MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 313

Topics covered in this issue include:

  1) Re: Just saying Hi and wondering.
	by "David Ramsden" <avalon-+AT+-post.dungeon.com>
  2) Re: Snow
	by "David Ramsden" <avalon-+AT+-post.dungeon.com>
  3) Re: Just saying Hi and wondering.
	by "David Ramsden" <avalon-+AT+-post.dungeon.com>
  4) Re: re: Eastern Empire
	by "David Ramsden" <avalon-+AT+-post.dungeon.com>
  5) Re: Firesong---> illustrations
	by McCaffrey's White Dragon <gipple-+AT+-clark.edu>
  6) Re: YKYBRTMMLW (wow, this really is getting off-thread ;)
	by McCaffrey's White Dragon <gipple-+AT+-clark.edu>
  7) heralds and justice
	by EGLESTON-+AT+-GROVER.BPL.ORG
  8) Re: YKYBRTMMLW (wow, this really is gett (fwd)
	by McCaffrey's White Dragon <gipple-+AT+-clark.edu>
  9) (Fwd) Bardic Voices vs Valdemar
	by "David Ramsden" <avalon-+AT+-post.dungeon.com>
 10) (Fwd) Evil, ambition, sanity
	by "David Ramsden" <avalon-+AT+-post.dungeon.com>
 11) Re: illustrations
	by CHONNI <k_moll-+AT+-cariboo.bc.ca>
 12) Re: re: Eastern Empire (+changing philosophies)
	by CHONNI <k_moll-+AT+-cariboo.bc.ca>
 13) Re: New Thread: Charachters
	by EGLESTON-+AT+-GROVER.BPL.ORG
 14) UK vs. US editions
	by EGLESTON-+AT+-GROVER.BPL.ORG
 15) role-playing games (off subject)
	by EGLESTON-+AT+-GROVER.BPL.ORG
 16) RE: Makaar
	by "Patrick S. Waterlander" <patw-+AT+-clark.edu>
 17) Re: Too Much Misty & Queens Own
	by McCaffrey's White Dragon <gipple-+AT+-clark.edu>
 18) Re: FW: Re: YKYBRTMMLW: 
	by Rosario Holsen-Baker <rholsen-+AT+-sidwell.edu>
 19) Re: illustrations
	by Mat Timmerman <ACCMJT-+AT+-vaxc.hofstra.edu>
 20) Re: Just saying Hi and wondering.
	by Mat Timmerman <ACCMJT-+AT+-vaxc.hofstra.edu>
 21) Re: re- myriad subjects
	by "Patrick S. Waterlander" <patw-+AT+-clark.edu>

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 18:23:23 +0000
From: "David Ramsden" <avalon-+AT+-post.dungeon.com>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: Just saying Hi and wondering.
Message-ID: <199601121829.SAA17558-+AT+-gate.dungeon.com>

> For a Valdemar-based MUD, try telnetting to
> 
> mud-+AT+-vividnet.com 1996
> 
> Muranog
> 
> ***************************DGIF #11027************************* *"If
> thou do not wish to talk,                                * * and
> thou do not wish to listen,                             * * then
> thou do not wish to live." - Dawn Taylor, Canadian poet*
> ***************************************************************
> 
2 things: Isn't that an email address and didn't Misty refuse 
permision for valdemar muds?


David Ramsden - Avalon-+AT+-post.dungeon.com
----------------------------------------
Bishop:  I can promise that in this other world, there is 
       hope.  Hope that by working hard enough and 
       reaching far enough others like us can someday rid
       the world of the fear and predjudice and hatred
       that claimed this one.
Illyana:   Then I'd rather have - hope than nothing at 
        all.

                       - from X-men Omega

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 18:23:22 +0000
From: "David Ramsden" <avalon-+AT+-post.dungeon.com>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: Snow
Message-ID: <199601121829.SAA17553-+AT+-gate.dungeon.com>

> On Thu, 11 Jan 1996 05:19:32 GMT, 
> Becky Anne Christensen  <beckyanne-+AT+-iforge.valleynet.com> wrote:
> 
> (after I started a snowball fight)
> > 
> >        Send some snow balls this way! I could use them! Snowballs
> >        don't 
> >scare me! I love snow!
> >
> >                                                        (:*BECKY*:)
> 
> Oh yeah?!
> 
> Well take this!!<reaching towards private stockpile of snowballs>
> 
> *wham wham biff bang thud smack wham thud wham wham wham!*
> 
> <ducks behind reinforced snow-fort, then pops up and sticks out
> tongue>
> 
> Nyah Nyah Nyah!!
> 
> Kaatje
> "and the man who can do that, can plan my castle-onslaught any day."
> 
I think I'll build an igloo and take cover :)


David Ramsden - Avalon-+AT+-post.dungeon.com
----------------------------------------
Bishop:  I can promise that in this other world, there is 
       hope.  Hope that by working hard enough and 
       reaching far enough others like us can someday rid
       the world of the fear and predjudice and hatred
       that claimed this one.
Illyana:   Then I'd rather have - hope than nothing at 
        all.

