MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 956 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Reply to: WoChange by Rozanna McNeer 2) Re: Yfandes by Chris & Sean Talbot 3) I'm back! Arrows, SG, SKitty, help! by Becky Anne Christensen 4) Petition as Priestess/Acolyte to Lady Jaguar by tygriss-+AT+-juno.com (Sara A Youngblood) 5) Stolen Silver/Equine Telepathy/Talia/Art/Music by singer-+AT+-iglobal.net 6) Re: Companion's Grove?/ by "Linda Malcor, Ph.D" 7) Re: Foresight by "Linda Malcor, Ph.D" 8) Re: daycare by "Linda Malcor, Ph.D" 9) Re: fluff schizophrenia by DawnRain 10) Apologies by DawnRain 11) My very first braid! by Paradox 12) Lots o' stuff... by Kat 13) Re: ...Equine Telepathy... by "Ramona Winkelbauer [SERA]" 14) Re: Braid: Genderless/Songs/Imps/Fluff by infodyn-+AT+-distrinet.com.uy (Eleonora Scoseria) 15) Re: Braid: Genderless/Songs/Imps/Fluff by "Linda Malcor, Ph.D" 16) Re: Genderless by Becky Anne Christensen 17) Re: Apologies by Jaguar 18) BDAY ALERT/Re: Cennydd's last post by dsarik-+AT+-PO-Box.McGill.CA ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 16 Nov 1996 21:53:19 -0500 From: Rozanna McNeer To: "mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk" Subject: Reply to: WoChange Message-ID: <199611162210_MC1-C06-3630-+AT+-compuserve.com> Jacquelle frothed : > Ok, how many of you noticed that on the cover of Winds of Change > GWENA HAS A BIT IN HER MOUTH!!!!! Companions DON'T use > bits! What was Jody Lee thinking? That is a fundamental error! Well, I also personally happen to think it is a fundamental error to have pink and purple Companions too, or have Kethry with blond hair, or have Kero wearing armor by Laura Ashley, but that's just IMO. While we are on the topic of Artly things - I really dislike most of Larry's human portraits in the books. Shaiknam and Gerber? HURL! what is wrong with that face?!?! I've heard of wide or lantern jaws, but really! And silver veil? She was supposed to look ageless, right? the last I knew, ageless did not mean wrinkles like some sun-worshipping 80 year old crone whose face has turned to leather from UV exposure!! The only human portrait of his I did like was the one of Amberdrake Alone. rant off -- sorry about that. You know who I'd really love to see do some Misty related stuff? MICHEAL WHELAN!!!! Firemist, who eyes her somewhat naked walls and wonders where she can get prints of MW stuff. . . ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Nov 1996 22:20:16 -0500 From: Chris & Sean Talbot To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Yfandes Message-ID: <199611170320.WAA12507-+AT+-nemesis.idirect.com> At 04:51 PM 11/16/96 GMT, you wrote: >I've been pondering Yfandes' seeming Foresight, and I'm curious as to >what all of you think...was her Foresight (:I knew when I Chose you >that our bond would come to this.:) specific or general? I mean, do >you think she actually knew that x number of years down the road she >and Vanyel would be fighting off Leareth (is that it? I'm so awful >with names from books I haven't read in over a year or so) in the >Forest of Sorrows? First he didn't fight him in Sorrows he fought them in the mountains as it said something about the pass. >Or was is a more general Foresight, like she knew >that eventually they would die fighting some kind of evil somewhere? I believe it would be general because Vanyel had the same dreams. What I believe is that she knew through Vanyels foresight about that happening and made out what was really going to happen and then said that she knew about it when she chose him. >Do you suppose that if it was specific that would explain why she >hadn't Chose for so long? If she knew exactly how her life would >turn out, she would've had to have waited for Vanyel to come along >for her to Choose. Why would she wait. Foresight is ever changing. The future is not set. She chould very easily have chosen another youngling with the mage gift and it could have been him or her fighting Leareth and not Vanyel. Aistes ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Nov 1996 20:42:48 -0800 (PST) From: Becky Anne Christensen To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: I'm back! Arrows, SG, SKitty, help! Message-ID: Heyla all! Sorry I just kinda disappeared without warning, my family came uot from NEw Hampshire (we're in California, about as far as you can get) for a week or so, and I wa spending all my time with them (we went to Disneyland, and even stayed in the Disneyland Hotel! Fun!) Right before I disappeared, I think I was being considered for Handmaiden of Procrastination, was I granted my wish oh wise and powerful Mat? *please* Okay, Misty stuff I re-read the Arrows trilogy, and again remembered why it's my favorite. sigh, I love those books. Oh yeah, and I *finally* got through the rest of SG (for those of you who don't remember, I've had the book for months now, but could never force myself to read, which has never happened with me and a book before) And I once again realized why I never finished it to begin with, crappy book. Sorry, I love Misty dearly, and most of all her other things, but it really truly was a crappy book. :( I also read SKitty, I first got Catfantastic when I was in elementary school, and paid absolutely no attention to authors, and had never heard of Misty. Now when I read it again, I could definitely tell form the style and such that it was Misty. It's such a good story too. I also read Gate of the Kittens (I think that's the name) anyone who has read Catfantastic, and understands that one, please explain it to me, it was really good, but throughout the whole story I found