MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 1073 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Braid:FireRose/Caffeine/SB (no spoilers)/Elvenbane/colds?Hotmail/AOL/ by "Shy Kraytman" 2) What is Fantasy Fiction? by "H.D. Wegemer" 3) speech by LCM46-+AT+-aol.com 4) ADMIN: Hotmail, again by Melanie Dymond Harper 5) Re: Birthday Stuff/Bad People/Gala/Dialects by nme848-+AT+-hecky.acns.nwu.edu (Nina Ehgartner) 6) birthing days/Chantel|Aerden by vrondi-+AT+-juno.com (Chrys A Dean) 7) Midori Snyder Question(off-Topic with apologies) by vrondi-+AT+-juno.com (Chrys A Dean) 8) Re: Emotional Tolkien by Eugene McDougall 9) Re: Midori Snyder Question(off-Topic with apologies) by rozanm-+AT+-juno.com (Cat Person) 10) Unsubbing temporarily by myktshr-+AT+-ldd.net (miyako hirao) 11) Re: Birthday Stuff/Bad People/Gala/Dialects by "JAIME HATHAWAY" 12) Fire Rose and silk robes by "Shy Kraytman" 13) Tylendel by chenchen-+AT+-rgs.edu.sg 14) Midori/Fire Rose Silk by vrondi-+AT+-juno.com (Chrys A Dean) 15) Re: Tylendel by Chris & Sean Talbot 16) Norton/Zaleka/Harmful Things/Bad People/Tolkein/SoI by Lee <97jsalaz-+AT+-jasper.uor.edu> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 24 Jan 1997 00:52:08 -0000 From: "Shy Kraytman" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Braid:FireRose/Caffeine/SB (no spoilers)/Elvenbane/colds?Hotmail/AOL/ Message-ID: <19970124005208.18853.qmail-+AT+-hotmail.com> ~~~~~ Cennydd wrote: "For those who were interested, there is not yet a God or Goddess of Caffeine." Kenny, Did you say. . . CAFFEINE???!!!!! ~~~~ Liseth wrote: "I just managed to finish _The Fire Rose_ yeste... um, sorry, this morning. Well, I started it yesterday, I guess I read to much. My question is if Misty is planning to write more in that particular "universe." Well, this universe, that is. The characters intrigue me." I read an interview w/ Lackey on one of the links I found coming from the heraldic circle pages that although she's not sure she wants to follow up with those exact characters, doing a historical fiction novel really intrigued her and she's looking into the possiblity of a similar project in the future. ~~~~~~~ Dyana wrote: "And, while I'm asking for response, would someone please tell me why I seem to be the only one who thought that Rose gave Jason(I hope that's his name) the wrong color pouch from the chinese man?" I didn't notice it the first time but I went back yesterday and checked. Not only did she give his the wrong package, she (or rather, Misty) miscounted the package. I can't give you the exact quote or pages because the book isn't with me but this is what Misty wrote First she described Master Pao making up the packages, one in blue with the replica of the recipie Rose asked for, one in green with his own recipie for the same stuff, one in WHITE so she could get the necessary amount of restful sleep in only four hours, and a FOURTH package in red. Then he goes on to explain each one to her and asks her to try to get Jason to take the medicine and when she takes the stuff Misty wrote that she gathered up the THREE packages. (Looks like someone forgot how to count!) When she returns and the Salamander she unwraps the WHITE package. Dyana, you aren't crazy. There really is a mistake there. ~~~~~~ I don't remember who wrote this (and I wouldn't be able to remember the name at a swordpoint) but the gist of the post was that Misty's books are so addictive at any age is because she manipulates emotions so well that the reader is drawn into the story. The problem with the SW, SR, SB series is that didn't feel drawn in. I understand exactly how you feel. I read the trilogy becaue Misty wrote it, but I think that neither this nor White or Silver Gryhon were close to her best works. (Black Gryphon was pretty good) I don't feel as much emotionally bonded with the characters. I symphathize with them, I'm upset if someone dies, but I'm not as torn apart as I am whenever I reread Vanyel. Fire Rose IMHO, was also one of Misty better books, along with the Winds. I think that by the Storms, Misty lost something in her writing. ~~~~~~~ I read Elvenblood and Elvenbane a while ago and I REALLY enjoyed the books. I'm not sure why, but I've always had the impression that this was a trilogy. Can anyone confirm/deny this? ~~~~~~ I HATE COLDS . The wheather finally got out of the ungodly negatives