MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 1049

Topics covered in this issue include:

  1) Re: Poem/Back!/Newbies/Tom Cruise/music/stupid things/apology??
	by WinterRobin <wayaadis-+AT+-inreach.com>
  2) Newbies/EldersReturn/EquineEmergency
	by tygriss-+AT+-juno.com (Creature Person)
  3) Interview / Music
	by Shdwflt-+AT+-aol.com
  4) Re:poem/Companions/Companion substitutes
	by Faranheit-+AT+-aol.com
  5) Re: country vs. metal/Ah-ha!
	by Chris & Sean Talbot <brujah-+AT+-idirect.com>
  6) Re: Hello again!
	by Chris & Sean Talbot <brujah-+AT+-idirect.com>
  7) Re: Elspeth
	by "Tasha MacClellan" <xenagoo-+AT+-hotmail.com>
  8) Re: Poem/Back!/Newbies/Tom Cruise/music/stupid things/apology??
	by "Tasha MacClellan" <xenagoo-+AT+-hotmail.com>
  9) Re: Poem/Back!/Newbies/Tom Cruise/music/stupid things/apology??
	by Renee Boykin <elven-+AT+-nightshade.ml.org>
 10) Re: Newbies/EldersReturn/EquineEmergency
	by IsleUsher-+AT+-aol.com
 11) [REPOST] Auntie Mel's Rules Of Thumb!  New Users PLEASE read!
	by Shdwflt-+AT+-aol.com
 12) Urban Valdemar Fantasy / Soul's gender / No RPG! / Companions Gone Bad..
	by Shdwflt-+AT+-aol.com
 13) Re: Elspeth
	by Lydia Hales <psu07362-+AT+-odin.cc.pdx.edu>
 14) Elspeth, horses
	by Jan <janprins-+AT+-mindspring.com>
 15) Re: Adrian Paul/Queen/I'm here!!!/Poem
	by WinterRobin <wayaadis-+AT+-inreach.com>
 16) Re: Elspeth
	by Vrondi <deanca-+AT+-student1.concord.wvnet.edu>
 17) Elspeth as in LLL
	by SEANSQ-+AT+-aol.com

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 08 Jan 1997 15:59:33 -0800
From: WinterRobin <wayaadis-+AT+-inreach.com>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: Poem/Back!/Newbies/Tom Cruise/music/stupid things/apology??
Message-ID: <32D434E5.720A-+AT+-inreach.com>

Elven! Cool Poem!!! I'm adding a poetry page to my web page would you
care to have it posted there? I'm still working on my Mercedes Lackey
Page though. 

Romylee A. Ejercito wrote:
> <snip>Basically, I'm back from the Windy City,

Welcome back Mylee!! And welcome backto Shadow Lover and everyone else
that has finally come back home :)

Lythande and Myka welcome to the list!! I hope you have fun here!! This
is a really cool place!

Khrysa Singweaver wrote:
<< YECH! He's a scientologist. And in spite of his background, refuses 
 to do shaych roles. etc etc. No nay never, Tom Cruise must never be 
 permitted to ruin any Valdemar movie (not that there will be any, 
 but..:) >>


>When Tom play Lesant in ,"Interview with a Vampire" Lesant was shaych.
>Movie down played that part, but in book it was prevelent.

I think the only reason he played Lestat was because he didn't have to
show the shaych part of the character, in a Valdemar movie the role of
Vanyel would HAVE to be played with the shaych part because that is a
very important part of the character, you can't drop it out of the movie
as easily as you can from Interview with a Vamipire.

Korendil wrote:
Aistes said, allowing me to catch up on this thread:
>I don't know about that.  Heavy Metal is way to heavy for my tastes.
>Especially for the stuff that Misty has in her books.

>Well--it depends how you classify heavy metal. I mean, you'd be >surprised
>how well 70's hard rock fits fantasy stuff--Rush an' Led Zep, fer >example.

Another good example would be the movie Heavy Metal. It is a fantasy
movie and they used a lot of Classic Rock in it (though back then it was
called heavy metal but now you have junk like Slayer and Danzig, those
would not fit well in a misty movie, unless you use them for the eveil
mages hehe). But I agree that a lot of the 70's rock would fit in a
Misty Movie.

Firemist wrote:
> <snip>I think it's a prerequisite to do or ask one dumb thing at least > once on this list
Myka wrote:
>Gee, do y'all think that maybe Vanyel has something to do with the >Forest
>of Sorrows being the way it is?  (k, so it's a transparently deliberate
>joke...sue me!) 

Umm who's Vanyel?? hehehe
Melanie wrote:
>I'm sorry if I sounded like I was picking on you - I didn't mean to, >honest! 

It's no biggie Mel, in a way I'm glad I changed my name cuz now it'll be
the name of my little niece/nephew!!  Imagine, if I hadn't changed my
name he/she might have ended up with a name like Ralphy boy or
Williamette <winces> heh :) you needn't apologize, there's nothing to
apologize for *smyle*

That's all for now!

