MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 621 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Wet Wings by Sarah Worley 2) Staven's "Gift" by Heart-Song 3) Parenthood and Childhood by Heart-Song 4) Re: Elspeth by Mat Timmerman 5) Re: Everything! by Mat Timmerman 6) Re: Mailing List Casting! Was re: Speaking of lists... by Mat Timmerman 7) Brin (was Re: Parenthood and Childhood) by Mat Timmerman 8) Re: Arizona by scoot-+AT+-iglobal.net (Bryant, Paul) 9) Re: Elspeth by Sarah Worley 10) Re: Parenthood and Childhood by Salli Bird 11) Re: Wet Wings by Salli Bird 12) Re: Weather/Silver Gryphon by Glithoniel-+AT+-aol.com 13) Re: Staven - Some discussion at long last! by ywlau-+AT+-singnet.com.sg (Lady Windsong) 14) Re: So you want to be a Wizard... by Sarah Worley 15) Re: Parenthood and Childhood by "Perkins,Cheryl;=7001696" 16) Re: Arizona by "Perkins,Cheryl;=7001696" 17) Re: help getting digest by Salli Bird 18) Re: Weather/Silver Gryphon by Becky Anne Christensen 19) Re: Of sheep and cows... :) by David Snyder 20) Re: Narnia/Commonlaw marriage/Out of print books/being shaych by David Snyder ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 15 Jun 1996 22:56:19 -0400 From: Sarah Worley To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Wet Wings Message-ID: <199606160256.WAA07106-+AT+-ist.net> On June 16, Valthrea wrote: > For those of the pagan persuasion, are there zealots in your belief system? I would say most definately, though not as many and probably not as vocal as in some of the more organized religions. When I was in college, an aquaintance of mine was very *loudly* Wiccan. Unfortunately, she completely ignored much of the religion in favor of: 1. "free expresion" (sleeping with as many people as possible) and 2. "High Magick" (laying curses on people she didnt like). The first being stupidity, the second being against the prime rule 'an harm ye none, do as ye will' of Wicca. She also tried to convert everyone in the entire school to 'The Mysteries of the Goddess' as she phrased it, and all but physically dragging people to her 'Coven Ceremonies'. Most of us agreed that she didnt know anything at all about the religion, but she made a very bad name for it to everyone who got within 20 feet of her. I would imagine that no few people from my college now thing that Wicca consists of sleeping with everyone in sight, laying curses, and dancing nude in the forest. *sigh* Zhai'hai'allav'a Dass According to a new survey, men and women split the barbecuing chores. Men light the coals, cook and clean the grill, women buy the food, clean up and extinguish their flaming husbands. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Jun 1996 18:02:29 -1000 From: Heart-Song To: Mercedes Lackey Mailing List Subject: Staven's "Gift" Message-ID: I'm at the office and can't check anything... But there's lots of talk about Staven's "Gift" of mindspeech and others. I don't remember seeing anything about their ('Lendel and Stav) speaking with each other. They had a very strong bond, and 'Lendel was Gifted, and they got up to mischief with what they could do. But I only remember a kind of Empathic, primal bond...nothing so specialized as actually talking to each other. That may have been the case, but I don't remember seeing it. (Of course that STILL doesn't prove anything). And how much of the ability they DID have was 'lendels untrained, unfocused Gifts? Bless, Ailima. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Jun 1996 18:22:46 -1000 From: Heart-Song To: Mercedes Lackey Mailing List Subject: Parenthood and Childhood Message-ID: Just a sort of devils-advocate: Many psychologists today are saying that the "childrens duty" to the parents attitude is hurtful to the development of the child. I, myself am no psychologist and don't believe in everything they say... But I thought I would through this out there. Putting the parent as GOD/GODDESS and to be trusted, obeyed, and followed, without question is hurtful mainly in that it can make the child assume responsibility and more for every mistake made. This can (according to the psychos), lead to low self-confidence, low self-esteem, severe co-dependence, self-punishment etc etc. What some say, further, is that this model worked for generations past, with different situations than modern times. While society has changed, parenting methods have not fully evolved with it. Next week, I am going to a family reunion with my parents to work through the problems that have come from similar roots. It was their idea, and I am happy for it. I've changed drastically in the past month alone. I feel alot freer, and I am much more my own person now, just from discussions with my parents over the telephone. I'm not saying this is TRUE, just throwing out another idea. And trying to show that I feel that part of it, at least, has a ring closer to truth. I am also not saying that brats should be allowed to continue to stay brats. :) Another smaller note: I am sure that many non-parents will thank you profusely, Valthrea, for effectively shutting them out. Your comment about them not understanding might be a bit difficult to take. Non-parents considering it, MUST understand and be made to understand as close as possible, the issues such as this. Furthermore, they must do all this BEFORE having child. It is at least their duty to the child who NEVER ASKED TO BE BORN. Of course, this is ALL my OWN opinion... :) BTW, does anybody else here read Brin? Similar note...what was that alien race that holds that the parents have a duty to the children. (thought transference or something). I haven't read him in about 3 years and can't remember ANYTHING. Except of course for Startide Rising, which is one of my favourite books all time. Take Care! Ailima. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 00:21:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Mat Timmerman To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Elspeth Message-ID: On Sat, 15 Jun 1996, Farrin wrote: > You wrote: > > > > Why do most of us seem to dislike Elsbeth so much. She certainly > > doesn't have an easy time of it. What with being a child with a mother > > that can't bear the sight of her and turns her over to a nurse that > > deliberately atempts to warp her, and then being the consistant focus > > of attention for the court and collegium, she spent most of her young > > life being pushed one way or another. > > > > Anyone who has been a first child, first grandchild knows how heavy > > the expectations can be. imagine how hard it must be bearing them for > > an entire country. > > > > And she does keep trying to serve. I have always thought that > > Darkwinds reaction to her very realistic perception that people were > > watching what she did was ignorantly cruel. > > > Got me. I keep piping up and saying "BUT I LIKE ELSPETH!" and everyone > keeps ignoring me for insisting that I should have my way, becuase its > right because I said so, darn it. I going to go hide where no one can > find me for hours now. ::Elspeth mode off:: > Ok, I've been fairly quiet about this, but [ducks and looks over shoulder suspciously, and whispers] I like Elspeth too. ;) In fact, after MPawn, MPrice, Aotq, and AFall, WoC is my favorite Misty book (oooooo, acronyms and abbreviations galore :) ). She seriously gets on my nerves in WoFate, but she changes quite a bit in WoC. Her old attitude isn't really any more excusable, but it is more understandable after WoC. > Seriously, I understand her motivations, and as a grownup, I really > like the person she has become. Couldn't possibly be because I feel so > much affinity for her, now could it? The line where she mentioned that > someone was always better than she at everything really hit home. > Competent at everything, outstanding at nothing, but okay with the > place she has. Yeah, that line made me feel kind of sorry for her. She was the Heir, and in her eyes, probably the Heir should have been very talented. But she sees herself as average in all things. Aside from that, Darkwind's responding thought lets us see how good Valdemar's mind-magic is. Whe she says that she's only average in Gifts, he thinks something like "If she thinks her Gifts are average, the rest of them must be frightening mind-mages." It's funny, since the science of Gifts seems a bit less advanced than in LHM. I guess that can only be attributed to LHM coming after Arrows. On another tangent, isn't it odd how most of us refer to the Talia trilogy as "Arrows", instead of "The Heralds of Valdemar". I mean, occasionally we see HoV, but not too often. I guess that so many of the books are about Heralds that HoV doesn't sound distinctive enough. Mat Cat Person and Adept mtimme47-+AT+-magic.hofstra.edu http://ada.hofstra.edu/~mtimme47/ Boy do I need a new sig line. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 00:36:36 -0400 (EDT) From: Mat Timmerman To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Everything! Message-ID: On Sat, 15 Jun 1996, Sarah Worley wrote: > > Can anyone tell me who exactly it was that Baron Valdemar requested > the Companions of? Whas there ever a name given for the God/Goddess, or no? > I know the story was explained briefly in the Arrows of the Queen, but I > dont remember off hand, and I dont have the book with me. A cloud of dust appears on the horizon. Soon, all can see a white and black tiger running up, and shape-shifting into Mat. "I have textevd!," he shouts. :) p 81, SFBC Queen's Own omnibus, speaker is Davan, Talia's year-mate: "...he went out into the grove that stands in the middle of what we call Companion's Field now, and he asked every god he'd ever heard of to help him. An' Mama told me in the version she'd read, it said he cast a special spell too, 'cause remember, he was a magician, not just Gifted." Arrows of the Queen Concordance, p12, "Companions" entry: "...the King called on every magical resource he possessed and prayed to every divinity he knew for aid." So, we don't know which gods(esses) he called on. Also, I wonder if his spell was the fuel for admiting the Grove-born Companions. After Rolan brings Gwena through, he seems kind of tired. It seems that doing it requires lots of concentration and energy. Afterwards, it's probably the rest of the Companions that bring through the new MOC, when the old one dies. > On a side tangent, what god/demigod? locked up the boarders of > Iftel? I have a feeling that it's neither. More like the vrondi as border guards. In this case, the Iftel border guard was probably set up by the Wind Lords (where did we get that name anyway? Was it BTS?). Mat Cat Person, Adept, and Eternal Keeper of Textevd for AotQ mtimme47-+AT+-magic.hofstra.edu http://ada.hofstra.edu/~mtimme47/ I still need to get a new quote. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 00:45:33 -0400 (EDT) From: Mat Timmerman To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Mailing List Casting! Was re: Speaking of lists... Message-ID: On Sat, 15 Jun 1996, Rosario Holsen-Baker wrote: > And speaking of whom, since no one else has, I nominate Sundancer > for Kero. Good idea. After all, she's already got the Sky^H^H^HSunbolts. :) Oh good, with Jake as Skif, I'm out of the running for that one. I just couldn't see myself as a moving target. Now a Tayledras, Moondance maybe (ok, so he's only adopted Tayledras, so what ? :) ). Karal doesn't work, since even though I'm technically Catholic, I haven't practiced in about six years... Mat Cat Person and Adept mtimme47-+AT+-magic.hofstra.edu http://ada.hofstra.edu/~mtimme47/ Without a quote, without a clue. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 00:50:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Mat Timmerman To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Brin (was Re: Parenthood and Childhood) Message-ID: On Sun, 16 Jun 1996, Heart-Song wrote: > > BTW, does anybody else here read Brin? Similar note...what was > that alien race that holds that the parents have a duty to the children. > (thought transference or something). I haven't read him in about 3 years > and can't remember ANYTHING. Except of course for Startide Rising, which > is one of my favourite books all time. It's been a while, but I have read some Brin. _Startide Rising_ and _The Uplift War_ were ages ago, along with _Sundiver_ (which I hated). More recently, I read _Glory Season_. Decent book, but the ending sucked. Mat Cat Person and Adept mtimme47-+AT+-magic.hofstra.edu http://ada.hofstra.edu/~mtimme47/ Where, oh where has my little quote gone? Where, oh where can it be? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Jun 1996 23:55:19 -0500 From: scoot-+AT+-iglobal.net (Bryant, Paul) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Arizona Message-ID: <19960616045518289.AAA170-+AT+-denp1-bantha.iglobal.net> At 10:31 AM 6/14/96 +0100, you wrote: > >> Dearie, I don't feel all that sorry for you. :( First of all, >>you are lucky that AZ is so DRY. Take that heat and stick 80%plus >>humidity with it... > ************************************* Howdy from Texas! Try 100+F, 70-95% humidity, and 30-50 mph winds, with a thunderstorm and tornados thrown in. Anybody want to come visit? By the time I get to work I have to ring my clothes out. OBMISTY: Are there tornados in Valdemar? Linda B. Linda & Paul Bryant Too tired to think of anything funny! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 00:58:27 -0400 From: Sarah Worley To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Elspeth Message-ID: <199606160458.AAA07337-+AT+-ist.net> On June 16, Mat wrote: > Yeah, that line made me feel kind of sorry for her. She was the Heir, and > in her eyes, probably the Heir should have been very talented. But she > sees herself as average in all things. Not necessarily limited to her own eyes either. People always expect the Heir to the Crown to perfect and have wonderful Gifts galore. "Above average" seems to be a job reqirement somehow. I think it dates back to the Sleeping Beauty fairytales. > Aside from that, Darkwind's responding thought lets us see how good > Valdemar's mind-magic is. Whe she says that she's only average in Gifts, > he thinks something like "If she thinks her Gifts are average, the rest of > them must be frightening mind-mages." It's funny, since the science of > Gifts seems a bit less advanced than in LHM. I guess that can only be > attributed to LHM coming after Arrows. Hmm. I always accredited the lack of finesse in mind magic in LHM to the fact that there were Herald-Mages. "Gifs... all Heralds have Gifts... but [he/she] is a HERALD-MAGE!" seemed to be the presiding concept of the time. I would imagine that a lot less emphasis was made on Gifs just overall, including, unfortunately, the training and exploration of them. > On another tangent, isn't it odd how most of us refer to the Talia trilogy > as "Arrows", instead of "The Heralds of Valdemar". I mean, occasionally > we see HoV, but not too often. I guess that so many of the books are > about Heralds that HoV doesn't sound distinctive enough. Hmm. Lesse.. (M) Winds.. (LH) Mage.. (M) Storms... Heralds of Valdemar? Winds of Fate Magic's Pawn Storm Warning Arrows of the Queen Winds of Change Magic's Promise Storm Rising Arrows Flight Winds of Fury Magic's Price Storm Breaking Arrows Fall Arrows just works better. And is more descriptive :) Zhai'hai'allav'a Dass According to a new survey, men and women split the barbecuing chores. Men light the coals, cookand clean the grill, women buy the food, clean up and extinguish their flaming husbands. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 00:36:01 -0500 From: Salli Bird To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Parenthood and Childhood Message-ID: <05360170123941-+AT+-misslink.net> At 05:35 AM 6/16/96 +0100, you wrote: > Many psychologists today are saying that the "childrens duty" to >the parents attitude is hurtful to the development of the child. I, >myself am no psychologist and don't believe in everything they say... >But I thought I would through this out there. Harmful? How in the world could listening to someone who has gone through life and survived be harmful? It makes me wonder if these people even know what it is like to be a parent, and sweat and be scared for the child? It makes me wonder if they would like to have non-responsible house guests who don't respect their property come to live... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Putting the parent as GOD/GODDESS and to be trusted, obeyed, and >followed, without question is hurtful mainly in that it can make the >child assume responsibility and more for every mistake made. That was why I inserted the line about "instructive". No one can live without instruction. Parents need to teach, which includes the reasons why. If the perent teaches effectively, it can be a building of self-confidence, rather than a breaker. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > I am also not saying that brats should be allowed to continue >to stay brats. :) Just for the group.... How would everyone stop a brat from being a brat? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > > Another smaller note: I am sure that many non-parents will thank >you profusely, Valthrea, for effectively shutting them out. Your comment >about them not understanding might be a bit difficult to take. >Non-parents considering it, MUST understand and be made to understand as >close as possible, the issues such as this. Furthermore, they must do >all this BEFORE having child. It is at least their duty to the child who >NEVER ASKED TO BE BORN. > I did not intend to "shut them out", per se... I have noticed, though, that non-parents do not have the experience to deal with parenthood. It is very different to be a parent than it is to be a child. Since my son is a father now, I have had time to reflect on the way society used to raise children and the way it is done now. It _used_ to take a whole village to raise a child. By this, I mean that the whole village would work together to raise the young. Today, it would appear that it is every parent for themselves, and watch oput if anyone "interferes". The young parents would get advice from Aunt Marie, or Uncle Sven. I am not saying it was a perfect system. But I am of the opinion that the methods used today are more ineffective and harmful. To bring the subject back to Misty, if possible... I think Misty does a very good job describing the societies in her books. The Valdemar scenarios are very agricultural, and they do point out the benefits of raising children who are respectful (for the most part), and willing to listen to the adults. (A person can't learn anything if they ain't willing to listen.) Valthrea aka The Bird Woman bird4ever-+AT+-misslink.net Striking out for independence by running my own business at home. And YOU can, too. I will share my secrets when you e-mail me! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 00:36:08 -0500 From: Salli Bird To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Wet Wings Message-ID: <05360891123946-+AT+-misslink.net> At 04:35 AM 6/16/96 +0100, you wrote: >On June 16, Valthrea wrote: >> For those of the pagan persuasion, are there zealots in your belief system? > > I would say most definately, though not as many and probably not as >vocal as in some of the more organized religions. > > When I was in college, an aquaintance of mine was very *loudly* >Wiccan. Unfortunately, she completely ignored much of the religion in >favor of: > 1. "free expresion" (sleeping with as many people as possible) and > 2. "High Magick" (laying curses on people she didnt like). > > The first being stupidity, the second being against the prime >rule 'an harm ye none, do as ye will' of Wicca. She also tried to convert >everyone in the entire school to 'The Mysteries of the Goddess' as she >phrased it, and all but physically dragging people to her 'Coven Ceremonies'. > Most of us agreed that she didnt know anything at all about the >religion, but she made a very bad name for it to everyone who got within >20 feet of her. > > I would imagine that no few people from my college now thing that >Wicca consists of sleeping with everyone in sight, laying curses, and >dancing nude in the forest. > > *sigh* > >Zhai'hai'allav'a > Dass > According to a new survey, men and women split the > barbecuing chores. Men light the coals, cook and clean the > grill, women buy the food, clean up and extinguish their > flaming husbands. > > Kinda makes a person wonder what the zealots have for lunch, don't it? Sorry about the one liner....... Valthrea aka The Bird Woman bird4ever-+AT+-misslink.net Striking out for independence by running my own business at home. And YOU can, too. I will share my secrets when you e-mail me! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 01:40:15 -0400 From: Glithoniel-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Weather/Silver Gryphon Message-ID: <960616014014_218244855-+AT+-emout15.mail.aol.com> In a message dated 96-06-13 19:36:32 EDT, you write: > Gosh, if you want to know about bad humidity, think New >Hampshire. We were there a couple years ago in the summer, and that place >was what I imagine hell to be like :) I couldn't bear to take hot >showers, way too steamy, and as soon as you dried off, you felt all wet >again from the humidity. I was ready to die after 10 minutes outside. It >was actually a little cooler than CA, but that humidity was awful! I am >never going back there again, except.......maybe in winter....maybe. > > *^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_ > Lady Becky, Goddess of Stress & Dry Breakfast Cereals > > Honey Chile(sorry, just had to turn on the accent) if ya'll thought New Hampshire was bad, never set foot in the Southeast during July or August. The air's so thick you can practically swim through it. Hot I can deal with. Humid is the pits(especially since it breeds mosquitos by the zillions. I have to change the outside dogs' water every day!) !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Lady Kadessa asked: > Question: Has anyone else heard of or read "Support Your Local >Wizard"? I found it on my library's computer, but haven't had time to >read it yet. I thought it maybe was another book in the Young Wizards >series. Anyone else know? I don't think so. Isn't that by Christopher Stasheff or Barbara Hambly? Or perhaps I'm hallucinating again. A quick search of the bookshelves was unhelpful. I must have at least twenty novels with the word Wizard in the title! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Dass said: > When Kris and Talia were up in the northern part of Valdemar, >raiders (raiders from where, I've always wondered) attacked some village >and most of that burned. Those particular raiders were barbarians from beyond the Forest of Sorrows. They lived in the rough northern wastes. So, I guess it was easier to raid than farm. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Queen Reesa commented: >Okay. I've admitted a lot of things on this list. I can finally >say this to you. I'm 'Reesa, and I like country. No, don't shoot me. I >don't like twang, but I do like most country music. But then, I've always >had interesting music tastes. For almost three years I listened to nothing >but country, and H,H&H and _Celtic Odessy_. (these were like the only tapes >I owned...sad isn't it?) I didn't start listening to Alternative till about >two months ago, when Jake (SEE! It *is* his fault!!!) posted the parody of >_Ironic_. I still love Celtic and filk, and country, and a lot of really >wierd stuff. So there. And don't call me hillbillie. I like sheep, not >cows. You're not alone. I to yearn for a weird mixture of music -- alternative, rock, classical(anybody else out there play air-symphony orchestra?), space music(was new age, now its something else but I call it space music from the PBS radio program), older country, and my current favorite is oldies(I know all the words). I do the same thing with books. Most people think I'm crazy. I always maintain that I'm sane, its the rest of the world that's crazy. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Lady Becky rambled: > Let's play a game! I'll think of something in this room, and you >guess it! (just kidding) What kinds of games did they play in Valdemar, I >don't recall hearing about any board games or stuff. Well there was Hinds & Hounds. It sounds like a type of chess or checkers. Vanyel and Stef played it all the time in _Magic's Price_ !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Trouble mentioned: >(Me, I'm a short story writer -- I >can't make anything last a novel, without a colaberation of some sorts. >Works well with my Mark -- We're writing an interesting series right now, >that could never have worked out like it has without the both of us.) I'm just the opposite. I can't work a story idea at less than novel length. I don't even much care for short stories(except Arthur C. Clarke). I too have a Mark but he doesn't write, he just points me to the correct universe to write in. Uh-oh, that's two me-too posts in a row. Just when I thought it was safe to believe that I'm weirder than anybody else, I go and find other people who are just as weird *sigh* ;) !!!!!!!!!!!! Fireheart supposes: >Just putting in MHO... I think Elspeth is NOT a bad character. She DOES have >qualities... even though I agree she doesn't show them all the time. She IS >a good character... and you can't do a whole lot in her time frame without her Elspeth has always seemed more like a real person to me. Some of the characters are a little too perfect. I like Elspeth. Her character fits her position exactly. So, she's arrogant and conceited. She's been spoiled-in one way or another-most of her life. She never really had extensive outside experience with non-Valdemaran groups. By the end of the MageWinds series, she does some serious growing up. Give her a break folks. Need I remind you just how whiney(sp?) and selfish Vanyel was at the beginning of _Magic's Pawn_? Ok, I'll hush now before I get flamed. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Queen Reesa queried: >Or, just on the merits of personality, cast a woman for a man's part? Sure, just like the Elizbethan theatre but reversed. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Sandy wondered: >(Probably)A Stupid Question: >The heir to the thone MUST be chosen, correct. By to be a land holder, >you MUST NOT be chosen. Does that seem odd to anybody else?? Don't >land-holders have the same (but different scale) of responsibility to >their land and people as the King/Queen does to the whole country?? As >it stands now, any old schmuck can be a land holder-and potentially cause >a lot of havoc!-but CAN'T be chosesn? Something just doesn't sit right >with me here. I think what the rule means is that a Herald can't be tied to any particular place. Holding land ties one down. It makes you partial to a certain area, just because its yours. A Herald can never be anything less than impartial. There is also the matter of the oaths a Herald takes. I believe those oaths put them in the direct service of the Monarch as the throne's representatives to the people. They serve Valdemar and the Monarch, not one particular area. (BTW, no question is ever to stupid to ask. Only those who don't know and don't could be called stupid.) Ok, that's all for tonight. I'm almost caught up and I want to go to bed(besides I'm running out of verbs). Of course next week, I'm on vacation so I'll soon be behind again. Ah, well -- that's life. Glith "Only well-diggers start at the top." ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 13:58:27 +0800 (SST) From: ywlau-+AT+-singnet.com.sg (Lady Windsong) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Staven - Some discussion at long last! Message-ID: <199606160558.NAA17917-+AT+-orchid.singnet.com.sg> Lady Nightshadow said: >This implies that Staven had gifts worthy of heraldry if it weren't >for the fued. So we already know that Staven has mindspeech (from a comment >'Lendel made about how they could always communicate in some weird way - >loosely quoted no textevd this time, sorry Cennydd ) but what other gifts >did he have? Were there other clues about it mentioned in the series about >what they may be? > I think what was meant by 'Lendel being able to communicate with Staven in some way was the mind link between twins. Textevd: 'Lendel said: "We've had a primitive sort of mind link ever since we were born."( Magic's Pawn, Pg 138, paperback DAW version) He also mentioned that he had thought sensing beyond Staven, but there was no mention of Staven having the same gifts. Oh yes, and 'Lendel also said that their communication was mostly constrained to physical sensations. Well, everyone, mull over that, and get back on topic! Wind to Thy Wings, & Let me tell you of love: Love is patient and long Lady Wingsong & enduring;it is kind, never envying, never ambitious Lyrra (bondbird) & for itself, never putting on airs, or displaying ywlau-+AT+-singnet.com.sg & itself haughtily; it boasts not. & -- Dafyd, from _Merlin_ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 04:24:01 -0400 From: Sarah Worley To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: So you want to be a Wizard... Message-ID: <199606160824.EAA08242-+AT+-ist.net> On June 15, Thess wrote: > At 03:31 AM 6/14/96 +0100, you wrote: > > Question: Has anyone else heard of or read "Support Your Local > >Wizard"? I found it on my library's computer, but haven't had time to > >read it yet. I thought it maybe was another book in the Young Wizards > >series. Anyone else know? > > > >Lady Kadessa... > > > >Yes, yes, yes, read it read it read it read it!!!!! Diane Duane did a > superb job on what is supposed to be a kid's book, and I keep hearing that > in the UK, a 4th one is out, and a 5th one is going to be published. I WANT > THEM, and alas, I'm stuck in Fl, with only a good friend who's mom lives in > England to help...wait a minute, maybe I can get him to get her to bring it > over when she comes! Last (or thereabouts) message of a dying thread.. Diane Duane has her own homepage, its up at http://www.ibmpcug.co.uk/~owls/ (specifically: http://www.ibmpcug.co.uk/~owls/homeward.html) Its full of short stories, story clips, current info and lots of other good stuff. She also has an email address which is mentioned on the page. Zhai'hai'allav'a Dass dassin-+AT+-ist.net Even evil magicians get up in the night http://www.dassin.org/ and look for cookies, sometimes. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 05:57:23 +0000 From: "Perkins,Cheryl;=7001696" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Parenthood and Childhood Message-ID: On Sun, 16 Jun 1996, Heart-Song wrote: > > > Just a sort of devils-advocate: > > Many psychologists today are saying that the "childrens duty" to > the parents attitude is hurtful to the development of the child. I, > myself am no psychologist and don't believe in everything they say... > But I thought I would through this out there. > Putting the parent as GOD/GODDESS and to be trusted, obeyed, and > followed, without question is hurtful mainly in that it can make the > child assume responsibility and more for every mistake made. This can > (according to the psychos), lead to low self-confidence, low self-esteem, > severe co-dependence, self-punishment etc etc. > What some say, further, is that this model worked for generations > past, with different situations than modern times. While society has > changed, parenting methods have not fully evolved with it. I'm no psychologist. I think parents (unless they are truly unworthy) are due some respect. But I felt really adult when, long after I left home, I was able to say to myself, my parents loved me, raised me as best they could, but I have chosen my own way. I respect their traditions and beliefs, but I don't always follow them. My own beliefs may be tested. My father died years ago, and my mother is saying yet again that she'd like to move to my city. She HATES this place! She must know (courtesy of my sibs) that I live in a downtown area, not in a `suitable' suburban area. > Next week, I am going to a family reunion with my parents to work > through the problems that have come from similar roots. It was their > idea, and I am happy for it. I've changed drastically in the past month > alone. I feel alot freer, and I am much more my own person now, just > from discussions with my parents over the telephone. > > I'm not saying this is TRUE, just throwing out another idea. And > trying to show that I feel that part of it, at least, has a ring closer > to truth. I am also not saying that brats should be allowed to continue > to stay brats. :) > Good luck with the reunion. And although I have no children, I know people who do. The effort and skill involved in raising children is incredible. Was it this group or another one in which someone pointed out that any 14 year old (I'd say 12 year old) can get pregnant, but it takes special skills to raise the kid. This whole thread reminds me of my teaching days - `If she'd only told me, I would have helped her get birth control pills!!'. I never confided my personal life to my mother, neither did my students with theirs. I'm rambling. And I can't think of a ML idea to add. Except there does seem to be a lack of birth control, and the only illigitimate (sp?) child I can think of is Van's nephew. If a reliable method of birth control wasn't available, I'd expect a lot more. Cheryl ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 06:04:59 +0000 From: "Perkins,Cheryl;=7001696" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Arizona Message-ID: On Sun, 16 Jun 1996 scoot-+AT+-iglobal.net wrote: > At 10:31 AM 6/14/96 +0100, you wrote: > > > >> Dearie, I don't feel all that sorry for you. :( First of all, > >>you are lucky that AZ is so DRY. Take that heat and stick 80%plus > >>humidity with it... > > > ************************************* > > Howdy from Texas! > > Try 100+F, 70-95% humidity, and 30-50 mph winds, with a thunderstorm and > tornados thrown in. Anybody want to come visit? By the time I get to work > I have to ring my clothes out. OBMISTY: Are there tornados in Valdemar? > > Linda B. > Linda & Paul Bryant > Too tired to think of anything funny! > I KNEW there was a reason I lived in NE Canada!! No hot temperatures, no tornadoes. Who cares about a bit of snow (sometimes in June)? ML doesn't mention weather a lot, aside from the storm which, I think, trapped Talia and was it Dirk? That storm sounded to me like a real NE blizzard, not a tornado. I don't remember a description of a tornado in any of her books. Cheryl ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 11:14:39 -0500 From: Salli Bird To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: help getting digest Message-ID: <16143959924561-+AT+-misslink.net> Can anyone here tell me how to get the digest instead? I tried to get it, but I don't see the command in the file I got..... Help? Valthrea aka The Bird Woman bird4ever-+AT+-misslink.net Striking out for independence by running my own business at home. And YOU can, too. I will share my secrets when you e-mail me! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 09:50:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Becky Anne Christensen To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Weather/Silver Gryphon Message-ID: On Sun, 16 Jun 1996 Glithoniel-+AT+-aol.com wrote: > > Gosh, if you want to know about bad humidity, think New > >Hampshire. We were there a couple years ago in the summer, and that place > >was what I imagine hell to be like :) I couldn't bear to take hot > >showers, way too steamy, and as soon as you dried off, you felt all wet > >again from the humidity. I was ready to die after 10 minutes outside. It > >was actually a little cooler than CA, but that humidity was awful! I am > >never going back there again, except.......maybe in winter....maybe. > > > > Lady Becky, Goddess of Stress & Dry Breakfast Cereals > > > Honey Chile(sorry, just had to turn on the accent) if ya'll thought New > Hampshire was bad, never set foot in the Southeast during July or August. > The air's so thick you can practically swim through it. Hot I can deal > with. Humid is the pits(especially since it breeds mosquitos by the > zillions. I have to change the outside dogs' water every day!) > > Glith > "Only well-diggers start at the top." > Well, on that same trip we went to Alabama,and Georgia and I actually thought it was nicer. Everyone said, if you think this is bad, wait till you get to Alabama. We thought theu were all crazy! It was hot, yes, but it wasn't nearly as icky and sticky as New Hampshire. Guess we got lucky. It was around that time when there was a whole bunch of storms and stuff, I think it was 1994, that should be right. Anyways, I liked Atlanta and Alabama compared to New Hampshire, but that could have been because all the weather was screwy, and we got really lucky. *^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_*^_ Lady Becky, Goddess of Stress & Dry Breakfast Cereals Everybody wants prosthetic forheads on their real heads *They*Might*Be*Giants* ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 12:48:21 -0400 From: David Snyder To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Of sheep and cows... :) Message-ID: <199606161648.MAA06519-+AT+-brickell.bridge.net> At 10:48 PM 6/15/96 +0100, you wrote: >Your Majesty I present, one flock of chocolate and one box of sheep. >Lady Nightshadow aka Shady who has paid her taxes! ******************* I refuse to pay taxes on the grounds that I'm a Goddess, and I Officially Crowned you, so on behalf of all us Gods, I demand a tithe. I promise to use it wisely, and not spend it on wine, sailors, and sheep. Use your imagination, I'll open a junk shop of the mind! Or, you can pay taxes to Queen 'Reesa, and SHE can tithe. Lady Thessaly, Goddess of Nomenclature, MKGC, LiG ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 13:26:49 -0400 From: David Snyder To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Narnia/Commonlaw marriage/Out of print books/being shaych Message-ID: <199606161726.NAA06719-+AT+-brickell.bridge.net> At 03:37 AM 6/16/96 +0100, you wrote: >It's not the Christianity that bothers me about that particular >>religion, it's most of the Christians! However, I have met some in real >>life, and some on this list, who aren't fanatical about it...more power >>to them! :) >Glith **************** Last night at work, my supervisor got into a discussion with one of the women who works there. He and another girl were questioning her beliefs (she's a born-again Christian) and I suspect INCREDIBLY psychic, which comes to her in dreams and also when she runs on at the mouth. (It's hard to get a word in edgewise around her.) ) Now, here's the thing. STEVE was genuinly curious. He likes knowing how and why people think, and he's incredibly mature for his age, and very well educated. (On an off note, he's an American raised in Britain for most of his life, and very proper. And a good conversationalist, and a good guy to work for. He'd make a GREAT storyteller/writer and a good teacher.) Shari, on the other hand, was threatened by Celeste's beliefs, because no one likes to be told that they're wrong. But the one thing I noticed from the sidelines is that Celeste never really answered any of the questions in an honest, straight forward manner, she just circled around them. She'll probably come back with textevd tonight, and yet again, it won't help, because I realized something last night. It's difficult to use the Bible to prove something if one person takes it completely literally, one sees it as a coded work on HOW to do stuff and so looks for the hidden meaning, one doesn't believe it at all, and one just thinks it's a bunch of metaphors. Meaning, on this issue, there will be no meeting of the minds, so it's a pity that everyone, including us "open-minded" sorts don't just stop and say, well, I don't agree with it, but that's their belief. And that's ok. Problem is, every time I start arguing religion with someone, I DON'T stay open-minded. The second someone tells me that their belief is that theirs is the only correct religion, I have this almost overwhelming urge to start arguing that they're wrong. And that's not very open-minded either, so I am teaching myself to stay the heck OUT of these discussions. End of story. so much for that. Lady Thess ------------------------------ End of MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 621 *********************************