                       - from X-men Omega

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 18:23:24 +0000
From: "David Ramsden" <avalon-+AT+-post.dungeon.com>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: Just saying Hi and wondering.
Message-ID: <199601121829.SAA17564-+AT+-gate.dungeon.com>

> 
> >        Hiyas,
> >I have been reading Lackey for awhile and I love her stuff. I was
> >just wondering if there were any MUSH'es and other Role Playing
> >PLaces for her books, IE Heralds  and the such. I know Robert
> >Jordan has a couple, I am on two of them;). Well anyhow I should
> >keep this short for my first post. Thanks.
> >                               ravnmoon-+AT+-cdsnet.net
> 
> I attach the relevant section from the Lackey archives faq:
> 
> *************************************************************** 5. 
> Why won't she let us have a MUSH or write fanfic?
> 
> Russell Galen is Mercedes Lackey and Larry Dixson's agent.  He has
> made the following statements in a general post to
> alt.books.m-lackey, dated in October 1994.
> 
> Any use of works by Mercedes Lackey and Larry Dixson in fan fiction
> or a role playing game is strictly prohibited.  The reasons are as
> follows:
> 
> A. It is copyright infringement. Any unauthorized use of
> intellectual property, whether or not for profit, is copyright
> infringement.
> 
> B. The authors are against it.  Knowing that strangers are making
> use of one's world, one's characters, one's creations, is usually a
> very unpleasant feeling, one of violation and intrusion.
> 
> C. There's been a great deal of discussion here as to whether a MUSH
> or MUD would help or hurt the salability of commercial game rights.
> The fact is, we don't know. It might have no effect, or a ruinous
> effect.  There is ample evidence for both from other media, and I
> don't know the answer. Given that uncertainty, we have to err on the
> side of caution and protection.
> 
> D. All of us on this side have discussed this and are resolved to
> take no chances with these valuable copyrights, and will vigorously
> pursue all legal means at our disposal.  Also, any action we might
> take would not be limited to individuals but to the universities and
> other organizations that permit their equipment and lines to be used
> for this illegal purpose.
> 
> E. Yes, we're greedy and narrow-minded in defense of our clients'
> ability to make a living. This is Mercedes Lackey's job. Anything
> that threatens her ability to make a living is no less an evil than
> any other situation in which an innocent party is forced, by the
> actions of strangers, to fight for her livelihood.
> 
> 
> So, please, folks - Just Say No to Lackey-MUDS.  If you want to
> write Fanfic, please send mail to the Queen's Own or HighFlight
> addresses above, and request a release form.  Don't go doing
> something that you're going to wind up regretting, later.
> 
> *******************************************
Sorry posted the first before i saw this
> 
> 
> And on a "P. Anthony" (shoulders rise defensively, furtive looks
> around the room) note - lookee what I came across when sifting
> through the FAQ pages on the Archives 
> 
> "Other collaborations:
> 
>         with Piers Anthony
> 
>                 If I Pay Thee Not In Gold (1993)
>                 (Baen: US PB 0 671 87623 6)
> .... "
> 
> The guy can't be all bad if _SHE_ choses to work with him. Anyone
> read this?
> 
> ciao ciao
> 
> Debbi
> 
> ********************************************************************
> ****** *      Pets are always a great help in times of stress. And
> in times of   * *                        starvation too, o'course.  
>                      * *                       Terry Pratchett,
> Small Gods                       *
> ********************************************************************
> ******
> 
I haerd somethig about I pay thee not in silver too.


David Ramsden - Avalon-+AT+-post.dungeon.com
----------------------------------------
Bishop:  I can promise that in this other world, there is 
       hope.  Hope that by working hard enough and 
       reaching far enough others like us can someday rid
       the world of the fear and predjudice and hatred
       that claimed this one.
Illyana:   Then I'd rather have - hope than nothing at 
        all.

