MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 468 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: re gays by mrtmh-+AT+-primenet.com (Lady 'Reesa And Tina) 2) Re: reading speed (fairly off-topic) by Chris Parmenter 3) A Bookstore by Chris Parmenter 4) Re: Men in power by "Seanna" 5) Re: Lyrics by "Seanna" 6) Re: Rolan by be248-+AT+-scn.org (SCN User) 7) ADMIN: let me repeat this, once more, with feeling. by mel (Melanie Dymond Harper) 8) Re: Talamir- Previous Queen's Own by mel (Melanie Dymond Harper) 9) Re: People names (was re:companion names) by Catherine Osborne 10) Katherine Kurtz by Catherine Osborne 11) Re: Lyrics by Rosario Holsen-Baker 12) Re: warnings by Rosario Holsen-Baker 13) Re: Men in power by Catherine Osborne 14) Re: Stef's duties was re: Companion-names (fwd) by Wildfire 15) The Last Unicorn by "Jill" 16) candlemark/watermark/hour by EGLESTON-+AT+-bpl.org 17) RE: Talia's shielding by EGLESTON-+AT+-bpl.org 18) Re: A Bookstore by Mark Mains 19) Re: DUMB QUESTION/Please be kind by LSFG20A-+AT+-prodigy.com (MS KIM H MILLER) 20) Re: Men in power by EGLESTON-+AT+-bpl.org 21) Re: Greeting by Tensen 22) Re: Mage of Green Silences where are you by LSFG20A-+AT+-prodigy.com (MS KIM H MILLER) 23) multi-task hel by ROZANM-+AT+-webster.nl (Rozanna McNeer) 24) Candlemark thread by Tensen 25) Re: Harmless Valgarth??? by ROZANM-+AT+-webster.nl (Rozanna McNeer) 26) Re: Men in power (was Re: Root of lesbian) by Tammy Harris 27) Re: warnings by Mannaheim 28) Re: Talia's shielding by Mannaheim 29) Re: Skif's gifts by Mannaheim ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 9 Apr 1996 19:23:32 -0700 (MST) From: mrtmh-+AT+-primenet.com (Lady 'Reesa And Tina) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: re gays Message-ID: <199604100223.TAA22448-+AT+-usr4.primenet.com> >ObMisty: There are songs in Valdemar, but is there poetry? > >Becky > > I distinctly (Or is that di-stink-tly?) remember Eldan telling Kero that he used to write bad poetry, but he stopped. It probably had something to do with the sword levelled at his heart... (Was that a case for GDRANFLTNT? McCaffrey's White? You be the judge!) ~~~~~~~~~~Lady 'Reesa~~~~~~~~~~mrtmh-+AT+-primenet.com~~~~~~~~~~~) "In a way, Sam had been like the clothes he'd worn; all ) one color on the surface, pure evil at first glance...but ) that shadow was supported and held together by a ) thousand other patches that made him what he was...a ) thousand shades of grey and a cluster of patches of ) rainbow, covered unfairly by the blanket definition of evil" ) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 13:02:12 +1030 From: Chris Parmenter To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: reading speed (fairly off-topic) Message-ID: <316B1DAC.1503-+AT+-academy.net.au> I remember reading very early, and I also remember reading an article in the newspaper about a boy my age (4) who was kidnapped and murdered. That's probably when I decided that places like Narnia were safer. When I was 11 I discovered that Hienlien wrote more than just teenage space books, and started on Methusalah's Children, which led me into his older books and the first mention of homosexuality I had found up to that point. I think these books helped me feel okay about sex, and by the time I reached puberty, I had a lot of info but veeeerrrrryyy little experience. -- XXXXX XXXXX XXXXX XXX XXXXX XXXXX XXXXX XXXXX X X X X X X X X X X X X X X XXXXX X XX X XXXXX X XXXXX X X X X X X X X X X X X X X X X XXXXX XXXXX XXX XXXXX X XXXXX X ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 13:30:31 +1030 From: Chris Parmenter To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: A Bookstore Message-ID: <316B244F.75DA-+AT+-academy.net.au> I go into the local bookshop. 'Have you got the latest Robert Jordan?' 'Basketball books are over there.' 'What about a new Mercedes Lackey?' 'Do you want books on Motor Cars?' 'Where are the Tolkien books?' 'In the Science Fiction section, of course. He hasn't written anything lately, has he?' 'Are there any more books like The Ship Who Sang?' 