MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 1057 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Diving In... by Tamarisk 2) Adpets/ fluff: the perfidy of deniz and woodlark by rozanm-+AT+-juno.com (Rozanna J. McNeer) 3) reading order by rozanm-+AT+-juno.com (Rozanna J. McNeer) 4) Re: Diving In... by chelsea etitameh 5) things by Faranheit-+AT+-aol.com 6) Companions lying by Melanie Harris 7) ADMIN: Hotmail by Melanie Dymond Harper 8) ADMIN: horses etc by Melanie Dymond Harper 9) ADMIN: a little respect, if you please by Melanie Dymond Harper 10) TC/S-L/OoAM/Goodness Gracious, Great Balls of Fluff!!!!! by woodlark 11) Re: grumbling by "Sera" 12) 1st title!/Whooppee/Van's priest/welcome Tamarisk by SEANSQ-+AT+-aol.com 13) companions/dragqueens/rolan/bits 'n bobs by dbackhau-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl 14) Hello! by Emma Apted 15) re: hello by dbackhau-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl 16) Scientology by davidt-+AT+-cet.com (D H Tiffany/Shawn Marie Walker) 17) Re: Emma/Shadowlover by WinterRobin 18) Re: Sorry! /Alberich/Welcome back by WinterRobin 19) Re: Braiding Shadows: Tom Cruise/Shadow-Lover by Aimee Dowd 20) Apology by davidt-+AT+-cet.com (D H Tiffany/Shawn Marie Walker) 21) Re: Scientology by LCM46-+AT+-aol.com 22) magic & rpg by DAVID MAGINNIS ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 12 Jan 1997 23:19:03 -0800 From: Tamarisk To: Mercedes Lackey List Subject: Diving In... Message-ID: <32D9E1E7.79CF-+AT+-icok.net> Whew, everyone here knows so much, it's really intimidating! But I shall persevere. My name is Chelsea Lightfoot, but I mostly go by Tamarisk. I just *love* the Diana Tregarde books, but now I can't figure out where to start reading the rest of them! I have the bibliography, but can anyone suggest an order in which to read the books? Or should I just start reading them chronologically? Thanks for any help you can give, and forgive me if I commit any great breaches of etiquette. I'm new here, and just a little confused... -- Y )O( Y )O( Y )O( Y )O( Chelsea/Tamarisk )O( *clight-+AT+-icok.net* Y )O( Y )O( Y )O( Y ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 00:24:44 EST From: rozanm-+AT+-juno.com (Rozanna J. McNeer) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Adpets/ fluff: the perfidy of deniz and woodlark Message-ID: <19970112.232522.11718.1.rozanm-+AT+-juno.com> Rhodri asked: > [srednop] That brings up two questions, then. First, is there any 'minimum >age' to being an Adept? Second, what if a mage were to specialize only in >Gates or such. I realize this is a rare occurence, but would such a mage be >able to do so without needing Adept status? Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't adepts the only ones that can tap into nodes? or can masters? anyway, Firesong was handling node energies at a v-e-r-y young age (it says so in one of the Winds books) which implies he came into his powers quite early. I'd say since it is a combination of both talent and discipline that having an Adept mage at the age of 14 is no more disconcerting than having a black belt in a martial arts at 14. relativley rarer, though. Um, Treyvan was only Master, but couldn't he gate? uhhh, Vikteren (does that make anyone else think of Victor Wren, the guy that does the maps?) managed to wrestle with gates, but someone was thinking at the time :he's only supposed to be Master level, buuuut: as in "guess not". ********************** FLUFF AHEAD AND UNTIL END SKIP AT WILL Mel the Redcap said: >Here comes Mel the Redcap, happily bouncing along wearing her late >Christmas present - knee-high, pointy-toed, stilletto-heeled, lace-up >shiny black boots! Wahey! to which the Duo replied: >hmmmm... in my-soon-to-be-time-honoured-tradition, >Mel? you are beautiful and have amazing socks and are not Goddess of digests >though you've read them all... will you marry me? :splutter: but, but, but DENIZ (wail) I said: >hello both of you ! and you said: >well, hello back to you! you're sure you won't marry us? boo-hoo :treesa-ish vapors: snivel/sniffle/sulk :vapors: pout/flutter eyelashes/look injured and hurt :vapors continued: SOB "You want to marry someone else? WAH! i want my mommy!" heart-rending sobs and shudders wrack her slender frame sniff sni--- "HEY! WAIT! does that mean I can share Mel, too???? now I ~really~ have to think it over." hmmmmm...... gets down on one knee next to Deniz and Woodlark before Mel "Please?" the three chorused. /-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/ Firemist rozanm-+AT+-juno.com Lore-Mistress of the Cat People Goddess of Made From Scratch Foods Bower Denizen ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 01:03:25 EST From: rozanm-+AT+-juno.com (Rozanna J. McNeer) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: reading order Message-ID: <19970113.000358.11718.3.rozanm-+AT+-juno.com> Chelsea/Tamarisk asked: >I can't figure out where to start