                       - from X-men Omega

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 18:23:18 +0000
From: "David Ramsden" <avalon-+AT+-post.dungeon.com>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: re: Eastern Empire
Message-ID: <199601121829.SAA17596-+AT+-gate.dungeon.com>


> Now that you mention it, somewhere it *does* say that Ma'ar had some
> permanent Gates, but I *definitely* remember it being stated that
> permanent Gates were Urtho's own private innovation (one that he
> didn't even teach to his own mages.. or couldn't perhaps since they
> were only Adepts and both Ma'ar and Urtho were Sorceror-Adepts /
> Adepts++).
> 
I thought sorceror-adepts were those that could create new life 
forms, much like healer adepts were mages that could heal.  A 
different form of adept , rarer than healer adepts, but not 
necassarily more powerful.


David Ramsden - Avalon-+AT+-post.dungeon.com
----------------------------------------
Bishop:  I can promise that in this other world, there is 
       hope.  Hope that by working hard enough and 
       reaching far enough others like us can someday rid
       the world of the fear and predjudice and hatred
       that claimed this one.
Illyana:   Then I'd rather have - hope than nothing at 
        all.

                       - from X-men Omega

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 10:34:52 -0800 (PST)
From: McCaffrey's White Dragon <gipple-+AT+-clark.edu>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: Firesong---> illustrations
Message-ID: <Pine.HPP.3.91.960112103058.13919B-100000-+AT+-clark.edu>

On Fri, 12 Jan 1996, Becky Anne Christensen wrote:

> 
> 
> On Thu, 11 Jan 1996, James T. Yardley wrote:
> 
> > >>Side note: Is there anyone else who didn't like the picture of Firesong
> > towards the end of SR as a limp-wristed effeminate? (I assume it's Firesong
> > though the chapter pics were only loosely related to the chapter they
> > prefaced..)<<
> > 
> > illustrations of people.  i would rather have the pictures that i come up with
> > in my head (which admittedly are rather nebulous) than someone else's ideas of
> > what people look like.  somehow i have found very few pictures that actually
> > correspond to my ideas.  does anyone else have this problem?
> > 
> > - Meg
> 	Exactly! I always thought that they didn't look quite right. I 
> much prefer to visualize them myself. Somehow seeing the pictures in 
> the book destroy my image, and I'm left with a cross between my image and 
> the books, it's not a pretty picture.
> 
> 							(:*BECKY*:)
> 


	Actually, I like the pictures. Admittedly they don't coincide with 
the pictures (nebulous as they are) in my head. That, however, is not a 
problem for me because I really don't associate the pictures with the 
characters and in a minute or two I'm back to my original image. I just 
appreciate the artwork for itself, not what it's supposed to be.

    ________________	Insanity takes it's toll.  ________________
   |\________________\      <gipple-+AT+-clark.edu>    |\________________\
   ||                | Jake Gipple (360)-887-3676 ||                |
   ||   PEAT MOSS    |  Please have exact change  ||  REPEAT MOSS   |
   \|________________|       when replying.       \|________________|
 		     a.k.a. McCaffrey's White Dragon
 			
			|\_____/|    Pete
 			 >0   0<      the
 			 )  V  (    AMAZING
 			(  ___  )  E-mailing
 			=||===||=     OWL!
 
 




------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 10:36:56 -0800 (PST)
From: McCaffrey's White Dragon <gipple-+AT+-clark.edu>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: YKYBRTMMLW (wow, this really is getting off-thread ;)
Message-ID: <Pine.HPP.3.91.960112103537.13919C-100000-+AT+-clark.edu>

On Fri, 12 Jan 1996, Becky Anne Christensen wrote:

> 
> 
> > > <munch, chomp, nibble>
> > > 
> > > > > > THOK! <the sound of a ripe coconut hitting the back of Jaguar's head at 
> > > > > > high velocity>.
> > > > > > <Innocently> Who me, no I didn't do it...
> > > > > It's those damn swallows again..
> > > > > 
> > > > > Kerry.
> > > > 
> > > > An African or European swallow?
> > > > 
> > > > Hmm. . . I wonder if this carboard box will protect me. . .
> > > > *sticks head out*
> > > > Piers Anthony!
> > > > *ducks back inside the box*
> > > 
> > > <Thokokokokokokthokthok> (The sound of about a ton of Homeing Coconuts 
> > > smashing into Alex's cardboard bomb shelter.)
> > > 
> > > Take that!
> > > 
> > > --Gyrfalcon
> > 
> >        I must object to the outright disregard to the rights of the 
> > coconuts! They have feelings to!! Join me in my SAVE THE COCONUTS 
> > CRUSADE you never know we might just find the Holy Grail as well. And 
> > in couldn't be an African swallow, they're non-migratory you know!
> >                  -Yossarian
> > 
> 	She's a witch! BURN HER! Burn the witch! She turned me into a newt!
> BURN THE WITCH!
> 
> 								(:*BECKY*:)
> 


	Funny, you don't LOOK like a newt!

