MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 920 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) linguistic question by Charlene Joan Falkiner 2) Re: 1 true way by Rose 3) language classes/witches by Pam Dziedzic 4) Re: Braves Braidsson Goes A-Plot Hunting/Silverfox/Survey by ShadowJaz-+AT+-aol.com 5) Re: language classes/witches by ShadowJaz-+AT+-aol.com 6) Ooops! I put my foot in it by infodyn-+AT+-distrinet.com.uy (Eleonora Scoseria) 7) Re: language classes/witches by Tensen 8) Talia, Vanyel, An'desha by "Hth." 9) Braid: You or Thou/The love of my life (y'all know who it by myktshr-+AT+-ldd.net (miyako hirao) 10) Fluff/Re: Writing Music by dsarik-+AT+-PO-Box.McGill.CA 11) Braid:circles/braiding/responses to by dsarik-+AT+-PO-Box.McGill.CA 12) lifebonds, true ways, Elspeth, etc. by "Hth." 13) RE: linguistic question by Debra Cebulski 14) Re: lots of things by DawnRain 15) Re: Mini-Braid: /perfection/data by DawnRain 16) Re: Oops!/Bunnicula/Dune/Duane/MZB by DawnRain 17) Re: lots of things by DawnRain 18) Re: Ooops! I put my foot in it by DawnRain 19) Re: linguistic question by DawnRain 20) Life Span in Valdemar by Adrianne 21) Re: Physics/Writing Music/Firebird/ by "Adrianne" 22) Re: Life Span in Valdemar by infodyn-+AT+-distrinet.com.uy (Eleonora Scoseria) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 4 Nov 1996 19:57:26 -0600 (CST) From: Charlene Joan Falkiner To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: linguistic question Message-ID: Hi, all. This may sound like a sily question, but I've been wondering about it all the sam.e The question has to deal with the words kestra'chern and shay'a'chern. What do you think the "chern" means? might the two words be connected? Char {ad655-+AT+-sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca} ***I fall upon the thorns of life*** ***I bleed*** ---Percy Shelley--- :):):):) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Nov 1996 21:08:55 -0500 From: Rose To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: 1 true way Message-ID: <327EA1B7.7C36-+AT+-ctol.net> Jefferson or Rain wrote: > The point that I am trying to make is that Misty's worlds, characters >and plots are, as a matter of course, going to reflect her own world >view. And we each have one of those. And if my opinion is "there is >NO one true way" then what am I going to do when confronted by someone >who thinks their way is the ONLY way? Of course, I am going to have to >work very hard to allow them their point of view. Particularly when it >directly conflicts with mine. Does anyone understand what I am getting >at here, which is sortof a basic internal conflict inherent in the >average human, IMHO? > "There is no one true way" has nearly become my theme. In such, I 've had to deal with people who don't feel the same way I do and who are not opposed to telling me all about it. I think that in Valdemar, "there is no one true way" is much more of an ideal than an actual fact. Take the conversation from AofQ when Talia is on kitchen duty and first learns that Mero only believes in one G*d. She thinks it's odd and knows her family would call him evil. But, instead of taking her prejudices to heart, she listens to when the girl who told her about Mero says something like "but they must be okay cause Mero is awfully nice." I think that it is here when Talia takes a major turn in thinking for herself and not being controled by her upbringing. I think that "There is no one true way" is meant to foster knowledge about who a person is rather than what set of beliefs they ascribe to. A person can be a satanist and still be a good person and a person can be a (excuse the expression) "G*d fearing soul" and still be evil at heart. The statement is trying to allow people from fundamentaly different backgrounds to get along and live together by giving them a reason to get to know the people for who they are and not just for what they belive. People can believe that their way of religion is the only way, but they should not judge others simply on the fact that they worship in a different fashion. Dyana --- "If I couldn't fill my stomach I'd fill my head. But I never could fill the words that I said." ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Nov 1996 20:11:01 -0600 (CST) From: Pam Dziedzic To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: language classes/witches Message-ID: <1.5.4.16.19961104201102.20f7c0f0-+AT+-BrandonU.CA> Emily Cartier wrote: "Why don't her characters ever complain about learning grammar in their many foreign language classes? Everyone seems to just magically know about six languages and not have much trouble picking them up (except Karal and An'desha)." My pet theory is that most Herald trainees are taught from day one to memorize reams of information in a short period of time. Remember Taila studying her list of nobles to introduce? I don't think learning a new language is a far stretch from this type of study. Long lists of vocabulary memorized mnemonically, ect. Another point to make is with the Collegium being sitauted in the capital city, there is opportunity to hear and practice foreign launguages with native speakers(diplomats, their entourage, visiting nobles, and so forth). Having travelled to Montreal to study French myself, I can say that's definitely the fastest way to learn! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Jaiook asked: "I was wondering how many people on this ML is a witch?" I was thinking the same thing myself. Anyone have some theories as to why witchy-types are drawn to Misty? I've been studying Wicca for about a year, and I feel the stongest pull when I read about the Tayledras. Healing the land, living with nature, these people know how to treat Gaia! New to the list, Herald-trainee Shadra Ayes. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Nov 1996 21:37:09 -0500 From: ShadowJaz-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Braves Braidsson Goes A-Plot Hunting/Silverfox/Survey Message-ID: <961104213701_1781018347-+AT+-emout08.mail.aol.com> Kory wrote (in response to my comment about liking SG): > Hmm..maybe I should reconsider that High Priestess thing;P Hey now! Somehow, I *knew* you were going to say that. Maybe I should take that back, umm, I didn't like it as much as the others, even Winds and SB. In fact, it's at the bottom of my list of Misty books, right with my least favorite urban fantasies, and it's about as far from LHM as it can get and still be a Misty book. And, yes, LHM is my favorite, and MPawn Is the one I'd keep too, if that was the only one I could keep (in response to that thread from last . . . week?). Are you reassured now, Magnificent And Most Divine Prince? , you know you love it, 'sides it's one of the priviledges of being a deity> See, I make a very good High Priestess, and I would consider it my duty to heap flattery upon you on a regular basis, especially if I make you made you mad, which I don't intend to do since an angry god is *not* a desirable thing. There, now you can go figure out all that Thee and Thou stuff, so you can anoint me . ============================================================= Re:Silverfox I always thought he was shaych, but when you think about, he could be bi. In my opinion, he couldn't be straight, but that's just my opinion. Amberdrake, well, I think he's straight, and I aggree with the person (sorry, forgot who) who said that (paraphrasing) in a lifebond, it wasn't too likely for someone to lifebond to someone who wasn't their preference, they wouldn't be very happy if they did, and then you'd have two unhappy people. ============================================================= To Hth and Deniz, concerning the Meyers-Briggs Survey, and The B-Day List: It's fine with me if you guys want to post my information, definitely not a problem. ============================================================= To Carrach: I'm an ENFP, although I think I'm probably more of a borderline like you. By the way, love the quote, and really love that movie. I'm impressed, you're a very good writer, I'm looking forward to what you write when mine comes around. ObMisty: Umm, did anyone else like Silver Gryphon? Please, no one throw anything at me . Blessed Be, NightShade OIB, LotPW, and (soon to be) High Priestess Of All Things Nocturnal ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Nov 1996 22:02:15 -0500 From: ShadowJaz-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: language classes/witches Message-ID: <961104220213_1114559118-+AT+-emout15.mail.aol.com> Welcome Shaydra! You'll like it here, it's fun, I know I'm enjoying it. I'm a witch, and have been studying wicca on and off for about 3 years, but I didn't dedicate myself till last spring. I know what you mean about feeling drawn to the Tayledras, me too! Anyway, feel free to e-mail me privately if you wish to discuss religion, you can do so at: ShadowJaz-+AT+-aol.com ============================================================= As far as language classes go, all I can say is: Yeah, what she said. Practising a language is definitely the best way to learn it. Case in point, when you know a language and don't use it for awhile, you get rusty and tend to forget. I think those Herald trainees are pretty lucky, I'd love to have an opportunity like that! Blessed Be, NightShade OIB, LotPW, and (soon to be) High Priestess Of All Things Nocturnal ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Nov 96 00:59 EST From: infodyn-+AT+-distrinet.com.uy (Eleonora Scoseria) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Ooops! I put my foot in it Message-ID: Well, as Korendil pointed out almost gently ;) I raised a much discussed issue when I wondered about the Grove born. Well, my excuses, it would seem I did not do my homework properly (I did not read through the whole archives) but somebody else raised the subject about the Grove born being reborn MOs and noone said anything so I did not imagine the subject had been so much debated. Can anyone tell me in a nutshell what the conclusion was?? I don't have the time to wade through the archives. Blessings, Ele ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Nov 1996 23:52:36 +0000 (GMT) From: Tensen To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: language classes/witches Message-ID: On Tue, 5 Nov 1996, Pam Dziedzic wrote: > "I was wondering how many people on this ML is a witch?" > > I was thinking the same thing myself. Anyone have some theories as to why > witchy-types are drawn to Misty? I've been studying Wicca for about a year, > and I feel the stongest pull when I read about