reading the rest of them! >I have the bibliography, but can anyone suggest an order >in which to read the books? Or should I just start reading >them chronologically? :laughs: you've just asked one of the more hotly debated questions on the list! everyone has an opinion on it by the way Hi! welcome to the list. Just join the line with the others and Mishi, Meg and Fireheart (the Welcoming committee) will be along in a bit to make you welcome soon. . . back to the matter at hand: Since you are already familiar with Misty's work, I'd say start wth the Arrows Trilogy: Arrows of the Queen, Arrow's Flight, and Arrow's Fall. You may get the feeling at the beginning of Arrows1 that the book was written for kids, but it does "grow up" as it progresses. Then I'd read By The Sword. Some will undoubtedly jump in and say read the Honors & Vows Duology next. Well, the main characters in Oathbound and Oathbreakers are in BTS, but it isn't necessary for story continuity. Next, continue with Winds: Winds of Fate, Winds of Change, and Winds of Fury (you will now be fully equipped to jump in the Elspeth argument with textevd and everything!) Then on with the Mage Storms: Storm Warning, Storm Rising, Storm Breaking. for dessert finish with the Last Herald Mage: Magic's Pawn, Magic's Promise, and Magic's Price. anyway, those cover the most frequently discussed books on the list. Yes, guys, I realize I left out the Mage Wars: Black Gryphon, White Gryphon, and Silver Gryphon, but we hardly discuss those. Good read. Don't let the series title fool you; only the first book is set during the actual wars; the other two deal with recovery in the aftermath of the wars. and work in the Oath series other goodies include FireRose, Firebird, her short-stories in various anthologies (note: if you have a copy of Sword and Sorceress 3, LOCK IT UP! everyone on this list lacking that book would do just about anything to get their hands on it. you have been warned. ) Elves in Suburbia: the Bedlam Bardz & SERRAted Edge, Bard's Tales, Bardic Voices, Bardic choices (same world, same characters; methinks 'twas a misprint and 'tis the same series) and last, but not least, Di. oh! nearly forgot Sacred Ground. and the Elven series with Andre Norton. and Tiger Burning Bright. think that's covered it wait -- HEY JAKE!!! WHEN IS OATH BISECTED COMING OUT?!?! BEFORE OR *AFTER* OATH BISEXUAL?!?! /-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/ Firemist rozanm-+AT+-juno.com Lore-Mistress of the Cat People Goddess of Made From Scratch Foods Bower Denizen ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 00:04:02 -0700 (MST) From: chelsea etitameh To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Diving In... Message-ID: On Mon, 13 Jan 1997, Tamarisk wrote: > My name is Chelsea Lightfoot, but I mostly go by Tamarisk. one quick request... could we try to use Tamarisk for Chelsea Lightfoot? ...i get confused when i see things like "Chelsea said" when i didn't!! ;) :) ...and i'm willing to go by either chelsea or etitameh or both, whichever works best (not that i'm exactly active, but... just in case ;) chelsea etitameh chelsea.fischer-+AT+-colorado.edu http://ucsu.colorado.edu/~ccfische caf0001-+AT+-jove.acs.unt.edu http://people.unt.edu/~caf0001 disclaimer: the above probably makes no sense... deal with it ::smirk:: ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 02:25:16 -0500 (EST) From: Faranheit-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: things Message-ID: <970113022515_1791418375-+AT+-emout06.mail.aol.com> Wow, I see that I've missed a lot in just a couple days. I couldn't find the time to check my mail. I must be sure to keep up with you guys. What other ML books are out there besides the ones that take place in Velgarth, and the urban fantasies and the one coauthored with Anne McCaffrey. I've read all of those and I'm trying to expand my horizons. Also, are they any good? Tom Cruise, hmmm, well I have to say that though I find him to be very handsome, I can't see him doing a movie about Valdemar. (well, let me take that back, he was in Legend, so maybe he could). And I saw something about the Order of Amber and Marigold on a recent post. I gathered it was something related to Van, I can understand the reference to amber, but what does Marigold stand for? Oh, how do I join you guys? One more thing, if any of you want some author recommendations, I would give you Meredith Ann Pierce. She is a bit hard to find and many of her books are out of print, but most libraries I've been to have her novels. She is the one who truly converted me to fantasy. Bye for now, Peony ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 18:32:14 +1000 From: Melanie Harris To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Companions lying Message-ID: <32D9F30E.4313-+AT+-mat.army.defence.gov.au> Mel the Redcap typing something in for Max again... re: whether or not Companions can lie - Storm Rising, Florian to