    ________________	Insanity takes it's toll.  ________________
   |\________________\      <gipple-+AT+-clark.edu>    |\________________\
   ||                | Jake Gipple (360)-887-3676 ||                |
   ||   PEAT MOSS    |  Please have exact change  ||  REPEAT MOSS   |
   \|________________|       when replying.       \|________________|
 		     a.k.a. McCaffrey's White Dragon
 			
			|\_____/|    Pete
 			 >0   0<      the
 			 )  V  (    AMAZING
 			(  ___  )  E-mailing
 			=||===||=     OWL!
 
 




------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 13:43:54 -0500 (EST)
From: EGLESTON-+AT+-GROVER.BPL.ORG
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: heralds and justice
Message-ID: <960112134354.465e-+AT+-GROVER.BPL.ORG>

Seanna started the notion by wincing at the thought of Heralds being
legislator, judge, and executor, and AliFarr protested that Heralds
dispense justice on a smaller scale, by ascertaining the truth directly
from the minds of the accused and the victim, and then ended by saying
that if we had Heralds here we could take back the streets.

(I either have to learn how to snip or start using smaller sentences! :-))

    But the Heralds haven't taken back the streets of Valdemar, not
even of Haven!  Why should Skif be afraid to let Talia go into the
rough quarter?  Thievery, abuse, even murder are still problems in
Talia's time.  Look at how she counsels An'desha in SW about how people
let their tempers get the best of them with murderous results, whether
or not they have mage skills.  (Woops, no, that was Elspeth, I think.)

   Valdemar is *big*.  If Pony Express Riders could cover 70 miles a 
day with fresh ponies every so often, Companions can probably do the
same at the run, and yet in the stories again and again it takes a 
Herald a lot of time to get from place A to place B, even when they
are in a hurry.  And there aren't that many Heralds.  

   No, *sigh* even if we did have people with Herald like skills, at
the same proportion of the population, I'm afraid that "taking back
the streets" would still be up to ordinary folks like me and you.

Yoicks! and Away!

Cindy

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 10:42:46 -0800 (PST)
From: McCaffrey's White Dragon <gipple-+AT+-clark.edu>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: YKYBRTMMLW (wow, this really is gett (fwd)
Message-ID: <Pine.HPP.3.91.960112104145.13919D-100000-+AT+-clark.edu>

On Fri, 12 Jan 1996, Becky Anne Christensen wrote:

> 
> 
> On Thu, 11 Jan 1996, L ESCHWIE wrote:
> 
> > >If you break your coconut in half, you got yourself a horse! 
> > >Maybe if you found a white coconut, you could kinda pretend it was a 
> > 
> > >Companion, you would have to be utterly psycho though.
> > 
> > 							(:*BECKY*:)
> > 
> > *Silverstorm ponders the appearance of a white coconut before 
> > disolving into gales of laughter*
> > 
> > 
> 	Well, it takes imagination, and you do have to be slightly psycho 
> to ride a coconut. But if you have a very active imagination.....
> 
> 							(:*BECKY*:)
> 
> 

	Actually, if you just had someone following you around with the 
coconut....

    ________________	Insanity takes it's toll.  ________________
   |\________________\      <gipple-+AT+-clark.edu>    |\________________\
   ||                | Jake Gipple (360)-887-3676 ||                |
   ||   PEAT MOSS    |  Please have exact change  ||  REPEAT MOSS   |
   \|________________|       when replying.       \|________________|
 		     a.k.a. McCaffrey's White Dragon
 			
			|\_____/|    Pete
 			 >0   0<      the
 			 )  V  (    AMAZING
 			(  ___  )  E-mailing
 			=||===||=     OWL!
 
 




------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 18:43:31 +0000
From: "David Ramsden" <avalon-+AT+-post.dungeon.com>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: (Fwd) Bardic Voices vs Valdemar
Message-ID: <199601121845.SAA18246-+AT+-gate.dungeon.com>



Does anyone out there in Lackey land prefer the Bardic Voices books to
the Velgrath ones?  

Also what are the Bard's Tale and Wing Commander novels by Misty like?




David Ramsden - Avalon-+AT+-post.dungeon.com
----------------------------------------
Bishop:  I can promise that in this other world, there is 
       hope.  Hope that by working hard enough and 
       reaching far enough others like us can someday rid
       the world of the fear and predjudice and hatred
       that claimed this one.
Illyana:   Then I'd rather have - hope than nothing at 
        all.