the Tayledras. Healing the > land, living with nature, these people know how to treat Gaia! > I think what you'd really want to know would be either who are pagan or whatever the truly politically correct form of that is. or those that are sensitive. Since I know there are more than a couple of people that match both those without being Wicca or a witch. Yes, me being one. Tensen ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Nov 1996 22:53:22 CST From: "Hth." To: Subject: Talia, Vanyel, An'desha Message-ID: <04NOV96.24720814.0056.MUSIC-+AT+-ACADEMIC.TRUMAN.EDU> My take on the matter. Talia *was* too timid, as a young adolescent in a new situation. As an adult, that seems to have vanished. She is now the Counselor Troi of Valdemar -- always smooth, always with just the right advice, beloved by all. Perfect husband, adorable kid (presumably), problems solved. Ick. My take on the matter. Should I add Vanyel's Champion to my sig? I don't happen to think he was too wrapped up in himself. Nor do I think he was perfect. I think most of Vanyel's problem was that he neglected himself and his own needs in the quest to better everyone else's life. The man actually felt guilty every time he was happy, because maybe he wasn't doing enough for other people -- maybe he wasn't being fair to Jonne, maybe he was putting his family in danger, maybe he was leading the serving girls on by being too friendly. He was too wrapped up in *other* people's needs to take good care of himself, and it took a physical and emotional toll on him. I like it that An'desha is hard to classify sexually. He seems fairly heterosexual, but open to a relationship with a man, but generally not much of a sexual person. He can't really be pigeonholed, and I respect Misty a lot for avoiding easy answers when it came to An'desha. I think he's one of the neater characters in the series. Not everyone is solidly one thing or another, not even solidly bisexual. I've had relationships with women I consider quite heterosexual, and I don't discount the possibility that I might someday meet a man I'd like to be involved with. Real human beings are sometimes a little ambiguous, like An'desha. I guess that's part of why I've enjoyed that character so much -- he seems especially genuine somehow. HTH r618-+AT+-academic.truman.edu "You never know what goes on inside a giant badger." --Third Rock from the Sun ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Nov 1996 23:30:52 +0000 From: myktshr-+AT+-ldd.net (miyako hirao) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Braid: You or Thou/The love of my life (y'all know who it Message-ID: <199611050525.XAA20834-+AT+-cdale3.midwest.net> On the "Thou or you" argu... erm discussion: I'm getting confuzzled here, so I think I'll just stick with "you" for singular and "y'all" for plural in my pseudo-southern belle accent -- it's horrible, though. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Herald Jacquelle wrote: >>>Wait a minute!!!! Data wasn't WILLINGLY kissing that Borg Queen, was he? No, he wasn't..I am in complete denial. She was blackmailing him. <<< No he WASN'T !!!! I'm in complete denial as well. She wasn't blackmailing him -- she was, I think, exploiting him because all he really wanted to do was save his friends' lives, but with the emotion chip, he could be tempted, and the B*TCH knew that!! Sorry, y'all, moment of insanity Then, Kory wrote: >>>Actually, from the preview I saw when I went to see Romeo and Juliet, either he gets captured by the Borg, or it's really Lores...erm..Lore...Lores' the herald..gotta get my fiction straight;> <<< NOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!! Okay, on one of the movie synopses I read, it said that Data got Borged (too lazy to spell assimi... what?), but he was actually pretending, which takes a damned strong character to do, and Data can do it 'cuz he's the best and the greatest... among other things . But that does not excuse him from the injustice he has done me! There was a term in TOS that was something like "The Captain's Woman" -- I'm the "Android's Woman," dammit! The Borg Queen must DIE!!!! Tasha Yar IS dead! . Sorry people.... I'm nuts about Data. Can you tell? But Lore was one sexy insane bad android prototype! Too bad they had to dismantle him after that incident with the rogue Borgs. Okay, for some *real* Misty stuff.... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ On sheep: Visit http://www.muttonbones.com (I think) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Undine wrote: >>>Mel, please read SB. Even for all of my carping about Mutant Squids and boring Empire bits, it's the better book by far, IMO. Danya's correct about _Silver Gryphon_ being good only as a doorstop. Or you could use it as the proverbial blunt object *weg*<<< I believe that the book is, as Danya has stated and Undine has seconded, good only as a doorstop. The source of my confusion, I believe, lies in the lack of protest from environmental groups to stop publishing the book to save paper and trees, and ultimately, the Earth. As a blunt object, however, depending on the position of the blow and the force applied, the effects may be quite different from the desired... Oy! Am I talking like Data again? Hope not.... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Emily wrote: >>>I guess I'm talking about a Star Trek concept: Infinite Diversity in >>>Infinite Combination. It is something that Misty's books have, and I don't >>>want her writing to lose it. I'm afraid that they are starting to.<<< *Now* I know pretty much why I liked Misty's books from the beginning! The concept of IDIC can apply to any civilization, modern, ancient, real or fictional. But our opinions are quite mutual. Her Karsites have become too Heraldish, most of her non-Herald characters have adopted the Herald-like attitude towards cross-cultural issues, and that the Heraldic Way is the ONE TRUE WAY . But even in Star Trek, I think that the Federation is winning over. The Klingons, however, still retain the value of honor. BTW, I didn't really like the twist that the Klingons are the bad guys again. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ NightShade wrote: >>>ObMisty: Umm, did anyone else like Silver Gryphon? Please, no one throw anything at me .<<< I really didn't like it, but it was because the storyline dragged out into the span of a novel. IMO, Black Gryphon should have been the last book in the series with two books leading up to the end of the war when Skan & co. have to flee from the site of Urtho's tower. And no, I won't throw anything at you... Oops! Spiffy just coughed up a hairball! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Okay, I'm done. For some reason, I am obsessed with Data. Is there anyone else suffering from the same problem?:Not bloody likely!: :Hush, Spiffy, someone might actually be listening.: Love, Summersong & Spiffy the Cat *********************************** Akiko Hirao "Some of the colonists objected to having an anatomically correct android running around without any clothes on" -- Juliana Soong (ST:TNG Inheritance) *********************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Nov 96 00:25:21 -0500 From: dsarik-+AT+-PO-Box.McGill.CA To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Fluff/Re: Writing Music Message-ID: <199611050537.AAA11406-+AT+-sirocco.CC.McGill.CA> On Tue, 5 Nov 1996, Lynne Markova wrote: >Lady Sophia wipes away a tear from listening to "Adagio for Strings," and >replies: "Adagio for Strings"?!?!?!?!?! I *love* that! Have you heard the "Agnus Dei" that's that piece arranged for choir? To die for! I want to sing that sooo badly >> By the way, it's even harder to try and write music out. Ugh. >> >I would say it is harder, because in most schools we do not get much >practice in writing music. Even if you take a theory course, that's one >or two hours a day, only - whereas, we spend eight or more hours per day >reading, writing, and using language. I do know it became much easier to >transcribe/take dictation/learn music after I spent at least two hours per >day "studying" music and listening to music.... I'm not sure if I'm >expressing myself terribly well here.... just that music itself is a >"language" and it is hard to use it, without first investing lots of time. Actually, what I meant was writing music out onto e-mail. It's really hard. Ask Heather if she actually managed to read what I sent her. I've done a lot of that theory stuff, actually, and I agree that it helps increase fluency. >(Lady Sophia's first language *was* music, but that's a looooong story). Oh, a woman after my heart! >KAAAA-BOOOOMMMMMM!!!!!!!!!! (Thunderclaps resound!!!!) > >Rise, Lady Adrianne!! To you be conferred the title of High Priestess of >the Goddess of Music and Song. Your duties are to be First Bard of all >Bards (or Pen-barrd, if you are of Keltic extraction), supervise all bards >and keep them in line (not an easy task), hear all petitions directed to >the Goddess of Song and Music, and be an expert on All Things Musical. >I bestow upon my High Priestess a golden lyre, lute or harp, and a laurel >wreath. Ooooh, my! May I be an Acolyte, hoping to rise in the Great Scheme of All Things Musical? Adrianne? Lady Sophia? I would like to contribute my Golden Voice to singing Your praises. love, free bard woodlark, who has |I baptize thee in the name of the Big nothing to do with deniz the |Twitch, the Little Twitch, and the Holy High Prstess of Procr. except |Ghost. Who, no doubt, is a Twitch, for an address and music. |too. dsarik-+AT+-PO-Box.McGill.CA -- Robert Penn Warren ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Nov 96 00:28:21 -0500 From: dsarik-+AT+-PO-Box.McGill.CA To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Braid:circles/braiding/responses to Message-ID: <199611050538.AAA11458-+AT+-sirocco.CC.McGill.CA> Spencer wrote: >>[I wrote]: >> Whoa! Yeah, sure, but where are hyperbolas intersecting with other hyperbolas?<< Are you considering Ma'ar's castle and Urtho's tower to each be a foci of the hyperbola? If so, I don't think it would work since, of course, they would never intersect. Then, of course, Misty would never get her nifty intersection points. And, of course, the Dhorisha plains and Lake Evendim wouldn't be so nice and round since on using the hyperbola analogy, they would create a single shock wave of X dimension. At least, I think so, if I understand deniz correctly. However, expanding ripples from each point would intersect, whether they form exact spherical waves or ellipsoidal waves or parabolic curves.