:31:26 -0500 From: Tammy Harris To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Trainees flunking Message-ID: <27248123039-+AT+-medicine.dmed.iupui.edu> On Wed, Jan 3, Gyrfalcon wrote: > Kero and Daren didn't just "get straight into whites" they still had to > go through certain classes, mostly about Valdermarian history IIRC (It's > at the end of BTS, where Kero offers to give up her captains position of > the skybolts, again.) But they didn't have to spend as much time as the > avgerage trainee. Maybe 5/6 months (This is a guess, don't quote me.) > But their Internship was waived in the light of the circumstances. (The > war, the necessity of having them around etc.) This still doesn't explain why they got their whites right away, rather than *after* they finished their schooling. The only explanation I've come up with is to distinguish them from the 'regular' Herald-trainee. But this doesn't make sense. Neither Kero nor Daren seems likely to want or need the formality, and Kero would probably prefer the student greys, anyway, as being less obvious targets. Just MHO. Tammy "It's time to ask yourself what you believe" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 07:34:56 -0800 From: be248-+AT+-scn.org (SCN User) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Queen's Own Message-ID: <199601031534.HAA18220-+AT+-scn.org> > > > >On Wed, 3 Jan 1996, SCN User wrote: > >> > >> >Okay, the book says that when the current queen's own dies, the companion >> >goes out and usually picks another herald to be the new queen's own. BUT >> >aren't the herald/companion bondings for life? Wouldn't the new queen's >> >own old companion die? Do companions die of old age? Or only if their >> >herals does? Because if the queen's own died, and the companion picked a >> >new one, then that one died, and the companion didn't, it could be >> >hundreds of years old. Or, if the queen's own companion dies, would the >> >queen's own die as well? >> > >> > (:*BECKY*:) >> >> Herald/Companion bonds aren't necessarily for life, one or the other of >> the partners can survive, however, they usually die soon after because >> they are bereft of the other partner, which is why they say it is for >> life. Also, the Queen Own's Companion is different from most Companions >> because he is always a Stallion and alway Grove-Born, therefore, he >> continues on, picking Heralds to be Queen's Own until he dies, at which >> time a new Companion comes out of the Grove and assumes his duties. Yes, >> Companions can die from old age, but only as long as their Herald >> survives that long as well, for I haven't heard of a Companion surviving >> when his Herald dies. >> >> Just my thoughts... >> >> Zhai'helleva, >> Herald Briana >> >> -- >> Denise Abbott >> Herald Briana Kestyl >> wc814-+AT+-freenet.victoria >> be248-+AT+-scn.org >> > One more question It does say in Arrows >of the Queen that the new Monarch's Own is usually already a Herald, >right? So if he/she was already a Herald, then he/she would already have >a Companion. Would they give up their first Companion to bond to the >Monarch's Own Companion? That doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Heralds >have a deep bond with their Companions, how could a Herald just give up >his first Companion? > > (:*BECKY*:) > >I'm so happy because after finishing the last two books in the Last >Herald Mage trilogy, I am completely caught up with her books so far. >Can't wait for the Silver Gryphon....or the rest of the mage storms trilogy. > I believe that in TLH-M, it talks about Jisa being the next Queen's (or King's) Own when she is grown. It also states that she will probably be Chosen, but the Companion/Herald bond would be light and that Taver(her mother's Companion) would then Choose her, so that is evidently what happens. Just my thoughts... Zhai'helleva, Herald Briana -- Denise Abbott Herald Briana Kestyl wc814-+AT+-freenet.victoria be248-+AT+-scn.org ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 07:47:31 -0800 From: be248-+AT+-scn.org (SCN User) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Trainees flunking Message-ID: <199601031547.HAA20542-+AT+-scn.org> > > >>> Can Herald trainees flunk? >>> >>> Cindy D. > >>I suppose that it depends on if they were ready to be a herald. Herald >>trainees probably COULD flunk, but wouldn't just because of the very >>nature of Heralds. >> >> (:*BECKY*:) > >But they can't really can they - I mean what do their companions, that they've >just spent 3 or more years bonding with, do? Say "sorry about that, it was fun >knowing you" and go find someone else? I reckon that if you're chosen, that's >it. The very fact of being selected by your companion ensures that you're >going to be a herald - all this passing of your intern (?) year is just a >formality. That's possibly why Kero and Daren get straight into whites - they >have no need of 'training' - they've spent a large chunk of their lives doing >just that. It's just a matter of experience