Karal (admittedly not Companion to Chosen, but still...) "...even if I have to tell an untruth and claim you're with me." ???comments??? Max. Mel again: I think that was when Karal wanted to take An'desha down to the Compass Rose to meet the artificers without anyone else finding out... Obviously, Florian *can* lie - because if he couldn't lie, then saying he *could* tell an untruth would be a lie, and he couldn't say it... ooooo... why did I just go cross-eyed and dizzy? Mel the Redcap various titles that I'm not gonna bother putting on a post this short ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 11:22:41 GMT From: Melanie Dymond Harper To: mercedes-lackey Subject: ADMIN: Hotmail Message-ID: <199701131122.LAA23099-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk> I'm awarding Hotmail my "I Want To Strangle Your Mail Administrators" award for this week for the recent changes to their system; previously addresses from Hotmail were getting picked up as 'name-+AT+-www.hotmail.com', now they're being picked up as 'name-+AT+-hotmail.com'. To add insult to injury, sending mail to 'name-+AT+-www.hotmail.com' doesn't actually work any longer. (No cutover period? No information to the users so that they can make alterations when needed? Ah, the sarcasm, it drips from my tongue like somewhat-rotten golden syrup, can you hear it?) I think I have fixed all of the addresses on the Lackey list, but if you know anyone who uses Hotmail on this list or others run from Herald (the Lois Bujold list, for example) who hasn't received mail lately, please let them know that they'll probably need to unsubscribe from the old address and resubscribe from the new one. If they can't unsubscribe the old one, tell them to get in touch with me and I will do it for them. Mel ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 11:23:38 GMT From: Melanie Dymond Harper To: mercedes-lackey Subject: ADMIN: horses etc Message-ID: <199701131123.LAA23103-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk> Tygriss has apologised to me for the off-topic alert, so the subject is now declared closed. Mel ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 11:29:44 GMT From: Melanie Dymond Harper To: mercedes-lackey Subject: ADMIN: a little respect, if you please Message-ID: <199701131129.LAA23902-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk> One of our less-vocal listmembers who happens to have strong Christian beliefs wrote to me off-list to express dismay at the song _A Grazing Mace_ which was posted the other day. He believes it's extremely disrespectful of a very well-loved Christian song. I realise that the person who posted it to this list didn't write it, but I'd ask that it not be posted again; this list has a good reputation for tolerance of all beliefs, and I'd like that to continue. Followups on this to me, NOT THE LIST, thank you. Mel ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 97 08:46:49 -0500 From: woodlark To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: TC/S-L/OoAM/Goodness Gracious, Great Balls of Fluff!!!!! Message-ID: <199701131350.IAA12420-+AT+-sirocco.CC.McGill.CA> ShadowLover said: > On the purely superficial side, and being shaych myself, I have to >say TOM CRUISE IS A HOTTIE... But that's not what this is all about... Let quite a few generations agree with you there. this girl, however, doesn't see what all the fuss is about. yeah, he's cute, but not *that* cute. maybe in a uniform... >me start with *THIS IS NOT A FLAME*... I've just seen a lot of really harsh >Cruise bashing going on, and had to get my word in... First on the subject >of scientology: I'm not exactly familiar with the make and method of the >Scientological church, but that doesn't exactly matter... The point is that >I'm very surprised to see people on-list denouncing someone for thier >religion... err... before i begin... TINAF... so now let's take a stroll through memory lane... i believe the person who first brought this up(down, delete finger, down) said, iirc, something along the lines that they were *surprised* TC was a scientologist and was refusing to play queer roles. when i read that post, it gave me the feeling that the scientologist church is accepting of queer society. NOBODY has actually stated what this church's policy is toward queers. everybody has said, "mumble mumble i'm not sure what the scientologist church says mumble mumble" and have refrained from commenting on that part. we're not bashing him for his religion. we're not bashing his religion. we're smart enough to know that we need more information before we can form an opinion about his religion. we're not bashing him. we're bashing the attitude we are perceiving. what you said, however, sheds a new light on said attitude. > Now on to more Misty related subjects, since this is after all the >Mistylist... Where do you think the ispiration for the Shadow-Lover came >from? It's a very new concept, that is