myself wondering, "What the heck does this mean, or where are they now, or what was that supposed to be about?" Thank you! Sorry if I missed anything that was directed at me right after I disappeared, I gave up on the 1000+ messages from the list, and just deleted them all. Welcome to all newbies that joined while I was missing! Glad you're here! I also found out something very interesting about myself and was wondering if any of you wise and knowledgable people knew anything about it. My parents told me all they can remember. Right after I was born, my mother noticed that I would have seizures semi-frequently. Now she was home with me and my sister all day, and my dad was in the mountains working on engineering some dam, and would only be home on weekends. Everyone thought she was just being a paranoid mother, and that she was just being overprotective and I wasn't really having seizures. They were wrong. She took me into the doctor, who said there was something with my brain, the nerves weren't insulated or fully developed or something (I wasn't born prematurely either) well, they treated it and they went away. This is apparently a pre-cursor to epilepsy, and if they hadn't have caught it that soon (I was almost 2 years old when they finally stopped) I probably would have been an epileptic. She said there was a name for this, but she couldn't remember what. Does anyone know what the name is, or where I might find out more about this? I'm really curious about wht kind of effects this might have had, or maybe even still does have. One interesting thing is that I am left handed, and left handedness has been associated with problems during pregnancy, birth, or infancy. It can be a minor form of brain damage. Okay, if anyone knows anything, all information would be useful, thank you! Sorry for rambling. :) Bye! Lady Becky(LIG), Goddess of Tofu and Dry Breakfast Cereals Founder of the AftPoSWT (confused? Just ask.) Mailing List Homepage http://www.psnw.com/~deb/becky/misty.html beckyanne-+AT+-iforge.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Nov 1996 00:16:32 EST From: tygriss-+AT+-juno.com (Sara A Youngblood) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Petition as Priestess/Acolyte to Lady Jaguar Message-ID: <19961116.231308.8247.1.Tygriss-+AT+-juno.com> Since I can't seem to find my Lady's address, I hope no one minds if I send my call out here. I humbly stand in your presence to request your acceptance of my official worship at your feet. I wish to share my knowledge of Quick Whiskers, Light Paws and Glittering Eyes. I beseech thee! Hear mine plea! Accept this soul into thy service forever and evermore. Tygriss-+AT+-juno.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Nov 1996 23:34:46 -0600 From: singer-+AT+-iglobal.net To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Stolen Silver/Equine Telepathy/Talia/Art/Music Message-ID: Re: Stolen Silver I just finished reading Stolen Silver, Alberich's story in the anthology Horse Fantastic. I was not disappionted in the story, but I was really sorry when it ended-much to soon for me. I wanted so much *more*. I would love to know how Kantor got himself tithed to the temple; and how he knew he needed to be there in the first place. And he never even told Alberich his name; though, admittendly there wasn't much time. Still, that seems unlike a Companion; I imagine he was woried about Alberich, and the only thing on his mind was getting his Chosen to safety. What I really wanted to know was how Alberich began his relationship with Kantor, and how he got to Valdemar, and who he met, and how he adapted to this incredibly new and frightening (and wonderful) situation. There was some of that, but not as much as I wanted. And how did the Voice trap him, exactly? Mostly it was too short, and over before I was ready. I would read a book about Alberich! Re: Equine Telepathy After I finished Stolen Silver, I was thinking about the part where Alberich is fervently hoping that Silver is not responding directly to his thoughts, because he does not need another "witch power" to call him to the attention of the Voices. And now I offer to you all that this kind of mental link between a horse and rider is not really such a farfetched thing. I do this; mindtouching the horses is part of my Gift. But I have known others in my Clan, who did not have my Gifts, and who were able to communicate with their partners this way. They tell me that they just thought about where they wanted to go, or that they wanted a gallop, or whatever, and their horses would respond to these thoughts alone. Some even cultivated this ability to every horse they trained, consciously forming pictures in their head for their horses to "see" and respond to. Granted, this wouldn't just happen......it takes years of working together as partners, building a foundation of trust and even love. Some will never achieve this level of communication with their horses at all. I imagine that more than Shin'a'in are aware of this; Vanyel was a sensitive enough horseman to notice such a bond, and there are others outClan who have, especially some horsebreeding families. My theory is that horses are telepathic creatures partly because in their natural state they live as a herd. Have you ever watched a herd galloping all out, yet constantly aware of where every other member of the herd is, down to the tiniest foals? They never step on each other; they maintain exact distances between themselves. So this natural ability of the horse has been noticed and cultivated by the most sensitive of humans, desiring partnership in the truest sense. (apologies if this