as to when you get your whites. >And (I don't know if my english teacher would even notice I'd started with an >'and') if being a herald was not a foregone conclusion of being chosen, why were >Selenay and Talia so estatic when Elspeth got chosen - they knew she'd get to >be a herald. > Yes, Herald Trainees can flunk, but only if they're Companion repudiates them. Therefore, if you're Chosen and your Companion doesn't repudiate you, you will eventually becom a Herald. I say eventually because they're going to keep training you until you get it and can reasponably got through a Circuit by yourself. Just my thoughts... Zhai'helleva, Herald Briana -- Denise Abbott Herald Briana Kestyl wc814-+AT+-freenet.victoria be248-+AT+-scn.org ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 07:53:42 -0800 From: SCN User To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Tylendel Message-ID: <199601031553.HAA21952-+AT+-scn.org> > >Becky wrote: > >> On Tue, 2 Jan 1996 EGLESTON-+AT+-GROVER.BPL.ORG wrote: >> >> > It also raises another interesting question. Skif says "Every Herald >> > knows when another one dies and whether or not it was from natural causes. >> > You start to get the sensing of it around about your third year--" etc. > >That's different, no? That's the Web. The knowledge (of a Herald's >death) comes through the Web a moment before the bell rings, but they >are separate things. Vanyel somehow created the instant information >effect, but the Bell rang even in Valdemar's times. I think. The first time the Death Bell rang was when Valdemar died... Just my thoughts... Zhai'helleva, Herald Briana -- Denise Abbott Herald Briana Kestyl wc814-+AT+-freenet.victoria be248-+AT+-scn.org ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 11:13:34 -0500 (EST) From: EGLESTON-+AT+-GROVER.BPL.ORG To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Tylendel Message-ID: <960103111334.555-+AT+-GROVER.BPL.ORG> Debbi said: "I suppose one could stay a trainee for ever??" Ouch! Can you imagine the poor good-hearted klutz who can't learn how to use a bow or a sword trying over and over and over and over... I think in that case, they would probably find something that the trainee can do well, and let that be his/her area of expertise. There must be a librarian in the building somewhere, for one. And maybe there are Heralds whose specialties are equine ailments? Cindy D. (Oh, I am having _so_ much fun!) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 12:11:10 -0500 (EST) From: Rosario Holsen-Baker To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Need's Story Message-ID: Gyrfalcon wrote: > Mel wrote: > > > I don't think we ever find out her (Need's) name (I may be wrong on this). > > You're wrong on this. In the second Winds book, Nyara has a "dream" > about when Need killed herself. No, the lesson in "fairness" was when she (Need) "went away" for a few days and forced Nyara to take care of herself, by herself. We the readers (in order to form a more perfect union...hee hee!) find out about Need's past when she first wakes up in Kata'shin'a'in and takes hold of Skif and Elspeth's minds to tell them her story. |--------------------------------<>------------------------------| | I would there were no age between sixteen and three-and-twenty | | or that youth would sleep out the rest, | | for there is nothing in the between but | | getting wenches with child, wronging the ancientry, stealing, fighting | |------------------------------------------------------------------------| ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 12:11:21 -0500 (EST) From: Gyrfalcon To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Tylendel Message-ID: On Wed, 3 Jan 1996, Tammy Harris wrote: > Sorry to be so vague; blame it on my little pea brain and seive-like > memory (if only I could install a hard drive in my head!). Now, dear, you know that all the space in the world doesn't make a difference, when your memory is corrupt. > "It's time to ask yourself what you believe" Where does that come from? I should know it but, well I guess my memory's corrupted as well. --Gyrfalcon =======================msowers-+AT+-menger.eecs.stevens-tech.edu=================== Magic still exists. We have only to reach out and touch it, it is a part of the very fabric of the world. When our belief of magic completely dies this universe shall die. Because that magic; Hope, Dreams, Love, Beauty, Wonder, Belief, and Discovery are what make us a people. They are all part of a great Art whose workings are still a mystery but whose applications can be seen every day. If we ever lose the Art mankind shall not last the day. Let the magic that is in us roam free in our work, play, in each other, and most of all in ourselves. Let it roam free or it will die. ============================================================================== ------------------------------ End of MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 287 *********************************