MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 1036 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Braiding: Why then obmisty by Rose 2) SOLARIS by David Maginnis 3) Re: The Burning of Aistes (brought to you by popular demand) by Chris Wiegand 4) Re: SOLARIS by Chris & Sean Talbot 5) Re: Braiding: Why then obmisty by Chris & Sean Talbot 6) Re: The Burning of Aistes (brought to you by popular demand) by Chris & Sean Talbot 7) Re: SOLARIS by David Maginnis 8) The Burning of Aistes by skarzin-+AT+-soonet.ca 9) Re: SOLARIS by Gene McKeever 10) Re: The Burning of Aistes by Chris & Sean Talbot 11) Re: SOLARIS by Lydia Hales 12) Re: Karsite Sun-priests/Karal by Lady Windsong 13) Re: (Braid)Newbie Fest (off topic), The Burning of Aistes, Solaris and the Karsites by "Kerowynn k'Sheyna" 14) Re: MERCEDES-LACKEY digest 1032 by Lady Becky of the Hills 15) Re: MERCEDES-LACKEY digest 1032 by Chris & Sean Talbot ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 14:08:19 -0500 From: Rose To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Braiding: Why then obmisty Message-ID: <32C6C1A3.2538-+AT+-ctol.net> To Cennydd. Thank-you. Thank-you, thank-you thank-you. About braiding. I realize that with some mail systems, it is difficult if not impossible to cut and paste within e-mail (the programers obviously never thought about groups like ours) But, people have found ways around this problem. One does not have to quote to respond to something someone said, an attribute will do. Now, when you put a bunch of these responses together, you get a braid that did not have to have any cut and paste to do. I know it can be annoying to wait on what you have to say, but it still is best to wait until you've read a significant amount of mail before responding, that way, you know if you should annotate what you said to include others opinions, and whether or not someone already responded your way and got a response already. And, It was not just Aistes that was doing this, I think Cen message was a well deserved reminder for all of us. P.S. Aistes, if you could post in a braid what kind of e-mail system you have, I'm willing to bet that someone on list can help. ------------------------------------------------------------------------Obmisty: I've been thinking lately, what do we know about Karal's history? was he in line to be a priest before Solaris became the Son of the Sun? If he was, how did he and his family feel about him being taken away? And Karse as a whole. It seems in the books that there wasn't much to be done amoung the people when Solaris came out. Sure, they must have been happy that the demons would be gone, but shouldn't such a radical change cause some severe dissention? If I'm completely missing something, someone tell me because I haven't reread the first two Mage books in a while. Kawryathen ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 19:34:54 +0000 From: David Maginnis To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: SOLARIS Message-ID: <32C6C7DE.2E1-+AT+-netcomuk.co.uk> Hi, I read what you thought in your email Rose,but have you forgotten the 'feast of the children'.I should think that any country suffering such a system where you could lose your child at the whim of a priest would be grateful for any sort of revolt that saves them.A lot of adults in Karse will have had siblings,children and friends who were taken away,never to be seen again. And don't forget the infamous 'fires of cleansing' where children were given to the fires for harbouring witch powers.After all solaris is only carrying out Vkandis's will and i'm sure even her greatest opponents won't want to cross a god. Dave ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 13:26:39 -0700 From: Chris Wiegand To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: The Burning of Aistes (brought to you by popular demand) Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19961229132354.0067ebac-+AT+-popd.ix.netcom.com > At 07:21 AM 12/29/96 GMT, you wrote: >Star, very carefully snipping her own quotes lest she forget the lesson, >watches in awe... > >As the person sitting at the keyboard typing these letters giggles and >applauds Ken's gift of turning a word. > > Huh?! (confused, to say the least) Chris Wiegand cwiegand-+AT+-urgentmail.com http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Heights/7734/ Below is my v-card, for those using Netscape 4.0 or a v-card aware e-mailer. BEGIN:VCARD FN:Chris Wiegand N:Wiegand;Chris ORG:StarTek ADR:;;1640 Potomac St.;Aurora;CO;80011-4045 EMAIL;INTERNET:cwiegand-+AT+-urgentmail.com TEL;HOME:303-366-7252 X-NAV-HTML:F END:VCARD ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 18:30:37 -0500 From: Chris & Sean Talbot To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: SOLARIS Message-ID: <199612292330.SAA05641-+AT+-nemesis.idirect.com> At 07:44 PM 12/29/96 GMT, you wrote: >And don't forget the infamous 'fires of cleansing' where children were >given to the fires for harbouring witch powers.After all solaris is only >carrying out Vkandis's will and i'm sure even her greatest opponents >won't want to cross a god. > Dave > What did the fires of cleansing really do. Since there were still people with mage gifts in the priesthood when the cleansing was around. Karal for one said that his uncles had met there fate in the Fires of Cleansing, but then we see Ulrich as