very dissimilar to any of >the Grim-Reaper/Mortis/On a Pale Horse/Thanatos views of Death that are in >(neo)classical literature... Any ideas where it may have sparked from? do you mean the concept of Death being desirable? Here's a quote from Neil Gaiman, creator of Sandman, on how he created his character of Death. If you haven't met her yet, find some Sandman and do, it's definitely worth it.: "There's a tale in the Caballa that suggest that the Angel of Death is so beautiful that on finally seeing it (or him, or her) you fall in love so hard, so fast, that your soul is pulled out through your eyes. I like that story. There's an Islamic story that declares that the Angel of Death has huge wings covered in eyes and that as each mortal dies one of its eyes closes, just for a moment. I like that story too, and take pleasure in imagining huge wings, and a ripple of ever-opening, ever-closing beautiful eyes. And there's a touch of wish fulfillment in there too. I didn't want a Death who agonised over her role, or who took a grim delight in her job, or who didn't care. I wanted a Death that I'd like to meet, in the end. Someone who would care. Like her." - Author's note, Death Gallery, No. 1, 1994 hope that helps, Shadow Lover! i just realized... i'm not trying to say that Gaiman came up with the concept, i'm just using his words to show that it's existed for a long time. the concept of a grim Death is pretty Christian/Western if i remember correctly. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Peony wondered: >And I saw something about the Order of Amber and Marigold on a recent post. > I gathered it was something related to Van, I can understand the reference >to amber, but what does Marigold stand for? Oh, how do I join you guys? remember Van's miracle cream that he uses for Stef's fingers? That was one of the ingredients. And just pay your respects to Heather (she's the Grand Dame and Founder of the OoAM) and promise to protect Van from people who think he (*gasp*) snivels and whines, and add the title to your sig! it's that easy. oh, and you can be a knight or a dame, just depends on how you feel, not your gender. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Firemistywisty wrote: >:splutter: > >but, but, but DENIZ (wail) I said: >>hello both of you ! > >and you said: >>well, hello back to you! you're sure you won't marry us? Well, you *did* reject us pretty firmly with that line about being married, yourself! Besides, you ought to know that woodlark is a little... ...fickle. >gets down on one knee next to Deniz and Woodlark >before Mel > >"Please?" the three chorused. > > glad to see you got over it though, mistywisty. that's the spirit! and you know, of course, that i still love you, right? don't forget that. if i propose to somebody else, it's not because i don't love you, but because... (think fast, woodlark, come on)... i respect your devotion to your husband and will just have to turn to others to satisfy the void in me... no... well... remember i proposed to you first. that's special. perfidy! i'm in shock! is that a compliment or an insult? love, free bard woodlark, Acolyte in | "So don't you question my counseling Music and Song, Knight of Amber| technique! It's a primitive culture." and Marigold, and party to | Deanna Troi, Star Trek: First Contact deniz's thoughts and computer. | dsarik-+AT+-PO-Box.McGill.CA http://www.geocities.com/CollegePark/9359/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 08:21:05 CST From: "Sera" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: grumbling Message-ID: <255DD020D2B-+AT+-email.rosary.edu> Liseth wrote: > I could swear I'm writing to myself. I say something, nobody responds to it, > > and soon I find that someone else has said almost the same thing, but not as > indepth. I 'spose I'll have to live with it. Well, Liseth, I am sorry to hear that you feel unloved, but you can now consider yoursel responded to! I know the feeling though! Sera * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * "Truly madam, you have a dizzying intellect." The Princess Bride "On the road of knowledge we all walk in life, Watch out for the speedbumps!" Me "Men are the infinite loops in the computer program of life." Kathy Becknek * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Liz Blaszak blaszael-+AT+-email.rosary.edu http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Vault/3772/ (708) 524-6997 X2076 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 09:23:12 -0500 (EST) From: SEANSQ-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: 1st title!