                       - from X-men Omega

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 18:43:31 +0000
From: "David Ramsden" <avalon-+AT+-post.dungeon.com>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: (Fwd) Evil, ambition, sanity
Message-ID: <199601121845.SAA18248-+AT+-gate.dungeon.com>

Is there anyone on here who belives, like me, that evil  ambition and
insanity are related but totally different things?




David Ramsden - Avalon-+AT+-post.dungeon.com
----------------------------------------
Bishop:  I can promise that in this other world, there is 
       hope.  Hope that by working hard enough and 
       reaching far enough others like us can someday rid
       the world of the fear and predjudice and hatred
       that claimed this one.
Illyana:   Then I'd rather have - hope than nothing at 
        all.

                       - from X-men Omega

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 10:49:56 -0800 (PST)
From: CHONNI <k_moll-+AT+-cariboo.bc.ca>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: illustrations
Message-ID: <Pine.PMDF.3.91.960112104745.539021502C-100000-+AT+-cariboo.bc.ca>

Okay, everyone has been arguing over how bad Larry's people have been, 
and I'll admit, his ideas of masculine beauty are NOT mine.  One problem: 
It came out in Queen's Own that Larry has been co-writing most of the 
books with Misty, so technically he has the right to choose how the 
characters look.  Any comments???



***********************************************************************
*   Why would I want my mind back?  Who knows where it's been!        *
*---------------------------------------------------------------------*
********************* Herald Chonni Brightwolf*************************


------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 10:58:38 -0800 (PST)
From: CHONNI <k_moll-+AT+-cariboo.bc.ca>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: re: Eastern Empire (+changing philosophies)
Message-ID: <Pine.PMDF.3.91.960112105025.539021502D-100000-+AT+-cariboo.bc.ca>

On Fri, 12 Jan 1996, Sanna Koulu wrote:

> Mannaheim wrote:
> 
> > On Wed, 10 Jan 1996, David J. De Riemacker wrote:
> >
> > >   I always got the impression that the Eastern Empire was founded by
> > > Urtho's people.  They are the self-described masters of Gate technology,  and
> > > they also have permanent Gates(IIRC).  Along with that, wasn't there something
> > > in the Storms books about the founders of the EE coming out of a Gate in the
> > > wrong place. 
> >   
> > What strikes me at first is the way that [the Eastern Empire] treats 
> > [its] people.  
> > Ruthlessly.  Charliss is quite evil, and will stop at nothing to get what 
> > he wants.  To me, this is not the way of the people that followed Urtho, 
> > although they might have changed over the centuries.  Still, I don't 
> > think it's Urthos people who founded the Eastern Empire.
I'm on the side that believes it was Urtho's people who founded the EE, 
if that includes the mercenaries he hired, who would not necessarily be 
his ethical soulmates.  Charliss is quite evil, I agree, but the 
aristocracy and the bureaucracy have gotten to the point where nothing 
else is possible.  And as for how the EE treats its people, I'm not 
completely sure what's wrong with it; I don't mean the conquering bit, 
but the laws they have to maintain order.  Its very Heilein-eque, and as 
plausible as any other societal organization.

> 
> Actually, I don't think the Eastern Empire is exactly evil. I think 
> it's a close approximation of the Roman empire. The EE is certainly 
> closer to real-world nations than Valdemar (for good or for ill :). 
> It's not so cutesy-pretty. <evil grin>
Na- the romans would never of thought of punishing rapists; after all, 
their victims are only women, after all...  I can't think of a single 
real world society that uses people's concerns about money to govern them 
so completely.



***********************************************************************
*   Why would I want my mind back?  Who knows where it's been!        *
*---------------------------------------------------------------------*
********************* Herald Chonni Brightwolf*************************



------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 13:31:02 -0500 (EST)
From: EGLESTON-+AT+-GROVER.BPL.ORG
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: New Thread: Charachters
Message-ID: <960112133102.465e-+AT+-GROVER.BPL.ORG>

Mannaheim has offered to compile lists of charachters.  I say, go for it,
but don't forget that Firebird is about to come out with concordances.
You may want to check their catalog to avoid duplicating effort.  (Or
get the concordances and enjoy the fun of finding what they missed.
Most reffie books get _something_ wrong!)

What I'm trying to put together is a list of Companion's names.  Does
anyone know what Roald's Companion's name is?  

Yoicks! and Away!