being an adept of considerable power. How could they determine if someone had the mage gift or other gifts be dangerous. Like why kill some people and not kill the rest with the gifts. There is something I am missing here but I am not sure as to what it is. The rest of the list should be able to answer the questions and hopefully help me to understand about the Karsites a bit more. Aistes ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 18:30:34 -0500 From: Chris & Sean Talbot To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Braiding: Why then obmisty Message-ID: <199612292330.SAA05626-+AT+-nemesis.idirect.com> >P.S. Aistes, if you could post in a braid what kind of e-mail system you >have, I'm willing to bet that someone on list can help. Eudora Light it says. It a program that deals heavily with NetScape. So I figure now someone can tell me how the heck you even do these things. I have been on the list for quite some time but I don't even know the system enough to use it. Aistes ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 18:30:42 -0500 From: Chris & Sean Talbot To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: The Burning of Aistes (brought to you by popular demand) Message-ID: <199612292330.SAA05684-+AT+-nemesis.idirect.com> At 08:36 PM 12/29/96 GMT, you wrote: >Huh?! (confused, to say the least) Don't worry about it. It is just supposed to be a lesson to me for not snipping and for not braiding. It is meant to make me start doing all those things to a better degree. Now if others who do what I do continue to do what I was doing they might get wrote to about it by Cennyd. See we all are supposed to follow the things that they were saying and I still don't understand my system all that well. So I make the mistake. See this time I only took one qoute is that much better? Aistes ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 01:54:05 +0000 From: David Maginnis To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: SOLARIS Message-ID: <32C720BD.2AC9-+AT+-netcomuk.co.uk> Chris & Sean Talbot wrote: > > At 07:44 PM 12/29/96 GMT, you wrote: > >And don't forget the infamous 'fires of cleansing' where children were > >given to the fires for harbouring witch powers.After all solaris is only > >carrying out Vkandis's will and i'm sure even her greatest opponents > >won't want to cross a god. > > Dave > > > > What did the fires of cleansing really do. Since there were still people > with mage gifts in the priesthood when the cleansing was around. Karal for > one said that his uncles had met there fate in the Fires of Cleansing, but > then we see Ulrich as being an adept of considerable power. How could they > determine if someone had the mage gift or other gifts be dangerous. Like > why kill some people and not kill the rest with the gifts. There is > something I am missing here but I am not sure as to what it is. The rest of > the list should be able to answer the questions and hopefully help me to > understand about the Karsites a bit more. > > Aistes Hi, In reference to Karal and Ulrich and the Fires of cleansing I believe the children given to the flames did'nt have 'real' magic,they had 'mind' magic as in Valdemar.That in my belief is why they were murdered. Dave ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 20:59:27 -0500 (EST) From: skarzin-+AT+-soonet.ca To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: The Burning of Aistes Message-ID: <199612300159.UAA07541-+AT+-victory.soonet.ca> Heyla All! Cennydd, your flame of Aistes was beautifully written, a joy to read, unless of course, the reader happened to be the unfortunate Aistes. It warmed my heart to read of all the time and effort that my fellow listmembers put into asking for the aid of the Mage of Green Silences, in the matter of Aistes' heinous crimes. I was touched to learn that _one_ listmember actually thought to in- form Aistes directly. I hope that said listmember will accept my heartfelt admiration for their rogue behavior, but please, try to keep these actions to a minimum. We wouldn't want courtesy and thoughtfulness to get out of control, now would we? I have a suggestion. What if, when a relatively new listmember is in violation of the "laws and customs of this place and the will of the Divine Listmistress Mel", we e-mail them _privately_, explain the problem _clearly_, and identify the transgressor by name, so as to avoid misunderstanding? We could then offer our help in solving the problem. I am sure that _no one_ enjoys being flamed, no matter how beau- tifully or eloquently it is done. Aistes, if you would like my help with snipping or braiding, or if you have any questions, please don't hestitate to e-mail me. Regards, Michele Goddess of Botanical Blight skarzin-+AT+-soonet.