'The Ship That Sank? Do you want the Titanic or the Lusitania?' What is going on here? Do bookshops only hire people who don't read? -- XXXXX XXXXX XXXXX XXX XXXXX XXXXX XXXXX XXXXX X X X X X X X X X X X X X X XXXXX X XX X XXXXX X XXXXX X X X X X X X X X X X X X X X X XXXXX XXXXX XXX XXXXX X XXXXX X ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 09:27:03 EET DST From: "Seanna" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Men in power Message-ID: <14848EF3C0D-+AT+-otdk.helsinki.fi> Tammy wrote: > On Tue, April 9, Cennydd wrote: > > > > Maybe just a hint of sexism in Misty's books? She never has > > men in position of power unless they are villains. Even Daren is clearly > > not constructed in the text as a powerful figure. [examples snipped] > Umm Cennydd, I hate to point out the obvious, but aren't you > forgetting Vanyel?!! And Tremane ain't such a bad guy, once you get > to know him. Also, Ulrich. I'd consider some of the senior Heralds > to have some power, such as Elcarth, Kyril, Teren, Alberich. Not > rulers, but leaders of people none the less. That's true, though the case could be made that they aren't in _positions of power_ - what power they have stems from their gifts, wisdom etc etc. Actually, I do think there's a hint (or more) of sexism in ML's books: namely, why are the evil ones always male? And yes, there's probably examples to the contrary (starting with that girl in AFlight, and probably a few of the S&S stories, and the hand-maidens in Burning Water..) but still, think about it. It may not seem like sexism at first, but it is. Victim feminism vs. power feminism debate springs to mind.. -Seanna ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 11:58:40 EET DST From: "Seanna" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Lyrics Message-ID: <14ACFDB2618-+AT+-otdk.helsinki.fi> Should have guessed (heck, I _did_) that this would ruffle some feathers..:) Sorry for not trimming more, but I don't want everybody (including me :) to get confused. Cindy wrote: > The Shadow-lover argued (and then recanted later) that Tarma and Kethry > were lovers. Seanna has suggested that Kal'enedral have given up sexual > desire rather than sexual acts (under which she includes hugging, touching > and cuddling) and says "Therefore I think Tarma and Keth might well have > shared activities we'd call sexual, although the passion was absent (on > Tarma's side). Actually, I'd like to think they were lovers." > > I doubt it. First of all, Keth never seemed to me to be the sort of persn > who could have fun taking advantage of somebody who was just lying around > like a piece of meat to be used. (Okay, that's a little strong, but I > very firmly feel that if both parties aren't having fun, it might be sex > but it sure ain't love.) Very true. My point being that Tarma & Keth could _both_ have enjoyed themselves. See later in this post. > Second of all, since when is a desire for touch, > a hug, or a cuddle a *sexual* desire? You can be physically close to > someone -- allow a person into your immediate personal space -- without > being physically intimate -- involved on a hormonal/sexual level. No, it isn't, I agree. Allowing people into your personal space can be done because 1) you have to - in a crowded bus for example 2) for mating purposes - hard to beget children otherwise 3) because it feels good to be physically close to someone with whom you are also emotionally close. I think that 3) reason is absolutely necessary for love-making. Otherwise, it's just sex. Sex and love-making are not the same thing; sex requires passion (sexual desire, horniness etc) but not (emotional) closeness. Love-making requires closeness but not passion. > Maybe I just have a different viewpoint because the person that I love > more than anyone but my immediate family is the same gender as I am, but > we are both, unmistakeably, heterosexual. If we haven't gotten into a > passionate embrace by now, I don't think we're ever likely to. And yet, > we hug, we touch. > And I cuddle with my nieces and nephews, especially on cold days, when > we are enjoying watching something. Does that make me a pederast? No. Pederasty's _sexual_ activity (feelings) towards children. People I hug, touch, am physically close to include my mother and 2 cats. It's not a question of sex, it's about love. To love is to want to touch - physically, mentally, spiritually or what-have-you. Nothing perverse about it. And yes, I can distinguish between passion & non-sexual closeness. I think the distinction's important. Of course, that's just MNSHO. :) > Tarma does not feel sexual desire. Kethry does. But horniness is not > an excuse for Kethry to use Tarma to achieve sexual relief. Let's face it > folks, unless you're feeling (ahem) involved, most sexual acts are -- well -- > icky. Well, if Tarma agreed, I don't think _we_ have anything to complain about . OTOH, my definition of acts that can, in some instances, be sexual is fairly loose. > (Okay, I think I've officially reached "ranting" here. *sigh* No offense > meant.) No offense taken. I've had reason to think about it lately.. -Seanna ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Apr 