WinterRobin (formerly known as Kerowynn k'Sheyna)

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 08 Jan 1997 19:19:49 EST
From: tygriss-+AT+-juno.com (Creature Person)
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Newbies/EldersReturn/EquineEmergency
Message-ID: <19970108.181848.5127.4.Tygriss-+AT+-juno.com>

I'd like to welcome Myka & Lythande (my fave MZB character!) to the list!
 [[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[Myka&Lythande]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]  We're a pretty
easy-going lot, hope you stay for a while!

Mylee, Khenta, HTH, and Shadow-Lover: we have all awaited your return
most anxiously and are pleased you are back!  Big tigerine hug for all of
you: [[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[HUG]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]

Okay, this is off-topic but very important.  My newspaper ran an
Associated Press (written by Martha Mendoza) article on January 5th on
the Wild Horses out west.  The adoption program was doing okay but what
is happening is that it is mostly Bureau of Land Management people
adopting the horses.  I have no problem with that.  I have a serios
problem with them turning around and selling the horses to
SLAUGHTERHOUSES.  Yes, people, it is happening again.  These beautiful
animals are in danger and this time it's from the fools that are supposed
to be helping them.

We need to DO SOMETHING to stop this.  I've spoken with Lady Tresta and
she is in complete agreement.  Let's try to get the word out about this
horrible thing happening to the Internet, e-mail, lists, anything you can
think of.  Contact your senators/representatives who support wildlife
conservations efforts.  If you don't know who they are, try your
Secretary of State's office or the main offices of your Senate and House
of Representatives.

Why this has happened, I don't know but it has to stop.  I know that all
together we can do something.  Spread the word.  I am going to type the
article up for distribution if anyone would like a copy but it may take
awhile; it's pretty long.  Just e-mail that you want a copy and I'll send
it as quickly as I finish it.  That's what I'm planning on doing tonight,
right after I send this.

Good luck and much love to all of you and the horses.

Tygriss

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Jan 1997 20:38:54 -0500 (EST)
From: Shdwflt-+AT+-aol.com
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Interview / Music
Message-ID: <970108175027_844437418-+AT+-emout08.mail.aol.com>

RE: Interview With The Vampire

MROCRO-+AT+-AOL.COM wrote:

<<When Tom play Lesant in ,"Interview with a Vampire" Lesant was shaych.
Movie down played that part, but in book it was prevelent.>>

Right, and I think that's the point of all this.  L'Estat in the books was
homosexual; Tom Cruise, if I remember correctly, refused to play the part if
they didn't tone it down.  So they did for some stupid reason. *grin* 

////////////////////////////////////////

RE: Music

I wrote:

>Indeed.  However, if I had to choose between heavy metal or country, I would
>definitely choose heavy metal.  I mean, a big kick in the 70's and 80's WAS
>fantasy-related heavy metal (to mind, the band MANOWAR springs to mind, with
>metal opuses (opi?) about greek mythology) and it was pretty good... I do
not

And Aistes responded:

<<I don't know about that.  Heavy Metal is way to heavy for my tastes.
Especially for the stuff that Misty has in her books.>>

You mean, Celtic Semi-Metal like... Tempest? *grin* Naaah, they'd NEVER do
anything like that.

<<WEll that isn't very good.  But considering the New Country that was
suggested is basically the same as 80's soft rock you shouldn't really
complain unless you also don't like that.  I mean there is very little that
is different with it.>> 

Who likes 80's soft rock? *grin* I don't...

He also wrote:
<<So you can't really tell me that there is no similarities.  And I doubt any
of you could forget Achy Breaky Heart by Billy Ray Cyrus who is a county
singer.  So right now there is hardly any difference between rock or soft
rock and country music.>>

??  Who was talking about similarities?  I *said* I didn't like the genre.  I
don't like country music *in general* no matter WHAT you call it. Rockabilly
does not equal rock.  :)  Billy Ray Cyrus does not equal, oh, something like
Aerosmith.  Two examples are not proof of a whole genre.  

Burn Brightly,

Jake

--
Jake Adamo (Shdwflt-+AT+-aol.com)

Mercedes Lackey Informational FAQ Administrator
Vice-President, Staten Island Science Fiction and Fantasy 
     Association (SISFFA)
(SISFFA unofficial motto: "Your Rules Don't Apply Here")

"Sounds like a furry red VIBRATOR to me!" -- Robin S. on Tickle Me Elmo

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Jan 1997 20:40:30 -0500 (EST)
From: Faranheit-+AT+-aol.com
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Re:poem/Companions/Companion substitutes
Message-ID: <970108191203_1622654426-+AT+-emout04.mail.aol.com>

  Elven, I loved the poem.  It was great.  I hope you'll write more and post
them on the list if that one is any indication of your talent.

  About Companions, I think also think they all meddled to a greater or
lesser degree.  I think the reason may be because of what they do.  Besides,
they are mortal.  I think everyone feels the need to meddle in someone else's
business once and a while.