<< Umm, Spencer? I don't think we're on the same wavelength here. I never said that hyperbolas intersect each other. I'm saying that the hyperbolas *describe* where the *ripples* will intersect. ---------------- rainwood said: >>[I said]: >>>talk about. I highlight what I want to quote, copy it (CTRL-C), switch windows, paste it (CTRL-V), and put little >>> and <<< around it. <<< :-) Like that? Cennydd, your braiding technique either didn't work with my software, or I am just too sheep-headed to use it. but thank you so much for taking the time to explain it. I think it must be because I use Netscape Mail or something. However, you are still going to get the gold encrusted jewel dripping truffle sheep - and I will send Deniz a bejeweled marzipan version of same. . . I guess someone had better sheep me off to computer school pretty quick here!<< DOH! I *knew* I forgot something. Rainwood, you should also write who you're quoting before you use their words. Thanks for the sheep. ********************* Lady Sophia said: >>Lady Sophia wipes away a tear from listening to "Adagio for Strings," and replies:<< I think my alter ego is gonna respond to this post enthusiastically. >>Congratulations to all of you who are entering into the wave discussion. Physics was one of my favorite subjects! I hereby nominate all of you for honorary membership in the Blues (but only if you want to be nominated!)<< Thanks! I accept. Ke'leecha said: >> The descriptions of the ripples that have been coming have been awesome! It was a nebulous concept for me when I was reading, and you have cleared the questioning cobwebs from my mind. I appreciate your work, even if I am hoping to be the goddess of those who hate calculus. Physics is okay though....<< You're welcome! :) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ rainwood wrote: >>Personally, I kindof think of life as a crucible. There is no growth without pain, no advances without struggle. Perfection breeds complacency, and that would be terrible.<< Yup yup yup! Sounds like me! One of my mottos is, "stagnation is bad." <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Kaatje said: >>I don't know if I'd call them fantastically perfect. They've all got problems--Talia was *way* too timid, Vanyel was always wrapped up in himself (sheeps from the Vanyel-worshippers....hey, I like him too, but he's not perfect!), Elspeth was way too hard-headed, etc. etc.<< Notice the past tense you used. By the end of their developments, they are perfect ... well, Vanyel has that one lapse when he goes insane, but Savil was just murdered, so he was justified. )))))))))))))))))))) Herald Trainee Shadra Ayes said: >>Having travelled to Montreal to study French myself, I can say that's definitely the fastest way to learn!<< You've been to Montreal? We must laugh and dance and hold hands and exclaim over our points in common! (I live there now). Actually, I know Shadra from another place. Everyone, I'm making a quick intro of her. Shadra is a really interesting character who definitely tithes regularly to Mat, mine God. She also runs the RCMH (Royal Canadian Mounted Heralds). Welcome! (Umm, I'm getting my dues in to you soon. Really! I only got the newsletter last week, so I feel justified in taking a bit of time. By the way, when's your birthday? %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Carrach, I'm an XNFP, too! Yay! love, deniz sarikaya, High Priestess |I was a brassbound Idealist in those days. of Procrastination and Holy |If you are an Idealist it does not matter Custodian of the B-Day List. |what you do or what goes on around you Confused? Write me! |because it isn't real anyway. dsarik-+AT+-PO-Box.McGill.CA -- Robert Penn Warren ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Nov 1996 23:39:30 CST From: "Hth." To: Subject: lifebonds, true ways, Elspeth, etc. Message-ID: <04NOV96.25551291.0056.MUSIC-+AT+-ACADEMIC.TRUMAN.EDU> Hmm, I don't know. I think you could be lifebonded to someone who, ah, wasn't exactly what you expected in a mate, without being unhappy. Of course, I have no proof of this, per se. An'desha wasn't unhappy with Firesong, exactly, and certainly not in bed. They weren't meant for each other, but I don't think that was because An'desha was straight. Plenty of people find themselves in love with people they never would have expected, and it doesn't seem to me that lifebonding should work any differently, at least in principle. By the way, guys, just because there is more than one true way, it does not necessarily follow that all ways are true. I don't want to give the impression that I condone treating people like dirt and then justifying it with, "But it's my way." Just that people sometimes take unexpected paths to the center, if you will. The girl in Fire Rose actually likes pretty things? Wow! I think it reveals something strange about my psyche that while reading about certain characters, all I can think is, "She'd be *so* hard to shop for." What can I say? I like giving presents. I think I could be lifebonded to a man, but he'd have to have pierced ears Jewelry is what separates humanity from the beasts. You know, I think seriously considering hanging a Council member with a glass-studded rope *might* be an impediment to being a Herald. Oh, sure, everyone wants to some days, but I think Heralds