1996 21:35:00 -0700 From: be248-+AT+-scn.org (SCN User) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Rolan Message-ID: <199604100435.VAA02577-+AT+-scn.org> >> Khenta wrote re: rehashing Talia's Gifts: >> >> > But why didn't Rolan choose to mindspeak to Talia more often, resp at >> > all? Seems kind of annoying to me, if he had the ability and didn't use >> > it for good. Receiving this kind of emotional support may sometimes be >> > comforting or whatever, but maybe direct advice could have been more >> > helpful at times. Rather than the other popular theories about Rolan's choice not to Mindspeak Talia, I think it comes from the doctrine that is expressed in those books. The specific incident that comes to mind is between Kris and Tantris when IIRC Kris asks Tantris why he didn't prevent him from making a fool of himself and Tantris said that the Companions weren't their Herald's keepers or parents, but rather their friends. It also occurs to me that one of the things prized in Valdemar is independance. If Rolan had Mindspoke to Talia without her having that Gift, it would be compromising her independence and giving her a crutch to lean on, rather than coping with it by herself. Don't know if this made much sense. Just my thoughts... Zhai'helleva Herald Briana -- Herald Briana Kestyl For some reason I never had any trouble Lady In Green figuring out what death was all wc814-+AT+-freenet.victoria about; but life - that's taken be248-+AT+-scn.org me until now. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 10:39:57 +0100 From: mel (Melanie Dymond Harper) To: mercedes-lackey Subject: ADMIN: let me repeat this, once more, with feeling. Message-ID: <9604100939.AA11070-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk> No. Chain. Letters. I really mean this. Mel. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 12:06:42 +0100 From: mel (Melanie Dymond Harper) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Talamir- Previous Queen's Own Message-ID: <9604101106.AA17050-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk> Lady Moonsong said: > On page 194 of AOTQ when Keren, Teren, and Talia were talking about Talamir > Keren said, "Grandfather used to claim he never knew what he was going to say > to the King beforehand, yet it was always exactly the right thing."- end > quote. A little while back in the book it said that Rolan took 2 months to > choose Talia after Talamir but wouldn't Selenay have ruled before than also? > What I'm getting at is that wouldn't Talamir have been advising the QUEEN not > the KING? Did I happen to find a typo or is that supposed to be like that? > Comments? Talamir was old, Selenay was young (there's a quote which mentions this somewhere in the Arrows books; Talamir is reputed to have been embarrassed by having to advise a young woman, which may have been why Selenay made her bad marriage). Therefore it seems likely that Talamir was Monarch's Own to Selenay's father before her. Mel. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 07:29:12 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine Osborne To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: People names (was re:companion names) Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Apr 1996, deanca wrote: > ObMisty: There isn't anyone named James T. Kirk(as far as we know) in > Valdemar Thank god. I\/ Catherine Osborne "After great pain, (who apologizes for the one-liner) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 07:37:11 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine Osborne To: mercedes lackey list Subject: Katherine Kurtz Message-ID: (dons flame-proof suit, just in case) I just picked up her books off the library shelf a few weeks ago, and despite all of my friends' negative reactions, I actually like them ok. They're no Misty, the prose style is more than a little rough and the villains are really laughable, but I *really* like Alaric Morgan. I'm wondering what everyone else thinks of her? Also, does anyone know where I can find a complete and current bibliography? (If there are web sites out there, I haven't been able to find them....) Bye, I\/ Catherine Osborne "After great pain, I\/ Sundancer a formal feeling comes." I cosborne-+AT+-sidwell.edu --Emily Dickinson I http://www.sidwell.edu/~cosborne/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 07:57:07 -0400 (EDT) From: Rosario Holsen-Baker To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Lyrics Message-ID: > How many people had to laugh themselves silly when they realized that Countess > Reine's sister was the one from It was a Dark and Stormy Night? Good