   Esmeralda, I like your description of Van and the motorcycle.  <laughter>
 I thought it was incredibly amusing and sounds like a scene from some movie.
 
  
   Peony

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Jan 1997 21:15:14 -0500
From: Chris & Sean Talbot <brujah-+AT+-idirect.com>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: country vs. metal/Ah-ha!
Message-ID: <199701090215.VAA12540-+AT+-nemesis.idirect.com>

>I hate to say this, but you are sick <weg>. You are describing the 
>(IMO) worst thing about pop/alternative/rock stations in the 90's. 
To tell you the truth I listen to any type of music.  But since I like the
80's rock I listen to country.

>Not only did I have to suffer thru country music on the way to 
>school (it's a long story, but it was worth it), but I had to suffer 
>thru it on the RADIO! As a result, I have stopped listening to the 
>radio unless it is news only or classical. Gimme metal any day. At 
>least they don't have accents that drive me up the wall <g>. Oh the 
That is not true very few of the new country artists have accents like what
you are thinking of.  Most of them are singing the same as the other genres
of music do.  I know since I listen to almost everything and anything
including Heavy Metal.  I like Marilyn Manson's songs.  But to tell you the
truth most don't have accents simply because of that reason, I know the
people that I listen to don't have the accents.  I listen to ones which are
counted as Rock as well such as Jann Arden.  I also listen to folk music
which is crossover into country and rock stations.  Mind you the folk I
listen to is only from Canada.  But I must say that unless you happen to
listen to county all the time like me then you would think of the accents.
Most however don't have them.  Right now I am listening to rock and they
have bad accents too.

>Hmm. If we had to choose music for Misty books, _I'd_ pick either 
>folk (then I don't need CD's...g) or rock/pop/alternative. I'd skip 
>my Broadway collection cause most of the songs don't fit. Actually, 
>some of Bach really works well with Misty...
Okay how could you pick rock pop or alternative since most of them are too
harsh for her songs.  You never really hear much about the beat.  But going
with what the area and time was like I would have to say that folk or maybe
soft rock and country would work the best since they sing very softly most
of the time.

Aistes


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Jan 1997 21:15:17 -0500
From: Chris & Sean Talbot <brujah-+AT+-idirect.com>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: Hello again!
Message-ID: <199701090215.VAA12580-+AT+-nemesis.idirect.com>

>	I got lots of books, as presents or with Xmas gift money: _The Art
>of War_ (Sun Tzu), _Descartes' Error_, _Tigana_ (GGKay), _Lady
Tigana I didn't find to great.  I tried to read it and after the first big
break I disliked it because it transferred over to too many people that you
had barely heard of in the first one.
>	Oh yeah, and I got SoI, too. <smug>
I have yet to find it.  Is it any good I have heard some good reviews on it
but I have yet to find it myself and read it.

Aistes


------------------------------

Date: 9 Jan 1997 02:31:26 -0000
From: "Tasha MacClellan" <xenagoo-+AT+-hotmail.com>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: Elspeth
Message-ID: <19970109023126.19587.qmail-+AT+-hotmail.com>

What?  When did Elspeth go bad?  Must happen in WoFury, I guess.  She seemed
fine all the way through the first books.  BTW--Finished WoC.  It was
excellent!

I do agree with the opinion that Gwena acts like an overprotective mother. 
Elspeth was relieved to get out of Valdemar "alone", to get away from Selenay,
but it looks like she got Gwena instead!  Elspeth had to go to the point of
yelling at and threatening Gwena to get the info she needed!  That doesn't
sound like a good relationship to me...

Anyway, I know this is a short post, but, I don't have  much more to say.

WAIT--I am beginning Black Gryphon and it shows the other two in the series as
"coming soon from Daw books" or something like that.  Have they been written? 
Will they ever be, if not?

Icesong

PS--I thought this was the best scene out of any movie I saw this year,
Jacquelle.

>"You broke your little ships."
>Lily to Picard
>Star Trek: First Contact
>


---------------------------------------------------------
Get Your *Web-Based* Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
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------------------------------

Date: 9 Jan 1997 02:43:09 -0000
From: "Tasha MacClellan" <xenagoo-+AT+-hotmail.com>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: Poem/Back!/Newbies/Tom Cruise/music/stupid things/apology??
Message-ID: <19970109024309.23157.qmail-+AT+-hotmail.com>

I know I know...I've posted once, why isn't this in it.  I try not ot do this,
but I don't usually read ~all~ my e-mail before posting...
what I want to say kinda leaks out...very bad.

OK, here goes.