are supposed to rise above that sort of temptation. Something about, um, compassion or something like that. Not that I have a clue what scene we're talking about, but I can't recall the Council ever doing anything that really merits an excruciatingly painful death. Am I missing something? You know, I never bonded with the Tayledras, and I'm not sure why. They seem like nice people. Maybe they seem a little too nice. I admit to getting irked these days when we get more Perfect Misty People in their wise and noble utopias, and I always felt like the Tayledras were the capstone of Misty's ongoing treatise on good government. And, wow, is it mere coincidence that they live like Misty, in blissful rural isolation with birds and gay men? Or maybe it's just that we never see any Tayledras women, and I freely admit to bonding much more quickly with women than with men, even marvelous men like Firesong. Or maybe it's that we hear about them mostly in the Winds series, and I could never abide the Winds series. Maybe I'll warm up to them during Owlflight. I don't think pagans gravitate toward Misty in specific. I think it's the genre that attracts us, and Misty is just one of the better writers in the genre. We tend to, on the positive side, have a sense of wonder about life and an attraction to magic and mysticism, which is reflected nicely in fantasy. On the down side, we also tend to romanticize the past and feel that anything is better than reality, and those somewhat darker tendancies also lead people toward fantasy. I also think that fantasy attracts the world's outsiders, like pagans, because of the element of the heroic involved. We often feel too powerless to change a world that isn't working for us quite the way we'd like, and for a while we get to share the experiences of someone who really can and does change her or his world, right the wrongs, all those things we wish we could do. Disclaimer: I am not ascribing any or all of these feelings and motives to *all* fantasy readers indiscriminately. If you don't feel this way, fine. I'm not saying that you do. Just that it's pretty common, judging from all the fantasy readers I've met in my life. Okay, enough babbling for today. I hunger, and go in search of food. HTH r618-+AT+-academic.truman.edu "You never know what goes on inside a giant badger." --Third Rock from the Sun ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Nov 1996 00:22:03 -0500 From: Debra Cebulski To: "'mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk'" Subject: RE: linguistic question Message-ID: <01BBCAAF.5F4A1A00-+AT+-kerowyn> Char wrote: This may sound like a sily question, but I've been wondering about it = all=20 the sam.e The question has to deal with the words kestra'chern and shay'a'chern. =20 What do you think the "chern" means? might the two words be connected? I'm not a language expert. However, Tylendel gives a translation of = shay'a'chern as "'one whose lover is like self,' with a sexual = connotation to the word 'self' that makes it clear that they aren't = talking about incest or similar interests." (MPawn, p. 145). My = personal guess is that "chern" means "lover" or something similar, and = that kestra'chern would translate loosely as "sexual healer." =20 All the best, Deb Cebulski Lady of the Pink Wand kerowyn-+AT+-waltham.harvard.net ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 00:28:20 -0700 From: DawnRain To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: lots of things Message-ID: <327EEC94.4151-+AT+-geocities.com> Katherine M Brielmaier wrote: > And I agree with Emily about Karse. It was *way* more fun when we knew > nothing about it. Much more mysterious. Hmmm....much like many > relationships seem to go for me lately... Ahh...but now we switch our attention to Iftel! We know SOOOO little about them... MorningStar ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 00:32:25 -0700 From: DawnRain To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Mini-Braid: /perfection/data Message-ID: <327EED89.8B8-+AT+-geocities.com> Eleonora Scoseria wrote: > > I guess what Van actually says about Gwena is that she has no real HUMAN > experience. So I always took it to mean that the grove born are not > reincarnated Heralds but spirits who have never been in the world before. > Does anybody else agree? If so, how can they guide their chosen without > making even more mistakes? Also, do you think those grove born Companions > ever reincarnate as Heralds? > Just questions. > Wind to thy winds, > Ele The first few lines I have said myself(in a later post from yours but an earlier one from this one) so I'll leave them alone. As to Companions reincarnating as Heralds? INTERESTING, to say the least. I'd like to see what would happen with that... And I suppose that it's possible, although for some reason I've always thought of them stepping on to something of a higher plane. [shrug] point to speculate later... MorningStar ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 00:42:36 -0700 From: DawnRain To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Oops!