/Whooppee/Van's priest/welcome Tamarisk Message-ID: <970113092311_945799564-+AT+-emout13.mail.aol.com> >Meg- I hereby dub thee, Assistant to God of new homes, specializing in >Neighborhood Welcoming committees. Huraaayyyyy!!!!My first legitimate title! Am I excited!! (Meg does war dance around the table in the computer room while the dogs and cat look on shaking their furry heads in sympathy. She's really losing it now!) Oh, Firemist, here's my favorite zip-lock bag of "real- made-from-scratch-recipes" in thanks for being the very FIRST to include me with the regulars on the list. I'll do my very best to live up to my new "monicker". >Hi! welcome to the list. Just join the line with the others >and Mishi, Meg and Fireheart (the Welcoming committee) >will be along in a bit to make you welcome soo `````````````````````````````````` Since most of the regulars are back from time off/vacations etc, this is something that came up just before the end of the year that I don't think anyone had the answer for. Any takers? On 12/28 Star said that Chris said: '>Nuff space. Here goes, and I even have textevd courtesy of Chris. >Page 361, Vanyel: "If I ever have the opportunity, remind me to tell >you of another young servant of Vkandis that I met, who proved to me >that not all of the folk who used Vkandis' Name to justify their actions >should be lumped together into a single category." >Now, can anyone tell me when this happened? We've thought through all >of the LHM series, and neither of us can think of it. Anyone? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Warm welcome to Tamarisk! Meg opens the door to the Community Welcome Lodge to reveal a warmly decorated suite just for your use. (Of course for a weekend only. Do you think we're made of marks/rubles/money??) Seriously, tho, we're glad to have you a part of the list. Just jump in and join the fun. (But watch out for the POUNCER! ) Meg Assistant to God of new homes, specializing in >Neighborhood Welcoming committees. OOPs does this mean my request for a title from Korendil is null and void?? I hope not. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 97 15:57:24 +0100 From: dbackhau-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: companions/dragqueens/rolan/bits 'n bobs Message-ID: <9701131457.AA06143-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl> hola, I wrote: > I'm going off these Companions you know. A bit Big Brother'ish aren't > they? This is the best way, so you will do it - and anyone who rebels > just gets a bit of brain work. Brrr! and Cen replied: > Well, I don't remember them using their power indiscriminately. Also, you > must remember that whatever they are, they are also agents of the gods of > Velgarth. If you accept that the gods know what they are doing (instead > of playing with lives of mortals and using loaded dice), then it follows > that the Companions have mandate to use their power and the justification > that what they are doing is the "right thing." weeelll, now lemme think ............... nope - it smacks of paternalism. Them deciding what's good, and what the Heralds/population shouldn't be bothering their pretty little heads about. I also think that once you've realised that a Companion can totally mindwash you without you having any inkling, there'd always be a suspicion that maybe they'd done it more than once. I also agree with Seanna aka Sanna Koulu's comments > There seems to be something morbid and unhealthy about the idea of > dead people (or divine spirits) coming back to rule over the current > generation with an iron hoof, so very holier-than-thou. How is society to advance if it is controlled by blasts-from-the-past? The "We did it that way when I was a student, and it never did me any harm" approach. It was the mass-tinkering over Stefan's death/disappearance that bothered me. I mean why? It's not as as his physical remains were needed (??), so why couldn't he die, have his state funeral and mass mourning, while his soul is whooping it up with Van? Mind you, the reason is probably that it suited what ML wanted to happen. Just like Talia's forgetting at the beginning of Arrows - it let us know early on what Rolan was capable of. ==================================================== Cen also wrote: > Seriously, it might be interesting to have a drag queen play Firesong. > Admittedly, he is male (so the cross-gender drag wouldn't be necessary), > but Firesong is definitely a major queen, and his very stylized clothing > does count as "drag." Only if they do the voice straight - I could take a drag queen Friesong, but not the awful campy, lispy intonation that so many gays I've come across affect. I "hear" his voice as normal male. (This is an opinion - that's all) I was walking from A to B in London on Sunday lunchtime, when I first walked past the Italian Church kicking out - hoards of italians in their Sunday best, lots of black clad ladies, then rounded a corner to where a big gay bar was also having a major chuck out - hoards of denim and leather and black clad, moustachioed men. The contrast between the two groups was ...... interesting! ============================================ --Aimee asked, (welcome back BTW) > This has been bothering me for a while. Why can't Rolan talk to Talia? We have done this at some length