is out there; if you hadn't noticed already, I am quite passionate about my windborn siblings. It is quite normal where I am from, to the occasional chagrin of would-be suitors. Many times have I heard, "If only she looked at me the way she looks at her horse...") Re: Talia I can't remember who suggested Indigo Girls "Girl With the Weight of the World In Her Hands" for Talia in our Character/Music matchup, but I am also familiar with the song and to me it doesn't seen to fit. The melody is lovely, but listeneng to the words, I think only the first verse really applies to Talia, even when she first came to Haven. The girl in the song is portrayed as a martyr, and I have never seen Talia as a martyr. Beleaguered, yes, human yes, but never a martyr. I have said before that she deserved a lot of credit for overcoming the abuse and troubles that she did; it has occured to me once or twice that some of those things she overcame a little *too* quickly. Not that a person can't heal, especially someone as strong as Talia, and as loved, but that it seemed a little too quick. Granted, we probably didn't get a blow-by-blow of Talia's recovery. And I guess Mind Healers are a wonderful thing. Re Abuse: Misty has dealt with abuse and neglect of all kinds quite a lot in her Valdemar books, especially as those things affect her primary characters. I am glad to see that she does deal with the subject, but sometimes it feels like she may "soften" it a bit. What I mean by this is, the abused characters (notably Vanyel and Talia) seem to have *someone* that they can talk to, somone who cares about them a little, who will help them as much as they can, even if that person's power is limited. Does it seem to anyone else that realism might call for at least *some* of the mistreated to be completely isolated, with no one at all to care about what is happening to them? I guess the child Stefen could fall into this category, but that part of his life was never really discussed much. The only other I can think of is Neave, but he was mentioned only in passing.Even Nyara had a little support (granted Falconsbreath murdered anyone who cared for her eventually, but she still had someone, however briefly.) This is not a criticism. by the way, just a hmmmm kind of situation that popped into my mind today. Misty may have to soften some parts of her character's lives, in order for people to be able to read....at least she is realistic about certain things, and acknowledges that they do happen. To add to my earlier comments on cover art (horses and Companions), Larry's drawings of Companions have improved tenfold since his sketches (I can't really call them drawings) of Gwena in Winds of Fate, which IIRC was the first illustrated book. The drawing of Florian in SR is exquisite; I do not have words to adequate describe how I feel about this picture. Many times I prefer drawings like that one to full color paintings. Finally, I just remembered one of the character/music suggestions that I couldn't remember the last time; Billy Joel's song about the room is perfect for Vanyel and Tylendel that first day after, when Vanyel is still so scared. I can't recall the name of the song, but here are the words: In every heart there is a room A sanctuary safe and strong To heal the wounds from lovers past Until a new one comes along I spoke to you in cautious tones You answered me with no pretense And still I feel, I've said too much My silence is my self defense And for all the times I've held the rose It seems I've only felt the thorns And so it goes, and so it goes And so will you soon, I suppose But if my silence makes you leave Then that would be my worst mistake So I will share this room with you And you can have this heart to break. Just read life for lovers, and I don't think a song could describe the situation any better. Go Gently, Tresta %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% %%%% Tresta shena Jor'ethan "Love must live free." Healer to horses -Shin'a'in Teaching %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% %%%% %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% "To be tired of horses is to be tired of life; horses are a gift to us." %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Nov 1996 21:43:29 -0800 From: "Linda Malcor, Ph.D" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Companion's Grove?/ Message-ID: <199611170543.VAA05267-+AT+-latimes.com> At 10:51 PM 11/16/96 GMT, dsarik-+AT+-PO-Box.McGill.CA wrote: >Danya said: >>>ObMisty: Talked with Captain Steph, and she's asked Lynn Tucker for >permission to publish Volume 7 of Companions' Grove (which has been >languishing for about a year now). I'm really excited, 'cuz my first story >about Danya is supposed to be in it!<< > >Whoa!!!!! 7th volume????? What is this? Who's the editor (i.e. how can i >find them in bookstores) and how come I never heard of them before? > This is a fanzine that is advertised through Queen's Own. I got my hands on the first volume, and it's absolutely marvelous! I have been trying to get the next five volumes for over a year, though, with no luck (Lynn Tucker who published the 'zine aparently moved or something, and mundane life has been interfering with her filling orders, etc.) There are novella-length pieces and other stuff available as well. You can try contacting Stephanie Anderson for more information. (She also heads up Golden Grove, the California Chapter of Queen's Own.) Danya ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Nov 1996 21:53:58 -0800 From: "Linda Malcor, Ph.D" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Foresight Message-ID: <199611170553.VAA05383-+AT+-latimes.com> At 10:49 PM 11/16/96 GMT, Lee wrote: >Jacquelle asked: >>> I've been pondering Yfandes' seeming Foresight, and I'm curious as to >what all of you think...was her Foresight (:I knew when I Chose you that >our bond would come to this.:) specific or general? I mean, do you think >she actually knew that x number of years down the road she and Vanyel >would be fighting off Leareth [snip] in the Forest of Sorrows? Or was is >a more general Foresight, like she knew that eventually they would die >fighting some kind of evil somewhere? << [snip] > >Vanyel dreamed of his death before he became lovers with 'Lendel; in the >dream he fights magic-against-weaponry and is alone and knows he's going >to die (and it isn't clear if he's a Herald or not). This is one of the things that irritated the heck out of me with _Magic's Price_. All the way through the stories of Vanyel he keeps having his flashes of Foresight and they keep changing and he's told that they are only what "might" happen, that he can change what he's seeing, and then he doesn't do a danged thing to change his vision at all when the time comes! He was a major Herald-Mage, holding off an army at an extremely narrow pass. All he had to do was stall until help arrived. So why waste power fighting four lesser mages? Why waste power fighting Learth at all? Vanyel could supposedly level half of Haven with his power. Why didn't he simply blow out the bases of the canyon walls and seal the stupid pass? I literally threw the book across the room at his alternative. I've since learned that Misty and Larry plotted out the series when they first met. I suppose Misty was unwilling to change what they had sketched out together or something like that. Or maybe she just hasn't played enough AD&D to know what some of the spells Vanyel had at his disposal could do. But Vanyel had absolutely every reason in the world NOT to call a Final Strike at that point, and he should have had the brains to figure out that there was a ridiculously easy option. Danya ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Nov 1996 21:58:48 -0800 From: "Linda Malcor, Ph.D" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: daycare Message-ID: <199611170558.VAA05427-+AT+-latimes.com> At 12:29 AM 11/17/96 GMT, JAIME HATHAWAY wrote: >Oooh, you're writing Valdemar stories? Are you planning to have them >published in a 'zine or something? I love to read Valdemar stories >written by fans to see all the different kinds of adventures, etc. I >want to read your stories!!! If you get them published, and even if >you don't, can I buy a copy, or read them anyways?? Please??? The stories are supposedly going to appear in Companion's Grove. That's what I signed for when I sent Misty the release forms, so, as far as I know, that's the only place I'm authorized to publish them (hence, why I'm dying for the 'zine to resume publication!). Danya ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Nov 1996 01:52:26 -0700 From: DawnRain To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: fluff schizophrenia Message-ID: <328ED24A.1A6D-+AT+-geocities.com> Rose wrote: > AHHHHHH! Please, I must interject a thought here. Schizophrenia is not > at all the same as MPD. A Schizophrenic can be characterized as a person > with delusions (of Grandur, of Persecution, and the like). There are > aslo the waxy schizophrenics who will hold any position they are moved > into when they have an attack. There is also the disorganized > Schizophrenic who will not bath. MPD is someone who has two or more > distinct personalities vying for control of the same body, a prime > example being Mrs. White, Ms. Black, and Jane. Sorry to go off on this, > but I had in intensive Psychology course last year and this fact was > drilled into our heads on every occasion possible. Those holes still > ache when someone confuses the two conditions. I feel your ache... I really do... It's one of my favorite psychology gripes, too. I wonder if there might be any MPD's in Misty's worlds? That would through an interesting twist into things... Can't you picture Talia trying to deal with an MPD? I'm sure there were schizophrenics there, but MPD...? Hmm... MorningStar ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Nov 1996 02:23:28 -0700 From: DawnRain To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Apologies Message-ID: <328ED990.5B7C-+AT+-geocities.com> I can't remember if I wondered about MPD in *Valdemar* or in *Lackey* in general... When the Bough Breaks had an MPD major character(s), but I haven't seen it in Valdemar. MorningStar ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Nov 1996 01:24:48 -0800 (PST) From: Paradox To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: My very first braid! Message-ID: <199611170924.BAA26218-+AT+-uclink4.berkeley.edu> Ok guys and gals watchout... my very first braid ahead! >Barbara S. and Jake wrote: > >>Caution - strange idea ahead! >>What if, at the DragonCon, we got together and actually tried >>~singing~ some of the filksongs? Sort of a 'DraConale'? It might >>be a lot of fun...I've got one of the songbooks... >!!! Yes! What an awesome idea. Now I have to piece together my bass AND a >weekend's worth of stuff for carry-on luggage... I have been talking to Rainwood and she seem to agree with this sentiment. We were thinking how great it would bw for all of us to get together, this is such a great group. I don't know anything at all about DragonCon, but maybe that would be a good place to start. If we made it a group effort I am sure we could get something together. I am not sure how much of this needs to be