/Bunnicula/Dune/Duane/MZB Message-ID: <327EEFEC.3432-+AT+-geocities.com> undine wrote: > Summersong, _Bunnicula_ is the first in a series of books by James Howe. > The books, about the Monroe family, are written by Harold the family > dog with assistance from Chester, the always suspicious cat. > Bunnicula is a bunny that the family adopts after finding him abandoned in > a theater. When vegetables drained of their juice begin turning up, > Chester suspects that Bunnicula is a vampire rabbit. The other books in > the series are: _The Celery Stalks at Midnight_,_Nighty Nightmare_, > _Howliday Inn_, and _Return to Howliday Inn_. Fun reading! > ************************* [MorningStar's eyes light up] I LOVE those books... Have for a VERY long time now. I don't think I've read _Nighty Nightmare_ yet, though... I'll have to look it up. > > About Diane Duane's books: _So You Want To Be a Wizard_ was reissued as a > $6 paperback in May (in the US). _Deep Wizardry_ is due to be re-issued > this month. And I'm assuming that the other 2 books will be reissued next > year. I couldn't wait that long so I ordered a copy of _Wizards Abroad_ > from a British import company. It's so hard to wait for the US release of > books knowing that they're available now in the UK (like _Interesting > Times_ or _Maskerade_). Sure, I believe in instant gratification ;> > ******************************** [Star's eyes widen and brighten even more] Woah, wait. There's *4* books in that series?!? I have the first three in hardcover together, a gift from my fiance a couple years ago, but I GOTTA find the other one... [Star considers rushing out now but remembers that the bookstore is not open at 12:40 am...] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 00:46:57 -0700 From: DawnRain To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: lots of things Message-ID: <327EF0F1.1A2-+AT+-geocities.com> Nicole Dubuc wrote: > I too think that Karse was better off without Firecats so similar > to Companions coming into existence. I much prefered when Altra was > portrayed as not needing food or being entirely mortal, because it was > something new. I hope that Karse doesn't completely about-face and become > another Valdemar. I think Altra liked it better that way too! But on the whole, I'm enjoying the series and am just waiting to see what happens next... > I recall reading (a looooong time ago) about filling out some kind > of paperwork to be a herald? or Taleydras? Did I really read that? Who > has that info? I would be extremely appreciative (okay, I'd be your > worshipper for a day) if you could send me that info. Thanks heaps of > sheeps . Send it my way too! That sounds fascinating... > Has anyone read Yon Ill Wind by Piers Anthony yet? Ha! This was a > blatant attempt to convert some of you to Xanth... No, but I intend to ASAP, translation, I'm going to visit the bookstore tomorrow now that I've been paid... > I really liked The Fire Rose. I wanted to get it for a while and > when I did, I started reading it in between classes (crossing the street > and the like, so I nearly got hit reading it, but it was a good book!). > Beauty and the Beast has always been my favorite fairy tale. What was my > point in mentioningthis? Ummm...Sorry, a chem midterm ate my brain. I'll agree, wonderful book. Does anyone know if she's going to expand on it? Perhaps something farther about Rose? It intrigued me, and now I'm curious... I, too, waited a while before reading it, which I shouldn't have. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 00:54:47 -0700 From: DawnRain To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Ooops! I put my foot in it Message-ID: <327EF2C7.36C7-+AT+-geocities.com> Eleonora Scoseria wrote: > Well, as Korendil pointed out almost gently ;) I raised a much discussed > issue when I wondered about the Grove born. > Well, my excuses, it would seem I did not do my homework properly (I did not > read through the whole archives) but somebody else raised the subject about > the Grove born being reborn MOs and noone said anything so I did not imagine > the subject had been so much debated. > Can anyone tell me in a nutshell what the conclusion was?? I don't have the > time to wade through the archives. > Blessings, > Ele [Star blushes] I must add my apologies, I'm sure... I haven't the time to go into the archives, either, nor did I really want to when I could read the nice, new messages waiting in my mail box! MorningStar ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 01:02:13 -0700 From: DawnRain To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: linguistic question Message-ID: <327EF485.6C1-+AT+-geocities.com> Debra Cebulski wrote: > I'm not a language expert. However, Tylendel gives a translation of = > shay'a'chern as "'one whose lover is like self,' with a sexual = > connotation to the word 'self' that makes it clear that they aren't = > talking about incest or similar interests." (MPawn, p. 145). My = > personal guess is that "chern" means "lover" or something similar, and = > that kestra'chern would translate loosely as "sexual healer." =20 Ok, can't resist adding my change here, either... Perhaps "chern" means something along the lines of "inner self" or "soul"? After all, "ashke" is beloved and "shay'kreth'ashke" is lifebonded love, so I tend to think of the "shay" part as being the lover connotation. Also, keep in mind that out of the terms we are discussing, "kestra'chern" is Kaled'a'in and the others are Tayledras, and while there's not that