>Khrysa Singweaver wrote:
><< YECH! He's a scientologist. And in spite of his background, refuses 
> to do shaych roles. etc etc. No nay never, Tom Cruise must never be 
> permitted to ruin any Valdemar movie (not that there will be any, 
> but..:) >>


Two questions: 
(1) Who did we say we wanted Tom to play?  Skif?  I still say Richard Gere. 
And, though he may be slightly old, he did do an awesome job in "First Knight"
(the medieval movie he did recently--I got bumped off the list again before I
could answer that!).  Still going for Adrian Paul as Darkwind!  (check out his
pic at www.rysher.com/highlander.  His character's name is Duncan MacLeod.
Hubba hubba, as they say!)
(2)  Shaych?  Wuzzat?


>Korendil wrote:
>Aistes said, allowing me to catch up on this thread:
>>I don't know about that.  Heavy Metal is way to heavy for my tastes.
>>Especially for the stuff that Misty has in her books.
>
>>Well--it depends how you classify heavy metal. I mean, you'd be >surprised
>>how well 70's hard rock fits fantasy stuff--Rush an' Led Zep, fer >example.

Queen.  Definately Queen. They're excellent for movie scores, and they have a
lot of those synthesizer-type reeeally cool music.  And they did a good job on
the Highlander movies.  (Now, who can guess that I like Highlander A LOT?)

Okay.  Maybe I'll be quiet for the rest of the night.

Icesong

PS--Kerowyn?  Where'd you go?  I LIKED your name!


---------------------------------------------------------
Get Your *Web-Based* Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 17:52:08 -0500
From: Renee Boykin <elven-+AT+-nightshade.ml.org>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: Poem/Back!/Newbies/Tom Cruise/music/stupid things/apology??
Message-ID: <32C5A498.1A25-+AT+-nightshade.ml.org>

WinterRobin wrote:
> 
> Elven! Cool Poem!!! I'm adding a poetry page to my web page would you
> care to have it posted there? I'm still working on my Mercedes Lackey
> Page though.

Thanks! I'd be honored if you'd post it there =) (What's your web page 
address?)

Elven

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Jan 1997 21:57:46 -0500 (EST)
From: IsleUsher-+AT+-aol.com
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: Newbies/EldersReturn/EquineEmergency
Message-ID: <970108194954_71274377-+AT+-emout15.mail.aol.com>

Hello Tygriss,

          I would like a copy when you have it.

      Thanks Judy

 (A Horse lover)

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Jan 1997 22:22:51 -0500 (EST)
From: Shdwflt-+AT+-aol.com
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: [REPOST] Auntie Mel's Rules Of Thumb!  New Users PLEASE read!
Message-ID: <970108213540_712513386-+AT+-emout04.mail.aol.com>

Heyla all!

To save Mel the trouble, *grin* I'm going to post this for the benefit of the
New Users here on the mailing list.  PLEASE PLEASE read this, and try and
follow the rules here.. *grin* we WANT to like you, and welcome you into our
wonderful online community, but if you start to really abuse posting (by not
following these guidelines) we tend to get Very Upset. *grin* 

And as another good thing, hey, do us a favor and RTFM! (Read The FAQ
Material.)  It's available on the mailing list homepage, and it'll give you
SOME idea of what's going on here.  Reprinting a section below: here's the
way to get the List FAQ.

"Read the FAQ. The relevant section is posted here semi-regularly;it's also
available via the Web, via FTP, or by mail.

	Web: http://www.herald.co.uk/local_info/lackey_list/lackey_faq.html
	FTP: ftp://ftp.herald.co.uk/pub/lists/lackey-archives/lackey_faq.1
	Mail: send mail to listproc-+AT+-herald.co.uk, leave the subject line
		blank or use "No Subject", message to read

		get mercedes-lackey lackey_faq.1

Don't post your query to the list. If it's a list-related question, and the
answer's not in the FAQ, then send [Mel] mail at lackey-owner-+AT+-herald.co.uk.>>


Your Public Servant,

Jake. (Shdwflt-+AT+-aol.com)

--- Begin Included Message ---

(From Melanie Harper)

As per my comment earlier this week, I notice one-line posts and suchlike
making a bit of a resurgence; for those of you who may not have seen this the
first time round, here's a repost of Auntie Mel's Rules of Thumb for Sensible

Posting. (This will migrate into the FAQ eventually. I'll probably wind up 
posting this each month along with the "how to subscribe/unsubscribe" posting
which is currently part of the FAQ.)


<soapbox mode>

1) Trim quoted text.

	Trim headers to the minimum. We're looking for something along the
	lines of "<X> said:" rather than six lines of quoted header with
	no content. 

	Is all of what you're quoting still relevant? We want enough left
	to keep track of the discussion, not its entire history. BUT -- see
	1a).


1a) Preserve attributions.

	Try, however, to keep track of who did say what. Being misquoted is
	annoying; being quoted as saying something you did not, more so.


2) Think before you post.

	I try to read through all of the list mail that has arrived before I
	post; especially on the weekends, if someone has a general question,
	the chances are extremely good that someone else will already have
	answered before I see it.

	It is obvious that with the delays caused by processing the mail, 
	sending it out, etc., you can't guarantee that nobody will have
	answered a question before you, but if a couple of days have gone past,
	the chances aren't bad.