on the list, so let me know. I would be more than willing, say, to put together (or maybe this has already been done) a contact list for people all in the same area. So that if people wanted to travel together or something. I was thinking about it, and since the large majority of us are students, how about maybe getting together this summer? =============================================== >Jacquelle asked: >>> I've been pondering Yfandes' seeming Foresight, and I'm curious as to >what all of you think...was her Foresight (:I knew when I Chose you that >our bond would come to this.:) specific or general? I mean, do you think >she actually knew that x number of years down the road she and Vanyel >would be fighting off Leareth [snip] in the Forest of Sorrows? Or was is >a more general Foresight, like she knew that eventually they would die >fighting some kind of evil somewhere? << [snip] Lee stated: >Vanyel dreamed of his death before he became lovers with 'Lendel; in the >dream he fights magic-against-weaponry and is alone and knows he's going >to die (and it isn't clear if he's a Herald or not). From this I suppose >that Vanyel was headed toward death in Sorrows in any case; Yfandes may >well have gotten incarnated in order to be Companion to whatever person >would be able to defeat Leareth, if that person should need her, one of >several contingency plans[snip] But that is simpy a theory I came up with and I'd like to hear >some alternates if anyone has any. I am not sure where this all started, but here's something to think about... As I recall Vanyel had nightmares all of his life about how he is going to die, but only he after he has his channels blasted open do the dreams included the Leareth (the man who is his dark mirror image) or rather a dark figure that looks too much like himself to be coincidence. It seems to me that if Vanyel was aware, then Yfandes had at least part of this knowledge with her, whether she liked or not. But I do agree with you, Lee. Vanyel and Yfandes were meant for each other, but whether that was fate or not, I dunno. Although, in the back of my mind I hear this little voice, "It's a story, it's All fate". "I do believe in spooks, I do believe in spooks, Ido, Ido, Ido believe in spooks" ============================== Sorry, deleted before I realized I had no source =( >This brings us back to the same issue I have been pondering (and NOT only >related to Misty's books, BTW) of whether Chosen pairings are preordained or >fated. If she is referring to that exact confrontation and its outcome, then >her Foresight would not work the way the Hawkbrothers say it works. For >instance, Moondance always tells Van that he is seeing only a possible >future and that things HE does can change it. So, if 'fandes always knew the >outcome, it would mean the future is immutable (a notion that I have always >found particularly frightening). [snip] That I think is a great point. Something definately to keep in mind upon my next re-reading. But that makes me wonder what could be done to change that future. It does seem immutable. I mean the dreams don't change much through the whole story. He was not able to change his fate (as far as I can tell). It does seem way to much like fate for me to be comfortable with as well. That makes me think that they just don't know, or that each indivdual culture has beliefs it knows to be true, but seem only to be true if one believes in them. Gods and Godesses this does seem to get way too confusing for me. ============================ This may sound a bit atrange, but with all of this gender stuff going on I want to put my bit in, too. I have a problem with the genders of Companions. Strange, huh? I tend to think of them all as genderless. Yes, I *know* they have children, and I *know* they mate, but must they have genders as well? (looks at last statement and laughs, it does sound funny. Iguess it is just a tendency of mine to think of most things as genderless, unless I have a use for them (Lee, do you remember a that discussion we had about INFP's a long time ago, "Things don't exsist unless I have a use for them." ============================ Dyana wrote: AHHHHHH! Please, I must interject a thought here. Schizophrenia is not >at all the same as MPD. A Schizophrenic can be characterized as a person > with delusions (of Grandur, of Persecution, and the like). [snip] Sorry, I didn't realize, I really didn't.... =( =========================== Hth wrote: 'cuz I'm at a point in the stories that I'm writing >about Danya, Yarik and Kaylan where she's going to have triplets (That's a >long, long story . . . I wanna see, please. I mean I think that's great! If you get 'em published' you'll let us know where to find them, right? Well, you've stuck it out, huh? Through the whole thing. Did you follow any of it? My First Braid ,let me know how it turned out. Have a fantastic weekend! Until we meet again, In the shadows Briana ================================= "Don't forget to breathe,...in and out." --Grover ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Nov 1996 03:14:31 -0800 (PST) From: Kat To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Lots o' stuff... Message-ID: Firemist said: > rant off -- sorry about that. You know who I'd really love to see do > some Misty related stuff? MICHEAL WHELAN!!!! Ooooohhhh.. I agree. I have a friend who is obssesed by Micheal Whelan's art. He has prints of all three of the _Dark Sun Rising_ book covers, a book full of his artwork and (get this) trading cards. Having him to coverwork would truly be awesome. > Firemist, who eyes her somewhat naked walls and wonders where she > can get prints of MW stuff. . . > I've seen them at every con I've been to so far.. Other than, that, I am not really sure. 