much difference, there is enough difference to cause confusion, right? MorningStar ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Nov 1996 20:27:05 +0000 From: Adrianne To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Life Span in Valdemar Message-ID: <199611051035.KAA00870-+AT+-enterprise.powerup.com.au> What's the average life span in Valdemar - natural, that is! In AoQ Keren is 'slightly more than twice Talia's age' (p 256 Legend edition) which is about 16 at this stage. It goes on to say, Keren was assigned to 'teaching full-time at the Collegium when the advance of middle years made it time to think of taking them [Keren and Teren] from field duty.' If she's now about 35 and she's been teaching for at least 3 years (because she was there when Talia first arrived), making her not much more than 30 when she was taken off field duty - and that's middle aged? I'm 36 and I hardly consider myself middle aged!!! Lady Adrianne, High Priestess of the Goddess of Music and Song, First Bard of all Bards, & Renunciate ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 'Laugh for me. Joy is in the ears that hear.' Foamfollower, First Chronicles of Thomas Covenant, The Unbeliever ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ajfabbey-+AT+-powerup.com.au ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Nov 1996 20:52:35 +0000 From: "Adrianne" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Physics/Writing Music/Firebird/ Message-ID: <199611051101.LAA04189-+AT+-enterprise.powerup.com.au> Lady Sophia wrote: > > > KAAAA-BOOOOMMMMMM!!!!!!!!!! (Thunderclaps resound!!!!) > > Rise, Lady Adrianne!! To you be conferred the title of High Priestess of > the Goddess of Music and Song. Your duties are to be First Bard of all > Bards (or Pen-barrd, if you are of Keltic extraction), supervise all bards > and keep them in line (not an easy task), hear all petitions directed to > the Goddess of Song and Music, and be an expert on All Things Musical. > I bestow upon my High Priestess a golden lyre, lute or harp, and a laurel > wreath. > > BTW, my birthday is 20 July 1967, and I am an INFJ, > > Blessed be! > > Lady Sophia, trilling away > Goddess of Song and Music > > > My apologies becasue my previous reply to this post seems to have become lost in the cosmic viod so I shall attempt to remember my words of wisdom - although I can usually only do it once! Anyway, here goes: Thank you, Lady Sophia, for your gracious and generous response to my plea. And I humbly accept the position of High Priestess. I thank youi for the laurel which resides comfortably upon my head and also thanks for the lyre, lute or harp - do I have to choose or can I keep them all ... please? I hereby accept the responsibility to supervise all bards and to keep them in line and I promise to write my first song for you. Deniz wrote: >Ooooh, my! May I be an Acolyte, hoping to rise in the Great Scheme of >All Things Musical? Adrianne? Lady Sophia? I would like to >contribute my Golden Voice to singing Your praises. > Deniz, unless the Lady herself objects, I see no impediment to your becoming an acolyte. Golden voices are always welcome - soprano or alto? Does your own god have any objections? Obmisty: If I remember correctly, there was mention some days (weeks?) ago about Alberich being special in that he was Chosen in spite of coming from Karse. Am I correct in this? How did this come about? - I mean, which book does this take place? P.S. I apologise in advance if the other post eventually turns up as well as this one! Lady Adrianne, High Priestess of the Goddess of Music and Song, First Bard of all Bards, & Renunciate ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 'Laugh for me. Joy is in the ears that hear.' Foamfollower, First Chronicles of Thomas Covenant, The Unbeliever ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ajfabbey-+AT+-powerup.com.au ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Nov 96 10:25 EST From: infodyn-+AT+-distrinet.com.uy (Eleonora Scoseria) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Life Span in Valdemar Message-ID: >What's the average life span in Valdemar - natural, that is! In AoQ >Keren is 'slightly more than twice Talia's age' (p 256 Legend edition) >which is about 16 at this stage. It goes on to say, Keren was assigned >to 'teaching full-time at the Collegium when the advance of middle >years made it time to think of taking them [Keren and Teren] from >field duty.' If she's now about 35 and she's been teaching for at >least 3 years (because she was there when Talia first arrived), making >her not much more than 30 when she was taken off field duty - and >that's middle aged? I'm 36 and I hardly consider myself middle aged!!! >Lady Adrianne, High Priestess of the Goddess of Music and Song, First Bard >of all Bards, & Renunciate I guess the life span cannot be so limited (at least for those who are not on active duty and making an effort to get killed before 40 ;) I remember Shavri telling Van in Magic's Promise that Randale would not live to see 50, and she was horrified by the notion thinking he would be dying young. That's all I can come up with. The very best to you all, Ele ------------------------------ End of MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 920 *********************************