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 21:33:40 -0500 From: Gene McKeever To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: SOLARIS Message-ID: <3.0.32.19961229212611.00697a74-+AT+-dalco.net> At 11:41 PM 12/29/96 GMT, you wrote: >At 07:44 PM 12/29/96 GMT, you wrote: >>And don't forget the infamous 'fires of cleansing' where children were >>given to the fires for harbouring witch powers.After all solaris is only >>carrying out Vkandis's will and i'm sure even her greatest opponents >>won't want to cross a god. >> Dave >> > >What did the fires of cleansing really do. Since there were still people >with mage gifts in the priesthood when the cleansing was around. Karal for >one said that his uncles had met there fate in the Fires of Cleansing, but >then we see Ulrich as being an adept of considerable power. How could they >determine if someone had the mage gift or other gifts be dangerous. Like >why kill some people and not kill the rest with the gifts. There is >something I am missing here but I am not sure as to what it is. The rest of >the list should be able to answer the questions and hopefully help me to >understand about the Karsites a bit more. > >Aistes > The Fire of Cleansing burned children who showed the slightest inkling of being uncontrollable mages or free thinkers. It was a perversion of what Pentecostals call being baptised in the Holy Ghost... At least that is my guess, based on the "revelations" of the young priest, S'Hawk ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 21:41:52 -0500 From: Chris & Sean Talbot To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: The Burning of Aistes Message-ID: <199612300241.VAA24286-+AT+-nemesis.idirect.com> >Aistes, if you would like my help with snipping or braiding, or >if you have any questions, please don't hestitate to e-mail me. >skarzin-+AT+-soonet.ca > > I would love some help but I only really now need help in Braiding since I don't know how to do that at all. Snipping I have basically figured out. It didn't bother me at all to be flamed I just wish that it was done in private and not in front of everyone since it really didn't concern all the list. I was only told once about it and that person did it in private mail which I like. Half the time I don't read all the messages so I never know when someone talks to me or about me. I was just lucky I saw that message or I wouldn't have read it since it didn't really interest me. I skipped most of it anyway so I wouldn't decide to snap and do the qouting on purpose. I just read some of the important parts. So see it didn't really bother me. So if you could help me with Braiding it would be much appreciated but I don't know much about it or Eudora which I use. So any help would be useful Aistes I hope this is better. I cut most of the qoutes out so I only qouted the part that I wished to reply to. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 19:15:14 -0800 (PST) From: Lydia Hales To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: SOLARIS Message-ID: On Mon, 30 Dec 1996, David Maginnis wrote: > Chris & Sean Talbot wrote: > > > > At 07:44 PM 12/29/96 GMT, you wrote: > > >And don't forget the infamous 'fires of cleansing' where children were > > >given to the fires for harbouring witch powers.After all solaris is only > > >carrying out Vkandis's will and i'm sure even her greatest opponents > > >won't want to cross a god. > > > Dave > > > > > > > What did the fires of cleansing really do. Since there were still people > > with mage gifts in the priesthood when the cleansing was around. Karal for > > one said that his uncles had met there fate in the Fires of Cleansing, but > > then we see Ulrich as being an adept of considerable power. How could they > > determine if someone had the mage gift or other gifts be dangerous. Like > > why kill some people and not kill the rest with the gifts. There is > > something I am missing here but I am not sure as to what it is. The rest of > > the list should be able to answer the questions and hopefully help me to > > understand about the Karsites a bit more. > > > > Aistes > Hi, > In reference to Karal and Ulrich and the Fires of cleansing I believe > the children given to the flames did'nt have 'real' magic,they had > 'mind' magic as in Valdemar.That in my belief is why they were murdered. > > Dave > > When the Karsites started the burnings (one of LHM series, don't rememeber which), they were burning *all* Gifted, or at least that was the impression that I had. The only ones spared were already priests. Perhaps age is another reason. Maybe they took the youngsters to be clergy, and burned those who were older and not already priests. After all, if they're not already in Vkandis' service, their powers must be from an evil source, right? Even though I think Dave's theory has merit. Maybe there is a combination of factors. As Kerowyn would say, fanaticism turns people's brains to mush. (Messy thinking causing messy wars.) Lydia (who planned to lurk, but couldn't resist putting in her .02 cents worth) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 12:04:51 +0800 (SST) From: Lady Windsong To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Karsite Sun-priests/Karal Message-ID: <2.2.16.19961230120354.2e8f15b6-+AT+-singnet.com.sg> Heyla, all! Hooray! I *finally* got hold of a copy of _Storm Breaking_, and I can *finally* read it! Yes, I'm on-topic for the first time in a *long* while. Aistes asked: >What did the fires of cleansing really do. Since there were still people >with mage gifts in the priesthood when the cleansing was around. I wouldn't know, but this is a _guess_: maybe those children burnt at the Fires were unwilling to cooperate with the priests? Wait a while......Yes, I remembered correctly, and it doesn't actually say anything conclusive. *sigh* But it does say that some of the children are actually chosen, begin training, and *then* are sent to the Fires. What it says is this: _Storm Warning_, DAW edition, pg 54: "Some, a fraction of the rest, were taken off by the Priests for "special training" that had nothing to do with scholarly pursuits. Some few of _those_(emphasis Misty's) were given to the Flames, later, as witches." And Rose? While I'm at it, there's some info on Karal's early life in _Storm Warning_, dropped all over the book in tantalizing tidbits. *mock sigh* But most of it is around pages 52-27. Does that help any? :) Anyway, what I'm getting at is, that the children might have been burnt because they refused to obey the Sun-priests in charge of their training. And the other children were forced to watch to discourage *them* from trying the same thing. And another question. Could it be that *because he had to watch other children burning in the Flames*, Karal mistrusted magic; he wanted to have nothing to do with it, and so he really didn't want to be a Channel? Is there any textevd? Just something to think about. :) Or yes, like Dave said, perhaps they had mind-magic. Hmm...something else to think about. And here's the off-topic part: Happy New Year, everybody! Here's wishing you and all at home a very very very happy one! Walk in Peace always, Lady Windsong. 'Your joy is your sorrow unmasked. And the selfsame well from which your laughter rises was oftentimes filled with your tears.' Gibran, _The Prophet_ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 22:32:24 -0800 From: "Kerowynn k'Sheyna" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: (Braid)Newbie Fest (off topic), The Burning of Aistes, Solaris and the Karsites Message-ID: <32C761F8.4F88-+AT+-inreach.com> >Eleonora wrote: >First of all, an all-time best-seller among newbies. The sheep thingy. Thankx for clearing that up! I thought it was funny to start off with but for a totally different reason, I had a "sheep" program (I think my hubby deleted it by accident heh) and thought it was cute, this little sheep running all over your screen, falling into a bathtub, running, bouncing, taking a leak (sorry for being blunt there) it was a really funny little program. If anyone has it I would like if you could send it to me. I thought that was what you all were talking about :) >SURE-FIRE WAYS TO GET FLAMED BY CENNYDD I have been warned once in private about not snipping, and after seeing the Burning of Aistes, though very beautifully put, I would rather not have my arse on the burning end. *watches her step very carefully* but it's good to know that you all are a bit forgiving :) >Michele Wrote: >I am sure that _no one_ enjoys being flamed, no matter how beau- >tifully or eloquently it is done. Aye ta that! >Dave wrote: > In reference to Karal and Ulrich and the Fires of cleansing I believe >the children given to the flames did'nt have 'real' magic,they had >'mind' magic as in Valdemar.That in my belief is why they were >murdered. > Dave What I don't understand is why would they kill those with mind magic and not those with real magic?? Would it be so that there are mages who can perform blood magic?? What if a child had real magic _and_ mind magic, would they be killed too, even though they could possibly be sunpriests? I haven't been able to read the Mage Storms series and I'm basically going on what I hear from the list, I hope to get the series as soon as I can. >S'Hawk Wrote: >The Fire of Cleansing burned children who showed the slightest inkling >of being uncontrollable mages or free thinkers. Using bloodmagic, killing those with mind magic and those who might be free thinkers, my disgust of the Karsites grows even more. :-/ >Lydia Wrote: >When the Karsites started the burnings (one of LHM series, don't >rememeber which), they were burning *all* Gifted, or at least that was >the impression that I had. The only ones spared were already priests. If they burned all the gifted, their sunpriests would die off, there wouldn't be anyone left with mage abilities to take their place, or do the sunpriests live forever? And if the people of karsite keep getting their children taken away why do they stay in Karsite?? I know they started to flee to Valdemar I think in SW (??), at least from what I heard from a friend, but why did they wait so long to leave? Why didn't they start fleeing in BTS when Daren helped kill that bloodmage to release the Karsite peasants from his control. All they did was join his army and helped in the last war of the book. Maybe there was something about in Arrows trilogy never been able to find those books, are they still in print?? >Lady Windsong's Quote from SB >"Some, a fraction of the rest, were taken off by the Priests for >"special training" that had nothing to do with scholarly pursuits. >Some few of _those_(emphasis Misty's) were given to the Flames, later, >as witches." Umm what would be the difference between witchery (would that be hedge wizards?) and magery? Mindmagic? If so maybe that's why the Karsites hate (or hated?) Valdemar, they thought it was a kingdom of witches (sorry that was sorta a confirmation for me). And from what you all are saying Karal is a Karsite, and from my friend he says that Karsite wants a treaty with Valdemar (he thinks, he hasn't actually read the book just browsed a bit, and he won't let me borrow the book until he's finished! *rolling eyes*) if that's true and if I were Queen Selenay, I wouldn't trust the Karsites with pig much less a treaty. Okay that's enough from me, I might