2a) Keep the fluff level down.

	People's mail systems vary, and many people receive the mailings as
	a digest. The latter group, in particular, cannot just delete 
	individual messages, and I will _not_ tolerate people being driven
	from the group because they cannot keep up with the level of mail, if
	that level is being artificially inflated by fluff. I don't mind the
	occasional off-topic message, but if you're posting several such per
	day, consider yourself warned.

	(Alt.books.m-lackey, the Lackey newsgroup, is far fluff-heavier than
	this list, and this is most likely because it is (generally) easier
	to skip unwanted articles within news readers rather than mail readers.
	It is also the main reason why I read about two articles a day from
	the newsgroup, if that.)


2b) One-liners are a Bad Thing.

	If you feel that you have to respond to someone with a one-line comment,
	and that comment is not an answer to a question that has been asked,
	consider replying by mail directly to that person.

	(Comment: at the moment, because this is a _discussion_ list, the
	default is that, when one hits the 'Reply' button, the mail is directed
	to the list at large, rather than the sender of the message to which
	you are replying. If you do not know how to change this, if necessary,
	you should talk to your local support folks. Asking for help on the
	list is unlikely to be productive, since we don't know what mail 
	system you're using, and they vary wildly.)

2c) Long .signature files are Right Out.
	
	The suggested length of signatures on Usenet is four lines. On this
	list, where many people post several times a day, it is probably safe
	to assume that people will remember who you are after the first post.
	Therefore, attaching an 8 - 10 line signature to every post is seen
	as antisocial. Don't do it.
	

2d) But, but, why can't they just delete or skip over or unsubscribe?

	Why should they have to?

	Some people pay for every byte of mail they receive. (Yes, this is
	still the case in some countries.) Some people pay phone charges to
	download their mail. (Just about anyone in the UK who logs in from 
	home, for starters; local calls are not free in the UK.) I -- or,
	to be strictly accurate, my business -- pay for the link to the Net
	over which list mail is sent. 
	
	Yes, your off-topic postings can inconvenience people. Yes, your 
	long signature is costing people money. No, they can't just ignore 
	it. So don't be so damn selfish.


3) If you've got a query about how to subscribe/unsubscribe/(etc)....

	Read the FAQ. The relevant section is posted here semi-regularly;
	it's also available via the Web, via FTP, or by mail.

	Web: http://www.herald.co.uk/local_info/lackey_list/lackey_faq.html
	FTP: ftp://ftp.herald.co.uk/pub/lists/lackey-archives/lackey_faq.1
	Mail: send mail to listproc-+AT+-herald.co.uk, leave the subject line
		blank or use "No Subject", message to read

		get mercedes-lackey lackey_faq.1

	Don't post your query to the list. If it's a list-related question,
	and the answer's not in the FAQ, then send me mail at
	lackey-owner-+AT+-herald.co.uk.

	Bear in mind that I work (fairly) normal office hours -- this means
	that questions mailed to me over a weekend may not be answered until
	Monday. I might log in over the weekend, but assuming that that will
	be the case is likely a Bad Idea.


4) Other things not to post:

	Almost anything that you have found online, unless it's obviously and
	specifically Lackey-related. _Especially_ if it says "Please post
	this to anywhere you can".

	Notable examples:

		- anything saying "Make Money Fast"

		- any mention of the Good Times virus (it doesn't exist)

		- any request for postcards/business cards/get well cards/
		  to be sent to a little boy who's dying of cancer (he didn't
		  die; he's still alive, and he really, really doesn't want
	  	  any more cards. Neither does his local Post Office, which is
		  also my local office at home!)

		- anything about forthcoming legislation (this is an 
		  international list, and as such any legislation is likely to
		  apply to no more than half of the people on the list)

	If you think that there should be an exception, mail the item concerned
	to me -- mel-+AT+-herald.co.uk -- and if I agree with you, I'll forward it
	to the list. But I'm an unreasonable bitch, as you probably already
	gathered by reading the rest of this post, so don't get your hopes 
	up.

</soapbox mode>

Phew! We now return you to your regularly scheduled discussions.

Mel.


----- End Included Message -----


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Jan 1997 22:56:50 -0500 (EST)
From: Shdwflt-+AT+-aol.com
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Urban Valdemar Fantasy / Soul's gender / No RPG! / Companions Gone Bad..
Message-ID: <970108212902_1757218006-+AT+-emout19.mail.aol.com>

Esme wrote:

<< Oh yes yes yes! I remember we played around with this a year or so back -
I went for a very large, white leather and chrome motor cycle, the Heralds
wearing white leathers (of course), white helmets with mirrored visors - or
maybe just shades. Just picture Van slowly pulling off his helmet and shaking
loose that hair, lowing the shades down his nose and fixing you with those
eyes .... yep, I like it just as much now as I did a year back!>>