Cindy

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 13:25:39 -0500 (EST)
From: EGLESTON-+AT+-GROVER.BPL.ORG
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: UK vs. US editions
Message-ID: <960112132539.465e-+AT+-GROVER.BPL.ORG>

Jerry, on 11 Jan 96, said:
  "For some strange reason, US covers usually look nicer than the UK ones,
but (in general) UK books seem to use higher quality materials. (and
cost two or three times as much, mutter mutter...)"

   The US publishers don't expect a book to last, don't want it to last, (so 
you'll have to buy another copy), and don't have any group which pushes
them to make the book to last.  There used to be a group which set binding
standards for children's books, but for most publishers, I have to order
those bindings in particular (and usually at higher cost.)  

   But if you think that's bad, back in the early eighties I went to 
England with my sister and picked up a bunch of books, including a TV tie-in
which adapted the tv show where Bigfoot met the Six Million Dollar Man 
(yeah, but I was _much_ younger then!)  I had the US edition at home.
Same author, mind you, same story, and the UK edition had 70 more pages,
with more complicated sentences.  (The first paragraph in the UK edition
was somewhere in the area of 15 words longer.)

  I try to get UK editions whenever I can!

Yoicks! and Away!

Cindy

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 13:58:32 -0500 (EST)
From: EGLESTON-+AT+-GROVER.BPL.ORG
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: role-playing games (off subject)
Message-ID: <960112135832.465e-+AT+-GROVER.BPL.ORG>

James T. Yardley wrote: "I personally wouldn't know a role-playing game
if it jumped up and bit me..." and then asked for enlightenment.
Foolish mortal!

There are many kinds of role-playing games, but the one most people
are referring to is really just a grown up version of "Let's pretend"
with a few -- or far too many -- rules thrown in to keep people from
arguing about who's dead.  My favorite is the Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay
system, from the UK, but it is hard to find because the company has
gone over into mostly miniatures wargames.

One person is the game-master, and they have to be all the monsters,
non-player characters, merchants, etc.  Everyone else pretends to
be a character.  (Hey!  Can I bring my elf in on this campaign?)
Over time, your characters can develop a lot, or get killed off a lot
depending on the GM.  Most colleges have roleplaying groups, so they
are a good place to look for one, but I warn you, some GMs and groups
can be pretty ... focussed on treasure and monsters, while other groups
are far more into character development.  I prefer the latter, and my
group has been known to spend an entire three hour session in the market
buying armor!

There aren't any role-playing games for Misty's worlds right now.  HEr
agent has been vigilant about cutting off any unauthorized versions,
but, as far as I can see, not very diligent about finding someone to
create a legitimate version!  I'd like to see a game set in the reign
of one of the Monarchs we've never heard about.  That would make it safe
to assume the rules we know from the books, but would ensure that the
characters we used are new.

Yoicks! and Away!

Cindy

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 11:42:42 -0800 (PST)
From: "Patrick S. Waterlander" <patw-+AT+-clark.edu>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: RE: Makaar
Message-ID: <Pine.HPP.3.91.960112113708.22179A-100000-+AT+-clark.edu>

On Fri, 12 Jan 1996, Sanna Koulu wrote:

> Kerry wrote:
>  [in response to StarWolf's (?) thought experiment with Ma'ar being a 
> "good guy"] 
> 
> > And as I said elsewhere, Ma'ar only cared about people as possessions..
> > Look at the way Firesong starts reacting in SR and you'll get a glimpse
> > of the way Ma'ar must have thought.
> 
> Hmm? Did you mean that Firesong reacts the same way Ma'ar did, and 
> possibly for the same reasons? An interesting thought. I thought 
> Firesong's insanity (warpedness) just randomly happened to be alike 
> Ma'ar's. I'd say the reasons are totally different... Opinions?
> 
>       
>                                          -Seanna 
> 
>
Well...this was the thread I was hoping wouldn't come up until everyone 
had read Storm Rising, but since i's out I guess I can say it.  Part of 
Firesongs warping of his attitude is due to the mage storms, which are 
warping the land.  Since he is a healing Adept of the land, this affects 
him.  Also, he had become used to having An'desha depend on him.  When 
An'desha began to pull away, it made him VERY angry and upset, and he 
blamed Karal (the karsite secretary of Ulrich, later becoming the 
ambassador himself) for An'desha becoming more independant.  When you do 
read Storm Rising there is several instances in which Firesong does NOT 
act like a Tayledras Healing Adept, and acts more like a slightly psycho 
spoiled brat, and he does and thinks some very scary things.  But I'll 
leave that alone until you've read the book.
							-Declan