start losing it and it took me a whole hour to write this thing, I feel a brain freeze coming on *runs for a warm soda, psst, gulp gulp gulp, ahhh _hic_, _puke_* Sure fire way to cure a brain freeze! Laterz all! Kerowynn k'Sheyana Clan Woad ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 23:32:46 -0800 (PST) From: Lady Becky of the Hills To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: MERCEDES-LACKEY digest 1032 Message-ID: > Lady Becky of the Hills wrote: > (snip snip, hey! look, I'm making snowflakes!) > > Well, you couldn't expect me to get them > > *all* out on time now could you? I am after all, the Handmaiden of > > Procrastination. Anyways, they'll be there soon. Be patient with me! > Then Ele said..... > Dearest Lady Becky, of course we are patient, but may I also make a > suggestion?. I believe you should also be a priestess or handmaiden of > hyperness and overbubliness ;) You certainly act the part very well, and > I always find myself stimulated after your posts :) > > Who is our resident Goddess of hyperness and overbubliness? My brain is thinking it's Mishi, but of course, my brain has never functioned properly. :) I shall find my Goddess and petition to become her priestess. ********************** Chris, I'm very sorry about your dad, I've been lucky to never lose anyone really close to me (except my kitty) but I offer you my love and my prayers. ********************** Okay, Misty time! Well, here in California, it's not winter yet (feels like fall) but today it is very misty outside! :) :) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: MERCEDES-LACKEY digest 1032 Message-ID: <199612301500.KAA00661-+AT+-nemesis.idirect.com> At 07:19 AM 12/30/96 GMT, you wrote: >> > Then Ele said..... >> Dearest Lady Becky, of course we are patient, but may I also make a >> suggestion?. I believe you should also be a priestess or handmaiden of >> hyperness and overbubliness ;) You certainly act the part very well, and >> I always find myself stimulated after your posts :) She does at that. Doesn't she. Always cheery. I don't think I have yet seen her in a bad mood. Does anyone remember seeing her in a bad mood on the list. > >********************** > > Does anyone else find it amusing that Cennyd's flame about >posting one liners generated a rash of one line posts? Just found that >funny in my strange sort of way.......... I have seen so many one liners that I don't know why they are all coming. I know they aren't all from me. Since I have not been sending any one liners except to reply to one liners. My first braid is coming up so be patient with me if I make a mistake with it. >Aistes asked: >>What did the fires of cleansing really do. Since there were still people >>with mage gifts in the priesthood when the cleansing was around. Lady Windsong wrote >I wouldn't know, but this is a _guess_: maybe those children burnt at the >Fires were unwilling to cooperate with the priests? Wait a >while......Yes, I remembered correctly, and it >doesn't actually say anything conclusive. *sigh* But it does say that some >of the children are actually chosen, begin training, and *then* are sent to >the Fires. But how would they determine that at such a young age. Children are always changing there minds so it shouldn't have been that if just one person did something to disobey or not follow orders that the they would be fed to the fires. How would they have justified all the deaths. Since the priests as well have the mage gifts usually so wouldn't that be kind of hard to do that for. I mean they are kind of bigotted if they act that way. Condone use of magery for there priests but opress people who have it but don't want to become a priest. Just my thoughts on this child burning thing. Lady Windsong Wrote >What it says is this: _Storm Warning_, DAW edition, pg 54: > >"Some, a fraction of the rest, were taken off by the Priests for "special >training" that had nothing to do with scholarly pursuits. >Some few of _those_(emphasis Misty's) were given to the Flames, later, as >witches." They have to be very bigotted to do that to there own people. I mean look at all what they go through and how hard training is. Plus there are always ways to change someone to an evil pursuit. Anyone can be broken. Now I don't remember what book it was I think the Winds book 1 so I am not too sure. So why not do what Falconsbane did and corrupt many mages to his ways. Lady Windsong wrote Could it be that *because he had to >watch other children burning in the Flames*, Karal mistrusted magic; he >wanted to have nothing to do with it, and so he really didn't want to be a >Channel? I believe that Karal really mistrusted it because I think it was two of his uncles died in the fires for being witches. So he didn't trust the mages that had very high authority. With Ulrich it was different because he was kind and didn't mind telling his protegee stuff about what the others were doing. So he may have started trusting magic again. He certainly wasn't scared of it though or he wouldn't have been with Ulrich, Altra or Andesha My first braid. So how did it turn out. Hopefully all right since I don't know what else to put into these things. Was it long enough and with enough qouted text and writing? Aistes ------------------------------ End of MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 1036 **********************************