The concept is interesting (imagery?  Sorry. Doesn't work for me... .  Now if
it were *Kerowyn* that's another story).  Kind of reminds me of that.. that
TV series wossname... *bing!* Knight Rider.  We'll have a talking Companion
Car! *giggle*

-+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+-

Glithoniel wrote:

<<Several folks have mentioned the sex of the soul question.  I don't think
that souls have gender.  If the soul is genderless, then sexual preference is
a by product of incarnation and not part of the soul's identity.  Souls
aren't feminine, masculine or both.  They just are. Gender based traits are
interpreted by society's current view of masculinity or femininty.  For
instance, several centuries ago men wore as much make-up and jewelry as women
do now.  Ever looked at a portrait of Louis XIV?  >>

I just don't agree with your concept.  If a soul has BOTH genders, your
argument works out just as well. Some disciplines believe the soul has more
than one part --  a masculine (animus) and a feminine (anima) part.  There's
also a Japanese cartoon part (anime) but the existence of it in souls is
doubted.  These various pieces of the soul keep each other in check and
balance. (Boy, can we tell Jake is listening to "Animate" by Rush? *grin*)  

-+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+-

Glith also wrote:

<<Pratchett is a marvelous mixture of humor and sarcasm.  He can slip things
by you that will suddenly come back and hit you from behind. (Like my husband
not realizing that _Lords and Ladies_ was a spoof on  a _Midsummer Night's
Dream_ ).  He's very good at mixing and matching classical plots.  You have
to know things to get some of his jokes.  Last time I was there the L-Space
web had a section devoted to obscure references in Pratchett's works. The man
is good!  >>

You have to *THINK* in order to get his jokes.  That's the best part.   (The
obscure reference file Glith talks about is called the Annotated Pratchett
File, on http://www.lspace.org.. along with the Quote file (around 65 pages)
a list of the Discworld dieties, and other things.)  There's jokes in Latin
(the motto of the Night Watch is "Fabricati Diem, Pvnc!") and other things
that just zing you.  Sure, there's the errant pun or two, but *grin* it's not
as prevalent as some other authors.... 

And of course he has my favorite quote of all time: "I believe that writing
is the MOST fun you can have by yourself!"

-+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+-

Myka wrote:

<<Okay, okay...I've had three people tell me now that it's just not legal  to
make a Misty RPG.  I've got the picture now ;)>>

Oh ho! *giggle* Only three.  You got off lucky.  But, as Information FAQ
admin (and as a bonus to you other newtype people out there) here's the
Straight Dope from Misty herself (well. by proxy, but from herself anyway.)
 This is from Misty and Larry's agent, Mr. Russ Galen.  He posted this a
while ago to abm-l.

"Any use of works by Mercedes Lackey and Larry Dixson in fan fiction or a
role playing game is strictly prohibited.  The reasons are as follows:

A. It is copyright infringement. Any unauthorized use of intellectual
property, whether or not for profit, is copyright infringement.

B. The authors are against it.  Knowing that strangers are making use of
one's world, one's characters, one's creations, is usually a very unpleasant
feeling, one of violation and intrusion.

C. There's been a great deal of discussion here as to whether a MUSH or MUD
would help or hurt the salability of commercial game rights. The fact is, we
don't know. It might have no effect, or a ruinous effect.  There is ample
evidence for both from other media, and I don't know the answer.
Given that uncertainty, we have to err on the side of caution and protection.

D. All of us on this side have discussed this and are resolved to take no
chances with these valuable copyrights, and will vigorously pursue all legal
means at our disposal.  Also, any action we might take 
would not be limited to individuals but to the universities and other
organizations that permit their equipment and lines to be used for this
illegal purpose.

E. Yes, we're greedy and narrow-minded in defense of our clients' ability to
make a living. This is Mercedes Lackey's job. Anything that threatens her
ability to make a living is no less an evil than any
other situation in which an innocent party is forced, by the actions of
strangers, to fight for her livelihood."

Don't play with fire! *giggle* Or at LEAST don't let anyone on the list know
about it.  

-+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+--+AT+-

Firemist said (stolen from another post):

<<But there is a reason why Heralds go along with their Companions' advice
when it is given -- a) they RARELY interfere. if a companion sticks his/her
nose in, then things must be going really WRONG.>>

Well, *thinking evilly* what if the Companions (collectively) decided to Do
Something Wrong on purpose?  I mean, they only speak up when it's desperate.
 Their sparse advice only seems like they act when things are going wrong.
 The Companions seem to have a LOT of clout in Valdemaran (Valdemarian?
 Valdemarite?) society.  Companions never Go Bad?  If they did, Valdemar
would be in TRouble (so much that there's a capital T AND R I think.)

Burn Brightly,

- Jake -

--
Jake Adamo (Shdwflt-+AT+-aol.com)

Mercedes Lackey Informational FAQ Administrator
Vice-President, Staten Island Science Fiction and Fantasy 
     Association (SISFFA)
(SISFFA unofficial motto: "Your Rules Don't Apply Here")

A grazing mace, how sweet the sound, that felled my foe for me /
I bashed his head, he struck the ground, and thus came victory...