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 11:34:08 -0800 (PST)
From: McCaffrey's White Dragon <gipple-+AT+-clark.edu>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: Too Much Misty & Queens Own
Message-ID: <Pine.HPP.3.91.960112105217.13919E-100000-+AT+-clark.edu>

On Fri, 12 Jan 1996, Sanna Koulu wrote:

> AliFarr wrote:
> 
> > "Sanna Koulu" <SKOULU-+AT+-otdk.helsinki.fi>wrote:
> > 
> > >... I think it's been mentioned that Valdemar has 
> > >judges and magistrates (or something that serves those functions). 
> > >Montesquieu would have a fit at Valdemar's government otherwise 
> > >(Think about it: the same group of people makes the laws, enforces 
> > >them, and passes sentences <wince>.)
> > 
> > No, Not wince.  The point of being a Herald and able to dispense justice, is
> > that you can find the perpatrator, ascertain the truth directly from the
> > minds of the accused and victim, detemine if they truly are insane (as in
> > deranged minds - not just so cruel and evil that any moral person would see
> > their acts as insane)

	Actually, I believe you are referring to the 'truth spell' which is 
actually one of a group of magical creatures which perform services, 
among them the truth spell, in exchange for a steady supply energy from 
the Valdemaran Heartstone.
 
> 
> > No need for juries that can be swayed, appeals by the
> > not so innocent acclaiming they are innocent, and there goes the biggest
> > argument against the death penalty; accidently executing an innocent person..
> 
> Also, we have laws that guarantee us immunity of the body. The 
> requirements for the police right to body-search and strict. How much 
> more sacrosanct should our minds be?  The Herald can't just go around 
> raping away people's thoughts. 

As I pointed out, the heralds don't actually invade their minds, they use 
a magical entity which either ascertains the truth of the person's 
statement (the ultimate lie-detector) or forces the person to speak only 
the truth (much more effective than any oath "so help you God" or "under 
threat of purgery"). Heralds, for the most part, have a strong moral 
aversion to invading another's mind without their permission, and they, 
again for the most part, would only do so if an extreme situation 
demanded it (same as a deep body cavity check).

> 
> About death penalty: I've argued about this, a lot, with my friends. 
> I'd say that the risk of executing the wrong person is a real-world 
> reason against it. However, I don't think 40 years in jail is a much 
> better option. Thus we might discuss the question whether, in an 
> optimal world, death penalty would be just. Should someone who kills 
> be killed himself? That is the primary question.

IMHO, I would suggest that whatever sentance would normally be passed 
could be lessened or waived if the perpetrator voluntarily submits to 
being scanned with the intent to actually 'fix' whatever the problem 
might be, even to the point of severely altering the person's personality.
Again, just IMHO.

>  
> > Note that Circuit Heralds did not handle  large scale justice - as in the
> > town caught cheating on their taxes.  But I would still expect that a Herald
> > would accompany the Guard and whoever came to investigate, to ascertain who
> > was really guilty.
> 
> Of course, Heralds would be great as investigators. (Though note 
> the reasons against it)

<insert above points as counter-points>

> It's just that their acting as judges is a gross miscarriage of 
> justice.
> 

I'd have to say it could use a little work, but, IMHO, not as much as you 
think.

> 
> 
>                                           -Seanna 
>                                           

    ________________	Insanity takes it's toll.  ________________
   |\________________\      <gipple-+AT+-clark.edu>    |\________________\
   ||                | Jake Gipple (360)-887-3676 ||                |
   ||   PEAT MOSS    |  Please have exact change  ||  REPEAT MOSS   |
   \|________________|       when replying.       \|________________|
 		     a.k.a. McCaffrey's White Dragon
 			
			|\_____/|    Pete
 			 >0   0<      the
 			 )  V  (    AMAZING
 			(  ___  )  E-mailing
 			=||===||=     OWL!
 
 





------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 15:10:41 -0500 (EST)
From: Rosario Holsen-Baker <rholsen-+AT+-sidwell.edu>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: FW: Re: YKYBRTMMLW: 
Message-ID: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960112150927.28671A-100000-+AT+-gateway.us.sidwell.edu>