in't past, but I don't recall anyone ever coming up with a really good reason. There's some evidence that he's not very good at it, gets tired or something, (Oh lah, my aching head), but that always struck me as a slightly wet excuse. So, I'm seconding this! Vrondi has mailed with a argument saying the mindspeech requires a sender and a receiver, - yes I can buy that, but there are times when Talia really, seriously could do with a helpful word or two (like "Will you stop being such a stupid cow, go find him, and just tell him fercristsake!" - thus sparing us a chunk of angst from Arrows 3.) ============================================ Kory asked: >>On Esmeralda's Vanyel Vision: YUM! Now that you put it that way, I see him >>in a whole different light -- and leathers! > >Esme? Who originally said that? Was it you? I remember when it was first >posted...but not by whom... t'was me. Ages back now - can't remember why we got onto it, but, as one who longed for a leather clad motor-cyclist boyfriend when she was about 12 (I got him at 18!), and one who dearly loved her Kawasaki 650, I've always had a slight thing for motorcyclists. ============================================ Jake - > Top Ten Connotative Lines from _Magic's Pawn_ thankee very much - enlivened a very tedious afternoon! Oh and Tom cruise - he's a touch short for me - I like to look my men in the eye (I stand 5'11" in my bare feet), but, theres this wonderful volleyball scene in Top Gun, including him and Val Kilmer that I just absolutely adore! Scientologists - declared persona no gratia in Germany I believe - membership is considered grounds for not getting jobs/being asked to leave. They boycott movies with Scientologist stars, I'm not at all sure why. 'kay, that's me, dooie, Esmeralda ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 15:16:01 +0000 From: Emma Apted To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Hello! Message-ID: <199701131516.PAA17454-+AT+-staff.uk.psi.com> Hi everyone, This is really just an 'hello, I'm new!' email ;) I started reading Mercedes Lackey books about a year ago. A friend of mine uses the 'Vanyel' name on-line and I asked him where it came from and he told me about the books. I like to read series of books in chronological order, so I read the Black Gryphon first, waited ages for the Silver Gryphon to be published (I do like the idea of kestra'chern!). The LHM trilogy was excellent, I think everyone agrees that Vanyel is one of her best written and most-loved characters. I'm currently reading the short story from the Sword & Sorceress book that is set 'next', and my boyfriend bought me 'Oathbound' for Xmas, which wasn't easy to find! My main question is, as I haven't read that many of her books, am I going to be totally confused by the discussions here? It seems that people use spoiler space for some books, which is great.... but I still find myself wondering who all the characters are that people mention (Talia, Rolan?) and if it's just that I haven't read that story yet, or my memory failing! So, shall I stick around and just read quicker? Or shall I unsubscribe and join again when I've read more? ;) Great list anyway... if you can somehow mention Highlander, Tom Cruise and Queen in a mailing list for such a great author, I may well stay despite the confusion ;) Thanks! Emma (,sig pending ;) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 97 17:15:09 +0100 From: dbackhau-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: re: hello Message-ID: <9701131615.AA06309-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl> Emma wrote: > My main question is, as I haven't read that many of her books, am I going > to be totally confused by the discussions here? It seems that people use > spoiler space for some books, which is great.... but I still find myself > wondering who all the characters are that people mention (Talia, Rolan?) > and if it's just that I haven't read that story yet, or my memory failing! The clatter was EE falling off her chair at the thought of someone not knowing who Talia and Rolan are. Hmmmm - well as an oooooold Misty reader who's followed her as she published, waited and sweated blood for each flaming part to crawl out from under the publisher's mercenary grip, I am not of the "read 'em in chronological order" school. Read Arrows, now. Before Oathbound/breaker and By the Sword - you don't need to have read them first. Oh my - what a treat you have in store - being able to go straight from Arrows to Winds to Storm without having to stop for a year or so for part 2/3 to appear. > So, shall I stick around and just read quicker? Or shall I unsubscribe and > join again when I've read more? ;) Oh I'd stick around - when you finally do read these characters you'll be sitting there thinking "So *that's what they meant", and "I know this person already". Mind you, I read all spoilers - I'm even known to read the end first. So if you're a