song, > Hmmmm...maybe Leslac wrote it! If he did, that would have to be the only decent song he ever wrote. *****LADY JAGUAR***** Leader of the Cat People Lady in Green LGMCB Conspirator #14, DHTBB Lobe #3! "Meddle not in the affairs of cats for you are soft-skinned, and blind at night." ********************* ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 07:59:40 -0400 (EDT) From: Rosario Holsen-Baker To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: warnings Message-ID: Monolith wrote: > Its funny, Mannheim, I just finished reading the second griffin book and > discovered that the main vaillin isn't gay or homophobic... at least not > mostly. He's more like a "normal" hetero-sexual. > I don't know about "normal," but he definitly wasn't homosexual, and there weren't any signs of him being homophobic. My take on it was that he was sort of misogynistic. Or maybe he was just plain insane. *****LADY JAGUAR***** Leader of the Cat People Lady in Green LGMCB Conspirator #14, DHTBB Lobe #3! "Meddle not in the affairs of cats for you are soft-skinned, and blind at night." ********************* ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 08:24:13 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine Osborne To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Men in power Message-ID: On Wed, 10 Apr 1996, Seanna wrote: > Actually, I do think there's a hint (or more) of sexism in ML's > books: namely, why are the evil ones always male? And yes, there's > probably examples to the contrary (starting with that girl in > AFlight, and probably a few of the S&S stories, and the hand-maidens > in Burning Water..) but still, think about it. It may not seem like > sexism at first, but it is. Victim feminism vs. power feminism debate > springs to mind.. Well, I happen to think there is a real problem with most female villains (actually, it's the same problem I have with most female heros): that is, they're all focussed on sex and tend to wear leather, generally red ;) the heros wear blousy white and are focussed on finding a good man. Gael Baudino and Misty are just about the only example I've found of truly good, consistent female heros; as far as female villains, I have yet to see it done well. Yes, I'm including Robert Jordan in that. It drives me nuts that male villains can be going after power alone (or whatever) but female villains are always going after power *and sex*. One of the things that annoyed me about the Katherine Kurtz novels was the way Charissa was having an affair with the *other* villain. In the later books, none of the (male) villains were doing stuff like that! I guess what I'm trying to say in my (rather incoherent) way is that if Misty can't do good female villains, I'd rather have her keep them out of the stories. I\/ Catherine Osborne "After great pain, I\/ Sundancer a formal feeling comes." I cosborne-+AT+-sidwell.edu --Emily Dickinson I http://www.sidwell.edu/~cosborne/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 08:42:14 -0400 (EDT) From: Wildfire To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Stef's duties was re: Companion-names (fwd) Message-ID: Heyla, everyone! I just subscribed to this list yesterday and this is an official delurk. Gods, I've missed discussing my beloved Velgarth world - haven't been able to access the newsgroup for the past year, -+AT+-#$%&! And stupid me, never thought of subscribing to a mailing list till recently... must be getting old... Anyway, since Van and Stef/Lendel are my favorite characters, I thought I'd jump in here...apologies if this has already been discussed before... 1. Does anyone else think it possible that Stef might have regained whatever powers Tylendel had after he died? I know it didn't seem so from WoF but I do so wish that's the case... somehow that feels "right" to me. 2. Same thing with the Companions - Yfandes gets to be with Vanyel forever, but what about Gala? Can't help feeling it's a little unfair on her and Tylendel... So, having wept at the deaths of 'Lendel and Van, I was awfully glad when Misty has them "live on" in Sorrows, but I wish Stef had come back as 'Lendel with all the abilities 'Lendel had, and reunited with Gala. Wind to thy wings, all. Wildfire ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 08:37:12 EDT From: "Jill" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: The Last Unicorn Message-ID: <2265C365C42-+AT+-pub.sbu.edu> > Has anyone seen "The Last Unicorn" recently? And what > about the book? I just borrowed the video from the library >(It was my favorite as a kid) and I was considering reading > the book, but I'd like