'Fandes: Hmmmmm.. I'm still thinking on this one. I beleive that if something is meant to happen it will find a way too happen. I have a feeling that Vanyel's being chosen was one of them, once the path he chose was chosen. Not everythign is pre-destined, just certain landmarks along the way. Kind of like check-up points. Hmmm.. Well.. It's really late and I can't think of anything else, so I'll go away now.. I need sleep. Kat Priestess of Karma ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Nov 1996 08:29:41 -0400 From: "Ramona Winkelbauer [SERA]" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: ...Equine Telepathy... Message-ID: Tresta shena Jor'ethan wrote: >Re: Equine Telepathy [ruthless snip of innocent verbiage] >My theory is that horses are telepathic creatures partly because in their >natural state they live as a herd. Have you ever watched a herd galloping >all out, yet constantly aware of where every other member of the herd is, >down to the tiniest foals? They never step on each other; they maintain >exact distances between themselves. > >So this natural ability of the horse has been noticed and cultivated by the >most sensitive of humans, desiring partnership in the truest sense. While I'd like to go along with this theory (Equine Telepathy), couldn't this behaviour (also) be explained by "extreme concentration" on the part of the horse to its surroundings? A prey animal, horses have a wide field of vision and a natural selection for "herd mentality". RL example (of non-telepathy): "Clever Hans": a (German) horse (?gelding) that could answer any question by tapping out the answer with his hooves. "What is 2x2?" "Yes or no questions a specialty." Trainer claimed that he'd been "teaching" Hans with books (read aloud) for ?ten? years. Investigation found that Hans was "reading" his answers from the questioner: the questioner's "body language" was providing Hans with "cues" to the answer. So, if the questioner didn't know the answer, or was in a different room, Hans would tap until someone stopped him. IMO, Hans was more clever than his "debunkers" gave him credit for: the horse was not just following the (pre-arranged) directions/cues of his trainer/rider in a domesticated [vs. the wild] setting (concentrating on a loved one) but was paying "extreme" attention to surroundings (concentrating on the questioner). Hans was paying attention to very small, easily "unseen", and idiosyncratic[1] cues: held breath or tension or etc., that most horses (and people) ignore as part of background "white noise". "Concentration on surroundings" might also explain the (well-documented) ability of horses to follow non-visual cues as well (e.g., rider sitting forward to go faster, and back to slow down). Ramona [1] Idiosyncratic because each person's cues are going to be slightly/grossly different from another person. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Nov 96 10:47 EST From: infodyn-+AT+-distrinet.com.uy (Eleonora Scoseria) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Braid: Genderless/Songs/Imps/Fluff Message-ID: Cennydd wrote in reply to some of my comments about predestined fates (is that redundant my lord??): > >Well, how about this: there are some events that are so important and so >all-encompassing that there is no way to avoid them. They are part of >divine necessity. Vanyel's death was such a necessity. To me, Yfandes >was a truly tragic figure, in that she apparently could see that necessity >and chose to give herself over to it, to love Vanyel and carry him to his >doom. To me, this is the one thing that argues for her being either >Grove-born or at least a true Guardian Spirit (although she may have been >incarnated in the normal way). Her task seems to be more than could be >expected from even the most self-sacrificing of human spirits. Also, her >Foresight seems to be something more than Mortal. Well, that IS a theory I can live with, and I agree it does add tyo Yfandes's tragic profile. Something I cannot remember. Was Leareth also Ma'ar? And the mage at the end of MPawn? Danya wrote about the subject: >This is one of the things that irritated the heck out of me with _Magic's >Price_. All the way through the stories of Vanyel he keeps having his >flashes of Foresight and they keep changing and he's told that they are only >what "might" happen, that he can change what he's seeing, and then he >doesn't do a danged thing to change his vision at all when the time comes! >He was a major Herald-Mage, holding off an army at an extremely narrow pass. >All he had to do was stall until help arrived. So why waste power fighting >four lesser mages? Why waste power fighting Learth at all? Vanyel could >supposedly level half of Haven with his power. Why didn't he simply blow >out the bases of the canyon walls and seal the stupid pass? Only thing I can say is: Van discovers Leareth is being FED magic energy from distant nodes by several mages, while Van had exhausted his reserves and had no access to other sources other than Yfandes, and that was barely enough for a Final Strike. Also, Van had only just recovered from rape, abuse and exhaustion, he was hardly in top form. In that context he did not seem to have much choice. Danya continued: >I literally threw the book across the room at his alternative. I've since learned >that Misty and Larry plotted out the series when they first met. I suppose Misty >was unwilling to change what they had sketched out together or something >like that. Or maybe she just