don't-tell-me-the-end-or-I'll-die sort of person, then maybe you'd better line up a week or two of serious reading, then leap in! Welcome, Esmeralda Evensbane ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 09:11:54 -0800 From: davidt-+AT+-cet.com (D H Tiffany/Shawn Marie Walker) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Scientology Message-ID: Joshua Jones wrote: > On the purely superficial side, and being shaych myself, I have to >say TOM CRUISE IS A HOTTIE... But that's not what this is all about... Let >me start with *THIS IS NOT A FLAME*... I've just seen a lot of really harsh >Cruise bashing going on, and had to get my word in... First on the subject >of scientology: I'm not exactly familiar with the make and method of the >Scientological church, but that doesn't exactly matter... The point is that >I'm very surprised to see people on-list denouncing someone for thier >religion... Once upon a time there was a second class scifi writer who was doing screenplays in Follywood and attended a party where the disscussion came around to ways of making lots of money. "You could always start a church and then..." suggested someone. "Hmmmm," said our L. Ron Hero. At least that's the story attested to by those still living that attended a certain party in the Hollywood hills back in the late 40's. Saying that there is no one true way is not the same as saying that all ways are true. Look what happened to the Son of the Sun before Solaris! This really isn't meant as a flame but when something is known to be a con you can't really expect people to take it seriously! I'll give a lot of faiths the benefit of the doubt but there is no doubt about scientology, it's a fraud! One can feel sorry for the poor folks, such as Mr Cruise, taken in by it though. David Tiffany, Gort fo tipots (Hey do you think I could make money from this? 8-{)# ) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 13:45:16 -0800 From: WinterRobin To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Emma/Shadowlover Message-ID: <32DAACEC.574-+AT+-inreach.com> Emma Apted wrote: > The LHM trilogy was excellent, I think everyone agrees that Vanyel is > one of her best written and most-loved characters. Hook, line and sinker!! *reels in the newbie* Welcome to the list Emma!!!! LHM is my favorite of the trilogies (Magic's Price being my favorite cuz it's one of the few books I cried to because of the characters) Vanyel is definately a great character *getting a little misty eyed*. > So, shall I stick around and just read quicker? Or shall I unsubscribe > and join again when I've read more? ;) STAY!!!! I haven't read the Arrows Trilogy yet so you aren't the only one who hasn't read all her books *smyle* I'm gonna have a nervous breakdown soon if I can't find those books. People! I have looked in used book stores and new books stores and I can't find the Arrows Tril!! Oh well, I don't really like to buy stuff over the internet, wait, no that's not true I bought the Apocolypse Riders sword from Swords-n-Stuff Okay! I'm going over to Amazon.com to check there. *sheeps to the one who told the list about Amazon.com and to those who kept suggesting it* > Great list anyway... if you can somehow mention Highlander, Tom Cruise > and Queen in a mailing list for such a great author, I may well stay > despite the confusion ;) Errr did someone say.....Highlander!?!?!?! "There can be only one!" hehe cool Emma you are thiiiis [] close to becoming a Cybersis here *gryn* > >Now on to more Misty related subjects, since this is after all the > >Mistylist... Where do you think the ispiration for the Shadow-Lover > >came from? It's a very new concept, that is very dissimilar to any > >of the Grim-Reaper/Mortis/On a Pale Horse/Thanatos views of Death > >that are in (neo)classical literature... Any ideas where it may have > >sparked from? woodlark wrote: > do you mean the concept of Death being desirable? Here's a quote from > Neil Gaiman, creator of Sandman, on how he created his character of > Death. If you haven't met her yet, find some Sandman and do, it's > definitely worth it.: I agree with this but I also think that when someone is close to death or is in quite a lot of pain, they would rather have death than the pain and would welcome it with open arms. IMHO severe pain is far worse than death. I'm not taliking about the pain from a broken arm. I'm talking about the pain from having your whole body crushed beyond repair without the help of prosthetics or metal rods. Or those who have cancer, yeah they fight for life but sometimes you get tired of fighting and the pain makes you so miserable you would love to have death than deal with the pain (words from my late sister). It's just me rambling but this is just how I think Misty got the term for Shadow-lover, death being dark (but who's to say it's not light) hence the Shadow and wanting/yearning/wishing for death over pain, lover. *braces herself for at least 20 rebuttles* WinterRobin http://home.inreach.com/wayaadis/bardcircle.