some reveiws. > You know, I'm amazed at how much better it seems >now. It's almost like watching a totally new movie, but I >know I'm just catching all the "grown-up" stuff that I had >no clue about at seven or eight. Oooh, I LOVED that movie when I was little ... and I still love the book, my copy of which is falling apart. :) I haven't seen the movie is years and years, but the book is worth the read. > As long as I've got your attention, anybody know if >I can get the sound-track? I just love the title song. The >name of the band that did it is/was America, and I heard >somewhere (Where is "somewhere"?) that Peter Beagle had >written them, but then, I could just be making it up in my > more-than-slightly delusional mind... I don't know about America, but Kenny Loggins put out a children's tape called "Return to Pooh Corner" last year, and the title song is on there. :D Yes, I have the tape - it's also got "The Rainbow Connection" and "Somewhere Out There" on it, and I'm just a kid at heart ... Jill Morrison /// morrisjm-+AT+-sbu.edu /// Merlyn3109-+AT+-aol.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- "Lord, what fools these mortals be!" - Puck, "A Midsummer Night's Dream" Act 3, Scene 2, Line 115 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 10:52:20 -0400 (EDT) From: EGLESTON-+AT+-bpl.org To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: candlemark/watermark/hour Message-ID: <960410105220.1f03-+AT+-bpl.org> It may be that Valdemar is in transition from one time system to another over the course of the books we've read. In medieval times, different hours of the day were different lengths, depending on time of year, but that made mechanical clocks and waterclocks incredibly complicated, (Also candle clocks, which burn at a steady rate) and gradually an hour of standard length became the norm. Yoicks! and Away! Cindy (who is groping off into the dim recesses of her mind for info...) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 11:20:32 -0400 (EDT) From: EGLESTON-+AT+-bpl.org To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: RE: Talia's shielding Message-ID: <960410112032.1f03-+AT+-bpl.org> I think when Elcarth taught Talia to shield he was only giving her the "quick and dirty" method because she was still recovering, and wouldn't have had the strength for the kind of "ground and center" tutoring that Kris had to put her through later. He expected Ylsa to do the formal "find your center, find your ground" stuff, but Ylsa probably looked at Talia in class, saw that she was centered and grounded and figured it had been done. (Did Ylsa have Sight? I can't remember.) Anyway, I think Elcarth was less thorough than usual because of Talia's condition. Yoicks! and Away! Cindy ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 11:18:42 -0400 (EDT) From: Mark Mains To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: A Bookstore Message-ID: <199604101518.LAA02147-+AT+-service1.cc.uky.edu> Chris Parmenter wrote: >I go into the local bookshop. >'Have you got the latest Robert Jordan?' >'Basketball books are over there.' >'What about a new Mercedes Lackey?' >'Do you want books on Motor Cars?' >'Where are the Tolkien books?' >'In the Science Fiction section, of course. He hasn't written anything lately, has he?' Obviously, you are going into the wrong bookstore Chris. I work at one and I have read all the books that you mentioned and we have them all in the store (or available for order). In my bookstore, the manager tries to hire a diverse group of people so that each person whom is working has a different specialty...ie romance, self help, religion. Mine happens to be Sci-Fi/RPG/Fantasy. Regular customers who come in know to ask me any questions they have about these areas. Mark Mains mamain01-+AT+-pop.uky.edu ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 11:23:29 EDT From: LSFG20A-+AT+-prodigy.com (MS KIM H MILLER) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: DUMB QUESTION/Please be kind Message-ID: <097.05629468.LSFG20A-+AT+-prodigy.com> I know this is a dumb question, but I'm going to ask anyway. Doesn't Vanyel and Stef come back in one of the newer books? If so, which one? I went back to re-read the series and have found that I'm missing at least 4 books! More if Storm Rising and Storm Breaking have been published. Have they? It looks like a quick trip to the used book store is in order. Thank you, and remember - please be kind! Lady Kim ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 11:30:04 -0400 (EDT) From: EGLESTON-+AT+-bpl.org To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Men in power Message-ID: <960410113004.1f03-+AT+-bpl.org> Seanna asked why the evil ones are always male. I know I'm going to be joining the chorus here but... remember Hulda? Powerful, vindictive, willing to take a long term path to absolute control, and definitely female? I'd say she's evil. Yoicks! and Away! Cindy (who doesn't seem to want to work with snow falling.) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 11:31:48 +0000 (GMT) From: Tensen To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Greeting Message-ID: > > About myself: I am a 21 yo college student at the University of Kentucky > where I am majoring in Secondary Education and Agriculture biotechnology. I > work at Waldenbook sometimes (mainly because even though I only get minimum > wage I get a 33% discount on all the books I buy :) ) [I give this little > bio simply because I consider it proper netiquette to introduce oneself] > Shame.. a Waldenbook's employee that actually pays the publisher their dues?!? Most of the employees at those stores I know cheat the system and tear off the cover of the books and send it back.. thereby illegally paying nothing for the book. Kinda explains why the people buying from the bookstores have to keep dealing wth the rapdily raising prices on books. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 11:20:36 EDT From: LSFG20A-+AT+-prodigy.com (MS KIM H MILLER) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Mage of Green Silences where are you Message-ID: <097.05629270.LSFG20A-+AT+-prodigy.com> There has been a raging controversy re: flaming newbies, and allegations about whether the Mage of Green Silences did/didn't or should have/ shouldn't have. My question is: Mage of Green Silences, where are you? I haven't seen any posting for days, and he was one of my favorites on this list. I hope you haven't unsubscribed over this. Has anyone heard from him recently? Lady Kim ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 17:37:22 GMT+0200 From: ROZANM-+AT+-webster.nl (Rozanna McNeer) To: Mark Mains , Subject: multi-task hel Message-ID: <316be4c3.webster-+AT+-mail.webster.nl> > On April 9 1996 Rozanna wrote: > > >I never said they couldn't do it, just that a greater percentage of > >women seem to be able to do it than men.[multitasking] And it would make > sense too, becasue if a woman could only do one thing at one time, the human > >race would not be where it is today. Imagine . . . if a woman could > >only cook, and do nothing else while one meal was cooking, actually > >while one dish was cooking, nursing babies would go hungry, the house > >would never be clean (causing more deaths from infection), etc. > > I think that you are over generalizing there, Rozanna. However, to counter > the point that you raised if men couldn't multitask the human race would be > extinct also. For example, primordial man had to stalk prey, keep silent, > watch for other predators, and coordinate his activities with the hunting > party all at once....otherwise no food for the women to cook. > **************************************************************************** > Mark Mains email:mamain01-+AT+-pop.uky.edu > University of Kentucky > Okay, I give. I was just trying to argue the point that the authors were trying to make (sorry Mage of Green Silences, my mom's run off to Houston with it so I can't quote it). I don't doubt that the authors thought they had a valid point (otherwise they wouldn't have been published), but they seemed to have missed both sides of the equations (does seem to happen a lot, doesn't it?). AND I was not trying to divide roles up into "women's" work and "men's" work, just falling back on stereotypes to help convey the point. But haven't you meet any people who can't (or can barely) mutli- task? Any way, I'll have my mom fax it to me and see what it really says. Maybe I misunderstood because I was befuddled with jet-lag /-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/ Rozanna n'ha Iris e-mail: rozanm-+AT+-webster.nl Renunciate of Darkover Member of the Cat People/Huntress "feel the wildness hiding in the back of the shadows, lips pulled in an uncurbed, savage grin." Charles de Lint ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 11:46:08 +0000 (GMT) From: Tensen To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Candlemark thread Message-ID: Boy, people really oughta look at the topic sometime, or rmemeber to change it... On the candlemark topic, its SCAdian time... of course it is.. For those that don't know, SCAdian time is unofficially sometime (after all, whats 5 or 10 minutes when you're several hundred years out of date). Time based on candles is approximate anyway. I've seen documents of historical candlemark as being 1 hour, 1.5 hours, and 2.5 hours. Of course there were also 12 hour candles. But seeing as how Misty either goofed, or had the editors change it on her, she probably meant it as 1 hour.. And if you want documentation on the hsitorical candlemarks, I'm sorry I can't produce it right now.. my authority passed away last Saturday in a kyaking accident, under mysterious situations (it made the Asbury Park Press, New Jersey paper, front page on Tuesday.) He was our local Mister of Arts and Science in the SCA. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 17:24:24 GMT+0200 From: ROZANM-+AT+-webster.nl (Rozanna McNeer) To: Rosario Holsen-Baker , Subject: Re: Harmless Valgarth??? Message-ID: <316be4c1.webster-+AT+-mail.webster.nl> > On Tue, 9 Apr 1996, Rozanna McNeer wrote: > > > Pelagir hills, Peligir forests, bandits that raped Tarma, firebird > > nest that burned the one herald in Arrows, bandits from Karse (no > > longer applicable, but used to be), renegade mages, Ancar, Mage > > storms, Falconsbreath Ma'ar thing, wild wyrsa packs, bullies, > > Holderkin and others like Talia's brother with poker, etc.etc is > > HARMLESS????? (hey, what a coincidence, 5?) What's your idea of > > dangerous then? > > > Nuclear holocausts, psycho Unabomber guy, Jeffrey Dahmer, > Charles Manson, Montana freemen, Michigan Militia, Michigan Militia > psycho guy who bombed OK, Scotland psycho, Jack the Ripper, Kent State > shootings, HITLER!!, legalized slavery, "colonization" of Africa, > Inquisitions and the Burning Times, Gengis Khan, Pinoche, World Wars I > and II, IRA bombings, Waco, French Revolution (off with their > heads!-thing), civil wars in almost every major country you can think of, > religious wars, the Middle East terrorism hotbed, Bosnia/Sarajevo.... > > That's my idea of dangerous. Comparatively speaking, Velgarth is > very harmless. > The difference lies only in the scale (the number of people involved) and the technology involved that allows for more horrible things (i.e. mustard gas, shrapnel bombs etc.) Think about what those bandits did to Van or the what the bandits did to Tarma. It could be an incident from Bosnia OR WWII. Falconsbane would undoubtedly have wrecked as much, if not more, havoc as Hitler if he had had the same tools available. Not to be overly pessimistic, but consider, would you rahter die from an arrow in the gut or from a bullet in the head? Sorry for the morbid thoughts and incoherent arguements from the alst few days. I have no excuse, just a reason for bad behaviour which I don't expect to get me of the hook. Stress in the form of marital relations, and financial problems have jus about pushed me over the brink. This list is practically the only thing that can make me smile any more. :( /-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/ Rozanna n'ha Iris e-mail: rozanm-+AT+-webster.nl Renunciate of Darkover Member of the Cat People/Huntress "feel the wildness hiding in the back of the shadows, lips pulled in an uncurbed, savage grin." Charles de Lint ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 10:52:28 -0500 From: Tammy Harris To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Men in power (was Re: Root of lesbian) Message-ID: <88C47D57B3-+AT+-medicine.dmed.iupui.edu> On Wed, April 10, Becky Anne Christensen wrote: > On Tue, 9 Apr 1996, Tammy Harris wrote: > > Umm Cennydd, I hate to point out the obvious, but aren't you > > forgetting Vanyel?!! And Tremane ain't such a bad guy, once you get > > to know him. Also, Ulrich. I'd consider some of the senior Heralds > > to have some power, such as Elcarth, Kyril, Teren, Alberich. Not > > rulers, but leaders of people none the less. > > Well, you forgot some very important ones, like Urtho, and > Baron/King Valdemar, there's also Tashir, who is a King in his own right, > Skan is a male, maybe not a human male, but still a male. Yeah, I ran out of time, and forgot several! I also forgot Roald, the Haighlei king (Shalaman?), Amberdrake, and others, I'm sure. Plus, if we look to her other series, there's Wren, the Baron, the King (the one Lark and Wren work for). I'm going to stop here. And Seanna wrote: > Actually, I do think there's a hint (or more) of sexism in ML's > books: namely, why are the evil ones always male? >It may not seem like > sexism at first, but it is. Victim feminism vs. power feminism debate > springs to mind.. Still, Seanna had a point that although not all males in power are evil, most of Misty's powerful villains are male. Besides Hulda and the villain in Jinx High, I