> Lots of people wrote: 
> > >> >     Hey, no fair! That was supposed to be a MAGICAL attack!
> > >> >     And where are the sparrows?
> > >> > > 
> > >> > > --Gyfalcon
> > >> > 
> > >>       African or European?
> > >> 
> > >>                                               (:*BECKY*:)
> > >> A-HA...and other exclamations of great glee and jubilation..I sense a fellow Monty 
> > >> Python fan in the ranks.....glad to know I'm not alone (: 
> > >> Fiona
> > >But then again, if she's lighter than the duck, does that mean she's a 
> > >witch?
> > >
> > >(Monty Python fan waving from the ranks) (wave wave)
> > >                                                -Mannaheim
> > >
> > Doesn't matter--anybody comes near me, and I'll bite their kneecaps!
> > (wave wave)
> > Kaatje
> > 
> 	*NICHT*! Don't mess with me, or I'll say *Nicht* ha-ha-ha!
> 
> 						(:*BECKY*:)
	It it it it it it it it it it it it it.........it!

|--------------------------------<<JAGUAR>>------------------------------|
|    He screams and screams and pounds his head against the wall until   |
|            wailing phantom firetrucks paces across his vision.         |
|   PAIN. PAIN IS ALL HE WANTS: We shall never forget and never forgive. |
|  			AND NEVER EVER FEAR				 |
|FEAR IS FOR THE ENEMY				   FEAR AND BULLETS	 |
|------------------------------------------------------------------------|
			


------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 17:05:04 -0400 (EDT)
From: Mat Timmerman <ACCMJT-+AT+-vaxc.hofstra.edu>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: illustrations
Message-ID: <01HZXI3PPEUA91WLFG-+AT+-vaxc.hofstra.edu>

From: mealink-+AT+-syd.au.swissbank.com (Kerry Mealing)
>
>Oh yes! Jodi lee's Vanyel _is_ Vanyel. Brook no rivals.
>
Except that on the cover of Magic's Price, Vanyel's hair should have
been white.  Node-magic, you know.

Mat 
accmjt-+AT+-vaxc.hofstra.edu
http://ada.hofstra.edu/~mtimme47/

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 17:08:13 -0400 (EDT)
From: Mat Timmerman <ACCMJT-+AT+-vaxc.hofstra.edu>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: Just saying Hi and wondering.
Message-ID: <01HZXI5KHPMW91WLFG-+AT+-vaxc.hofstra.edu>

From: dbackhau-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl
>
>And on a "P. Anthony" (shoulders rise defensively, furtive looks around
>the room) note - lookee what I came across when sifting through the
>FAQ pages on the Archives 
>
>"Other collaborations:
>
>        with Piers Anthony
>
>                If I Pay Thee Not In Gold (1993)
>                (Baen: US PB 0 671 87623 6)
>.... "
>
>The guy can't be all bad if _SHE_ choses to work with him. Anyone read this?
                                                                             
It's not too bad. IIRC, she didn't actually work with him.  I read 
somewhere on the 'Net that it was a plot that PA has sitting around,
but didn't have time to write.  He created the characters and the whole 
story.  I think Misty just wrote the actual dialogue and other words.

Mat

--

Mat Timmerman                "They want to stop the ones who want       
accmjt-+AT+-hofstra.edu            prosthetic foreheads on their heads.  But 
mtimmerman1-+AT+-hofstra.edu       everybody wants prosthetic foreheads on   
mtimme47-+AT+-magic.hofstra.edu    their real heads."  -- They Might Be Giants  
	          http://ada.hofstra.edu/~mtimme47/


------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 14:11:11 -0800 (PST)
From: "Patrick S. Waterlander" <patw-+AT+-clark.edu>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: re- myriad subjects
Message-ID: <Pine.HPP.3.91.960112141023.4405A-100000-+AT+-clark.edu>

On Fri, 12 Jan 1996, Sanna Koulu wrote:

> Becky wrote:
>  
> > On Thu, 11 Jan 1996, Ashke wrote:
> > > [Becky wrote:]
> > >
> > > > Urtho also doesn't seem like the kind of person that would 
> > > > take someone's body over like Maar did.
> > > > 
> > > But what about good old fashioned reincarnation???? There werent 
> > > companions back then for good men to come back as. And Firesong evin 
> > > mentions reincarnation in SR.
> >
> >     Well, I guess that could be possible, but I like to think that 
> > there are lots of truly good forces, not just a couple that keep coming 
> > back. It makes it seem more important somehow. I probably don't make any 
> > sense though do I?
> 
> Actually, you do. Also, I totally agree. Should we have a vote on 
> this list on who Urtho reincarnated to (Van, Firesong or no one?) 
> <smile>
> 
> 
>                                                  -Seanna
>  
> 
> 
Yes! Lets.  I agree.  I shall cast the first vote.  I think Urtho was 
reincarnated as both Vanyel AND Firesong.  Anyone else?
							-Declan


------------------------------

End of MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 313
*********************************