------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Jan 1997 20:26:28 -0800 (PST)
From: Lydia Hales <psu07362-+AT+-odin.cc.pdx.edu>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: Elspeth
Message-ID: <Pine.PTX.3.95.970108200226.28941A-100000-+AT+-odin.cc.pdx.edu>



On Wed, 8 Jan 1997, Rozanna J. McNeer wrote:


>. Firemist said:
> 
> In response to Heather's post:
> 
> Heather,  I think you pin-pointed the crux of the matter.
> 
> Elspeth's actions in Winds have always been about getting
> her way; doing things that appear to break the mold/rut that
> Valdemar is in. "We do as our Companions wish because
> That Is The Way Things Have Always Been Done." Which
> strikes a cord in all of us, since I'm sure everyone has come
> against this attitude and rebelled, too. But there is a reason
> why Heralds go along with their Companions' advice when
> it is given -- a) they RARELY interfere. if a companion sticks
> his/her nose in, then things must be going really WRONG.
> for the safety/well-being of Valdemar. . .
 

> {Snipped}

>  Elspeth's actions relfected a more selfish attitude than most
> Heralds exhibit. She prided herself on breaking the mold and
> accomplishing things in a new and novel way -- trying to be more
> like Kero and less like Talia. Unfortunately, Elspeth doesn't
> seem to share Kero's foresight and manner of clear thinking
> in the Winds books. She childishly rebelled against what Gwena
> had planned for her because she didn't like being herded. Well,
> Elspeth, b.f.d. nobody likes to be herded, but fer cryin out-loud,
> look at the precedents! Whenever a companions interferes, some
> serious stuff is going down. You don't argue with the commander
> during a battle; you follow orders. so what if the way she did things
> turned out for the best? the point is, it very well might NOT have.
> 

> Perhaps a new, unpredictable approach was needed.  Ancar had never seen
anything like the way the Hawkbrothers used magic.  I do  agree that she
was acting in a selfish manner, but her mission was to find mages, not to
find a specific mage; so she was following the orders she had from the
Queen.  Rolan and Gwena were trying to manipulate her into a course that
they determined.  Granted, they had the best interests of Valdemar in
mind, but they were interfering with a CHosen.  Remember in Arrow's Fall,
Elspeth asked Dirk why Companions don't interfere, and Dirk answered that
the Chosen would never learn and grow if the Companions interferred with
them every time they were giong to make a mistake.  The same is true here.
If she were unable to locate someone to train her by going to the
Shin'a'in, she would have returned to the original plan.  Elspeth was a
child in a woman's body who had not been allowed to grow up.  Because of
risks, she wasn't allowed to ride circuit.  Her mother was always there;
she was always being observed,, she couldn't have a frienship with Skif
that didn't start rumors of a romance.  In short, she never had the
opportunity to make mistakes and fix them.  She was a child still.  In the
books, she made mistakes that were "coming of age."  She became an adult,
and took adult responsibilities.  She need "outgrow" the rebellious stage
in time.


> It is enough to make you wonder if the only reason Elspeth was 
> chosen was because Talia had managed to make her behave
> somewhat like Chosen-material, Elspeth was the Heir, and Elspeth
> had the Mage-Gift. NOT because she had the true selflessness
> of the other Heralds.
> 
>> I don't think so.  When Darkwind pointed out that her behavior was
inappropraite, she thought about it, and changed.  She took adult
responsibilites and risks, for example, border patrol and "decoy" duty
when Nyara was going into face her father.  She abdicated!  When her
duties as Heir and Herald-Mage conflicted, she gave up a position that she
coveted as a child, and, until she had life experiences that caused her to
mature, she enjoyed the attention of being Heir.  She looked weaknesses
(jealousy, anger) in the face and learned from them, and did not allow
them to control her.  She put her life on the line to go after Ancar.  At
the beginning of the Winds trilogy, she was a bitch, a child.  She was
selfish.  At the beginning of the LHM., Vanyel was a stuck up, self
centered, child.  He matured to become Chosen, and a Herald- Mage.
Elspeth matured to become a good Herald.  Every Herald has their own flaws
and weakness.  Why should Elspeth be an exception.

>> My major complaint with her behavior was how she treated Skif.  He did
not deserve that, but, see my earlier comments about immaturity and
childishness.

Well, now that I've written a book, perhaps I ought to shut up now. 

Lydia 
psu07362-+AT+-odin.cc.pdx.edu


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 08 Jan 1997 23:30:04 -0500
From: Jan <janprins-+AT+-mindspring.com>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Elspeth, horses
Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.19970109043004.006ab7ec-+AT+-pop.mindspring.com>

Hey, y'all!  I'm sorry I don't know how to braid, I have to get my favorite
12- year old to teach me.(He's the one who showed me how to use the net!)