hasn't played enough AD&D to know what some of >the spells Vanyel had at his disposal could do. But Vanyel had absolutely >every reason in the world NOT to call a Final Strike at that point, and he >should have had the brains to figure out that there was a ridiculously easy >option. Please someone, what is AD&D? (not on the abbrev. list). I see you point about a character's supposed strengths and some situations he apparently gets himself into. That habit of authors of forcing their characters into heroic situations they could have avoided is VERY irritating. I think an excellent example of this is Louise Cooper's The Time Master Trilogy. Anybody read it out there? >On Sat, 16 Nov 1996, Dan wrote: >> What does the above have to do with a petition for a position? Well, I >> think it is proof positive that I am most deserving to be deemed the >> "Imp of inappropriate statements, carrier of foot-in-mouth disease, >> and bearer of inadvertent pain". > Cennydd replied: >Much as I would love to grant this petition, I fear that my Priestess >Deniz has put her finger on the crux of the matter. My Lord, I object!!! What is this about thy priestess Deniz?? Much as I respect and appreciate the aforementioned lady, I would like to point out that SHE is not thy Priestess. Werest thou by any chance referring to thy Priestess Ele? Was it a slip of thy tongue or retribution for the time thy humble priestess spent busily researching the Sovvan issue? >Cennydd continued: >Please note that even the Shadow-lover is not genderless. He/She is >always gendered, it just seems to change. Although I can't think of any >textevd for this claim, now that I think on it. Is there any real textevd >for the Shadow-Lover with a female form? The only text evd I can come up with is in MPromise, when Jaysen says farewell to Van after the former has talked to the 'male' Shadow-Lover, and Jays refers to Lady Death (since Jays was definitely not shaych it makes sense his lover should be a woman) and says "SHE promised you will not be alone, Van" (or words to that effect). That's all for now, WTTW. Ele Priestess of Karma P.S. For all of those looking for Firebird, I received a message from Amazon.com saying that they have the hardback (price 22.95 unless I am mistaken) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Nov 1996 07:49:35 -0800 From: "Linda Malcor, Ph.D" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Braid: Genderless/Songs/Imps/Fluff Message-ID: <199611171549.HAA01477-+AT+-latimes.com> >Please someone, what is AD&D? (not on the abbrev. list). Advanced Dungeons and Dragons. >I see you point about a character's supposed strengths and some situations >he apparently gets himself into. That habit of authors of forcing their >characters into heroic situations they could have avoided is VERY >irritating. I think an excellent example of this is Louise Cooper's The Time >Master Trilogy. Anybody read it out there? > Haven't read that one. But I do find that the problem crops up more often in the work of authors who (at least claim in interviews that they do) work by plotting out their material, then develop the characters and then write the story. The most common trouble I see is a character doing something that there is no way, no how that character would ever do at the point the author has the person do it--all simply because the author had preordained that thus-and-such is how the plot would go. Plotting ahead of time is fine if you are willing to change what you planned so that your character doesn't have to do something out of character in order to make your plot happen. Misty has at least one major glitch of this nature in every trilogy I've read by her (usually somewhere toward the end of the third book), but she is far from being alone when it comes to having this difficulty. Danya ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Nov 1996 08:23:34 -0800 (PST) From: Becky Anne Christensen To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Genderless Message-ID: On Sun, 17 Nov 1996, Eleonora Scoseria wrote: > >Cennydd continued: > > >Please note that even the Shadow-lover is not genderless. He/She is > >always gendered, it just seems to change. > > The only text evd I can come up with is in MPromise, when Jaysen says > farewell to Van after the former has talked to the 'male' Shadow-Lover, and > Jays refers to Lady Death "SHE promised you will not be > alone, Van" (or words to that effect). Hmmm, well, whenever I read that, I had taken it to mean that She refered to the Goddess, Kal'enel (I think, I probably got that spelling wrong) you know, the Shin'a'in one. :) He did continue to serve her, so it would make sense she would be looking after Van. Just a thought. Lady Becky(LIG), Goddess of Tofu and Dry Breakfast Cereals Founder of the AftPoSWT (confused? Just ask.) Mailing List Homepage http://www.psnw.com/~deb/becky/misty.html beckyanne-+AT+-iforge.