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 13:54:02 -0800 From: WinterRobin To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Sorry! /Alberich/Welcome back Message-ID: <32DAAEFA.62C4-+AT+-inreach.com> I was going to add this on to the other letter but I forgot and realized that too late, sorry!!! Vickie Lambert wrote: > > On 01-12-97 Winter Robin suggested Michael Ironside as an evil > character. > No, no, no. How about casting him as Alberich instead. He has the > toughness of looks and character to scare Talia out of her wits at > first glance. Aye 'tis the truth! I just have a problem with him playing a good guy, he looks too darned evil to be good, hehe, even when he was in that series in the early 80's "V", he played a good guy but he was always an arse to everyone. But he would make a great merc though *smyle* Welcome back Ailsa!! I'm one of the newbies that joined while you were away *gryn* WinterRobin ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 97 16:51:14 EST From: Aimee Dowd To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-HERALD.CO.UK Subject: Re: Braiding Shadows: Tom Cruise/Shadow-Lover Message-ID: <970113.170357.EST.AIMEDOWD-+AT+-UGA.CC.UGA.EDU> This is just a quick thought I had. Shadow-Lover was asking about where we think Misty got the idea for the Shadow-Lover, and about how unique it was for death to be portrayed as a lover and not something to be feared. It reminded me a a story I once read by Peter Beagle -- I think it was called "Come, Lady Death," or something like that. It has been a REALLY long time since I read it, but, iirc, Lady Death in that story was very polite and gentle and a relief to the woman she came for. But it's been so long since I read it that I could very easily be conflating it with some other story I read. Hmm. I think now I have to go and re-read that story, if I can find it again! Anyway, before I send this message off, I just want to say that I think Misty did a really good job in LHM in the scene with the Shadow-Lover. It was really powerful. It still moves me whenever I re-read LHM! --Aimee +=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=* Aimee Dowd * Outside of a dog, a book The University of Georgia* is man's best friend. Inside Department of English * of a dog, it's too dark to read. aimedowd-+AT+-uga.cc.uga.edu * -Groucho Marx *=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=* ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 14:23:59 -0800 From: davidt-+AT+-cet.com (D H Tiffany/Shawn Marie Walker) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Apology Message-ID: I think I owe the list an apology for my post on Scientology. I was confusing it with a similar group which has the founding history I put forth. I'm sorry the post got sent, another family member uploaded the mail while I was taking a nap, I woke up and realised my error but the post was already gone. most abject apologies David Tiffany ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 17:24:56 -0500 (EST) From: LCM46-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Scientology Message-ID: <970113142716_201882041-+AT+-emout10.mail.aol.com> Sheesh--------all I asked was who Tom Cruise could play, didn't mean to start a religious uprising, although, I am in thorough agreement with the forg od ytpos on the subject: any "religion" founded by a not-so-hot SciFi writer (I REFUSE to buy his books!) makes you wonder, doesn't it???? Besides Cruise, Travolta and Lisa Marie Presley are also members------wonder what you get for your $$$ by being a member? I would prefer to worship our own God of Typos first----here's looking at you, GDO! Maybe I'll start my own place of worship for disgruntled domestics! Nah, haven't got the time, and, it'd cut into my reading time. Am currently scouring for SOI, local stores are either out, or haven't heard of it----------stooges, all of 'em. Yers turly, Lorraine Goddess of Domesticity/Laundry But I'm not dead yet! MP/Holy Grail ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 22:36:44 +0000 From: DAVID MAGINNIS To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: magic & rpg Message-ID: <32DAB8FC.10BC-+AT+-netcomuk.co.uk> Hi, In all the Valdemar books we see various types of mages and magic.Yet the companions are not direct mages even if they were mages when they were heralds,Florian for instance admits he is a mage in Storm warning. I just wondered if anyone had thought about reasons for this restriction?.After all if some of the companions had used magic directly then some heralds might not have lost their lives. new topic: I just wondered if anyone knew of any shareware rpg's that were top class and also if anyone wanted to teach me and play an rpg by email?. yours, Sinnigam aka david ( UK ) ------------------------------ End of MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 1057 **********************************