About Elspeth and Gwenna, Etc.--I think Elspeth was an Adult at this point
and Perfectly capable of making decisions on her own.  The problem was( and
doesn't Winds say somewhere) that Gwenna was new and so made some mistakes,
one of which was "herding " Elspeth.  Sure, she needed training for her mage
gift, but Gwenna was trying to make her go one particular place to get it,
whereas Elspeth thought it would be better to get it from the Tayledras.
Elspeth was right to assert herself here, because gwenna was trying to
"micro-manage", and everyone knows thats a no-no.

To tygriss---I read that article about the slaughter of the western wild
horses, too, and I am MAD. I am going to do what I can, writing and such,
not that ol' Sen. Jesse :( and his bud Lauch will do anything, but maybe I
can find somebody else.

Well, it's supposed to ice storm tonight, maybe school will be on a 2 hour
delay and I won't have to face all my kindergarteners until 11:00<g>!
Actually, I love them all to pieces, even the one that hides under the table
and won't come out;)
(hopefully, soon to be) goddess of runny noses and untied shoes
Jayenna


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 08 Jan 1997 20:36:45 -0800
From: WinterRobin <wayaadis-+AT+-inreach.com>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: Adrian Paul/Queen/I'm here!!!/Poem
Message-ID: <32D475DD.735D-+AT+-inreach.com>

Tasha MacClellan wrote:
>Still going for Adrian Paul as Darkwind!  (check out his
>pic at www.rysher.com/highlander.  His character's name is Duncan >MacLeod.
>(Hubba hubba, as they say!)

No Kidding he even looks the part! Long dark hair and all, wonder
whathe'd look like with pure white hair! Hmmm. And QUEEN! YESSS! 
"here we are...born to be kings we're the princes of the universe..."
Did I get that right?? hehe

>PS--Kerowyn?  Where'd you go?  I LIKED your name!
I'M RIGHT HERE!!! *desperatly waving her arms and jumping up and down
frantically* hehe

WinterRobin wrote:
> 
> >Elven! Cool Poem!!! I'm adding a poetry page to my web page would you
> >care to have it posted there? I'm still working on my Mercedes Lackey
> >Page though.

>Thanks! I'd be honored if you'd post it there =) (What's your web page 
>address?)

>Elven

Sure Elven, my web page is http://home.inreach.com/wayaadis/index.html
I'm still in the process of creating the poem page, the only thing I'm
lacking is OH! Dare I say it? POEMS! heheh  If any of you have poems
feel free to send them to me through my webpage and I'll post them up,
your poems can be about anything and everything, just make sure you tell
me what catagory you want it in even if it's a made up catagory hehe.

WinterRobin (formerly Kerowynn k'Sheyna) <--last time I post this :)

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 2 Jan 1997 23:30:11 -0500 (EST)
From: Vrondi <deanca-+AT+-student1.concord.wvnet.edu>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: Elspeth
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.95.970102232940.8708A-100000-+AT+-student1.concord.wvnet.edu>

Gwena can lie mind-to-mind by only telling part of the truth.

-Vrondi a.k.a Chrys Amy Dean, a.k.a Free Bard Oriole.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"To light a candle is to cast a shadow..."
-"A Wizard of Earthsea" by Ursula K. LeGuin
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
http://edweb.concord.wvnet.edu/~deanca/book


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Jan 1997 23:51:03 -0500 (EST)
From: SEANSQ-+AT+-aol.com
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Elspeth as in LLL
Message-ID: <970108231159_1090374571-+AT+-emout15.mail.aol.com>

Here's a thought on the "Is Elspeth a brat thread"

These are the words to the song "Confusions" on the "Lovers, Lore & Loss "
tape

All that I want is a single thing that's mine--
Is that so very selfish, and so much out of line?
All that I want is one corner of my own,
One place where I can be myself, and just myself, alone.

All that I want is a single soul who cares--
I'm watching all the other girls making up their pairs--
And all that I want is the someone meant for me--
Just once to be the kind of girl that others seem to be.

All that I want is to be like all the rest--
Not watching every step I make, not have to be the best--
I'm tired of being held, under every eye--
I want a little freedom, and just once, I want to fly.

All that I want is a little bit of love--
Is that such an awful thing to be dreaming of?
So wrong to be wishing to have what others hold?
Someone to say he cares for me more than for crowns or gold?

Just ordinary-- to be like everyone
Once in a while to laugh and have a little fun
Just to be Elspeth and not the Royal Heir--
I'll never get the chance, and damn it, it's not fair!

All that I want is a single thing that's mine.
Is that so very selfish, and so much out of line?

Words: Mercedes Lackey            Music: Cecilia Eng
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Now of course when one is born into a royal family, they are expected to
simply accept the responsibilities that come with the territory.  But gee
wizz guys, they're only human.  The fact of birth does not automaticlly make
one self-less and willing to sacrifice ones life for the Greater Good.  Any
comments??

Meg :the self-appointed Warm Welcome Distribution Agent
                            Franchises issued upon request

------------------------------

End of MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 1049
**********************************