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Nov 1996 11:34:06 -0500 (EST) From: Jaguar To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Apologies Message-ID: On Sun, 17 Nov 1996, DawnRain wrote: > I can't remember if I wondered about MPD in *Valdemar* or in *Lackey* in > general... When the Bough Breaks had an MPD major character(s), but I > haven't seen it in Valdemar. > Depends on whether or not you count Falconsbane...he was definitly more than one person. Whether or not in the sense of MPD...well, that's debatable. Blessed be, Jaguar Leader of the Cat People "Some try to tell me thoughts they cannot defend Goddess of Large Hunter Cats Just what you want to be...you will be in the end Chronicler of the Mage Wars And I love you...." Lady in Green --Moody Blues "Nights in White Satin" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Nov 96 11:13:28 -0500 From: dsarik-+AT+-PO-Box.McGill.CA To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: BDAY ALERT/Re: Cennydd's last post Message-ID: <199611171639.LAA28752-+AT+-sirocco.CC.McGill.CA> 2-DAY BIRTHDAY WARNING!!!!! Lorraine (aspiring Goddess of Domesticity and Laundry) is having her big five o on the 19th. If you want, you can also send her private bday wishes at BudLor-+AT+-aol.com. $#$#$#$#$#$#$#$#$#$# a little good-natured fluff (misty after the next bar) Cennydd wrote: >-----BOM Eh? >-----EOM/BOM Wha? >Much as I would love to grant this petition, I fear that my Priestess >Deniz has put her finger on the crux of the matter. Hold up! I'm Thine? Excuse me, but last time I looked, I served Mat. Mayhaps Thou meant to add the word "and" ? >Ne'ertheless, a 6foot+, 210 pound, military man has a rather formidable >advantage in gaining my favor. =) Good luck! Try brownies. They worked for me! Or is he not the brownie type? Hmm... we'll think of something for you, Cenn. Never fear! $#$#$#$#$#$#$#$#$#$#$#$#$# stuff about the Shadow-lover Yup, it's still Cennydd: >Please note that even the Shadow-lover is not genderless. He/She is >always gendered, it just seems to change. Although I can't think of any >textevd for this claim, now that I think on it. Is there any real textevd >for the Shadow-Lover with a female form? Ah-HAH!!!!! You know when Van's been stabbed and he's with Death as a male? Right after he makes his decision, Death tells him there's somebody who would like to talk to him. It's whassisname, the Seneschal? his Herald? Jaysen? The guy who died goofily while shielding Jisa. Anyway, he refers to Death as a she. That made me assume that Death appeared in the gender the viewer was more attracted to. There's a saying that when you see Death, you fall in love so hard, and so fast, that your soul is drawn out of your eyes. That's why I always assumed that was how her Death worked. Now, how would s/he look if one were bi? $#$#$#$#$#$#$#$#$#$#$# stuff about music Hai, we're still talking with Cennydd: >On Sat, 16 Nov 1996, Deniz wrote: > >> My .02? It seems to me like everyone here is completely neglecting one >> whole class of music/songs. What about Black Spirituals and Work Songs >> from Ante-bellum U.S.? > >Oooo! Good! You are right, I wasn't really thinking about these. I was >thinking in terms of European music of the period that is the closest Most people tend to do that. I don't know why, but we (referring to the majority of peoples who just happen to not be Black (and I say that with respect), tend to forget about the power of their Spirituals and such. Gospel is a strong tradition for a reason. These people went through Hell, and expressed their faith in their songs. That's what gives them so much power. >You're examples of the coded signals and the teaching >songs are perfect. BTW, are you familiar with the folk-story corpus about >Big John de Conquer? Are there also songs about him? Why, thank 'ee, sir. Hmm. Big John de Conquer? I don't know. I can pull up my bibliography, though, and use those to start looking. Any info you have would help me. Just because I handed the paper in over a year ago doesn't mean I'm not interested anymore. >corpora of seasonal songs in Velgarth. Do you think, for example that >there are Sovvan carols? Is there a Mid-Winter Feast in Valdemar (I don't >remember one). Yes. Remember, that was when the major holiday was? Everyone left for home or to stay with friends, and Talia was left at the Collegium with nowhere to go. That was when she met (i'm not gonna try to remember his name), the Bardic Herald who taught her so much. >Since I collect Christmas carols, I am always interested in analogs. BTW, >for any non-Christians on this list, are there analogous corpora of songs >associated with a particular religious feast in your tradition? For example, >are there Channukah carols? Ramadan songs? etc. Well, there's Chichester Psalms! (woodlark's yelling at me about them, and i'd rather comply then get into another series of The Holy Keyboard Wars. Besides, she needs to save her voice... ;>) They're by Bernstein and were commissioned for the Chichester Church for some celebration they do every year for Christmas, or something like that. Anyway, they're basically bits of Old Testament in Hebrew with an organ or orchestral accompaniment (sp?) and a Treble Solo. Woodlark almost got that one, but the director decided to give it to a senior, instead. She's now insisting to me that it was all for the best, seeing as she got sick the week they performed, and wouldn't have been able to perform it anyway. Phew! I didn't realize we'd go off like that. Ramadan songs? Hmm... I can check it out while I'm in Saudi for my break. Oh, that reminds me. I'm gonna be gone from the net from Dec. 21 to Jan. 2 (I think), so somebody's gonna have to fill the post of Acting Birthday Person Extraordinaire. love, deniz sarikaya, High Priestess |But she had the trick of making a little of Procrastination and Holy |island right in the middle of time, and of Custodian of the B-Day List. |your knowing, which is what time does to Confused? Write me! |you. -- Robert Penn Warren dsarik-+AT+-PO-Box.McGill.CA and |~| _______________________________________________ |~| | |~| free bard woodlark -- dsarik-+AT+-PO-Box.McGill.CA |~| | ~| |_______________________________________________| |~ ~ ~ ------------------------------ End of MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 956 *********************************