can't think of any other female villains. The one in Summoned to Tourney (or was it Knight of Ghosts and Shadows?) really just worked for her father, the real villain. In the same way, the hand maidens in Burning Water weren't the real villains. I suppose there's the female false prophet before Solaris, but we don't see much of her. Suffice it to say, Misty really doesn't have too many evil women. Sexism in ML--I never thought I'd see it. It just breaks my heart. Of course, now, you're all going to write and tell me all the evil women I missed. Sigh. That's what happens when your brain turns to mush! Well, that's my $0.02, anyway. Tammy "It's time to ask yourself what you believe" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 09:02:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Mannaheim To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: warnings Message-ID: On Wed, 10 Apr 1996, Todd Sherman wrote: > At 08:30 PM 4/8/96 +0100, you wrote: > >> Why is it that all the villians seem like they are either homophobic, or > >> homosexual? > > I think the reason that most villains seem either homophobic or > >homosexual is because the authors cannot imagine a person being any other > >way. They probably think that if you're straight you're homophobic, and > >if you're homosexual then you're homosexual, and that's that. > > Its funny, Mannheim, I just finished reading the second griffin book and > discovered that the main vaillin isn't gay or homophobic... at least not > mostly. He's more like a "normal" hetero-sexual. > > Monolith > > But we never get the indication that Hadanelith ISN'T homophobic OR homosexual since he doesnt do anything sexual at all. The closest he comes to doing something sexual is when he controls those women while he is still at White Gryphon. But when I said the above, I meant that MOST authors think that way, at least in my experience. Misty seems to think a bit differently than most authors. Mannaheim -=-=-=-patw-+AT+-clark.edu-=-=-=-Mannaheim-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- "He teaches like Speedy Gonzalez on a caffeine high." =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 09:04:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Mannaheim To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Talia's shielding Message-ID: On Wed, 10 Apr 1996 Raingcats-+AT+-aol.com wrote: > On page 195 in AOTQ Elcarth teaches Talia how to shield. If someone as > competent as Elcarth taught her to shield (whether her gifts were under > control or not) then wouldn't her shields have stayed even when her gift went > wacko in Arrows Flight? Did Elcarth actually teach her wrong? that thought> Geez, you've guys have gotten me questioning a lot of > things since I joined this list. This is not all together a bad thing by the > way. It's fun, really. Comments? > > Zhai'helleva! > > Lady Moonsong > Raingcats-+AT+-aol.com > > IIRC, Elcarth didn't really teach her how to shield. He told her to imagine a wall around her that could block out other peoples thoughts and feelings, and when she did, she created a shield that wasn't totally under conscious control. He said that if her abilities didn't go away when she got better, then he would teach her how to truly shield. At least, that's what I remember. :) Mannaheim -=-=-=-patw-+AT+-clark.edu-=-=-=-Mannaheim-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- "He teaches like Speedy Gonzalez on a caffeine high." =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 09:06:15 -0700 (PDT) From: Mannaheim To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Skif's gifts Message-ID: On Wed, 10 Apr 1996 Raingcats-+AT+-aol.com wrote: > I have a question. What are Skif's gifts? Did anybody come across anything > that hinted (if not said outright) what they were? I am rereading Arrows Of > The Queen so I have LOTS of questions. (4 actually) They should come after > this email. > > Zhai'helleva! > > Lady Moonsong > Raingcats-+AT+-aol.com > > IIRC, he has a bit of mindspeech, and he used it to talk to Nyara while they were riding out through the forest so Nyara could sneak back into Mornlithes castle type thing. He also mentioned that he couldn't do it very well when he was telling Talia about the accident he was in during his internship. Mannaheim -=-=-=-patw-+AT+-clark.edu-=-=-=-Mannaheim-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- "He teaches like Speedy Gonzalez on a caffeine high." =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ------------------------------ End of MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 468 *********************************