and its actually NICE outside for a change and I'm SICK, STILL!!! AGAIN!!! WHATEVER!!! I'm on too many medications to count and would rather curl up in my nice, warm, comfy bed and sleep for the next week if I didn't have classes. ~~~~~~ Hotmail users: Has anyone else had trouble recieveing and sending out mail? Or am I the only one that seems to be inept? I have had occasions where I got my mail three weeks late (snail mail can beat that one!) and I sent out a letter and four weeks later I got a notice saying that hotmail couldn't forward my note and gave up trying after a while. Is this just me? ~~~~~~ While I'm on the topic of e-mail and computers, You AOL users out there, any one use the Author Fan Club Bulletin Boards (there was a Misty one there along with Richard Back, Jane Auel, and a few others.) less than a week after Christmas I went there and w/o any warning AOL redid everything so I can't get into the Fan Club BB> I don't even know if they exist anymore. Those boards were seing some pretty regular use so they weren't just erased. Anyone know what happened there? ~~~~~~ I think I'll finish now and go make myself a nice cup of tea and relax with my . . . . . math homework on my lap AAARRGGGG!!!! sick 'hawk PS!!!!!!! Would someone please explain to me how you could become unsubscribed to the list without you knowing about it? All of a sudden I'm not getting my mail and I'm getting my messages returned to me. What's going on? --------------------------------------------------------- Get Your *Web-Based* Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com --------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 00:16:09 +0000 From: "H.D. Wegemer" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: What is Fantasy Fiction? Message-ID: <9701240513.AA17796-+AT+-flash> You read and, largely, enjoy the works of Mercedes Lackey; if pressed to put them into a genre, you would likely say that they are fantasy fiction. You know what you mean when you say fantasy fiction, and I as the listener think I understand what you are saying . . . but when I try to tell another what defines fantasy fiction, I find myself failing utterly. It is simple to give examples of fantastic fiction; Tolkien's Ring series, Alice in Wonderland, Peter Pan, and the Valdemar stories are all examples of fantasy fiction. How do we know? I asked a reference librarian where I could find what "fantasy" meant in literature. She sent me to the dictionary, where I learned that fantasy in fiction is, more or less, a work that employs the imagination. Can you show me a work of fiction that does not involve the imagination? Somehow, then, I find this definition less than satisfactory. At home, in my Webster's New World Dictionary, I found: fan-ta|sy n., pl. -sies [ME fantasie < OFr < L phantasia, idea, notion < Gr, appearance of a thing < phainein, to ornament] 1 imagination or fancy; esp, wild, visionary fancy 2 an unnatural or bizarre mental image; illusion; phantasm 3 an odd notion; whim; caprice 4 a) a work of fiction portraying highly IMAGINATIVE (sense 3) characters or settings that have no counterparts in the real world b) such works, collectively, as a literary form; specif., those works dealing with dragons, elves, ghosts, etc. 5 Music FANTASIA (sense 1a) 6 Psychol. a) a more-or-less connected series of mental images, as in a daydream, usually involving some unfulfilled desire b) the act of forming such images Which of course sends me off to cross-reference at IMAGINATIVE (sense 3) -- of or resulting from imagination and at FANTASIA 1a) any of a number of predominantly improvisational musical compositions, with a structure determined by the composerr's fancy b) a literary work similarly constructed 2 a medley of familiar tunes Rather tired of chasing through the dictionary after abstract concepts, I will trust you to either understand "imagination" or look it up on your own. Now, this set of definitions might be useful. We can say, for example, that The Hobbit is fantasy because it has elves, and The Great Gatsby is not, because there are no dragons. Nicely black and white, except . . . Well . . . is Jinx High a work of fantasy? There are no elves. What about Sacred Ground? To get more marginal, isn't The Princess Bride? Is Charlotte's Web a fantasy? We have pigs in reality, but not talking pigs . . . This group contains many bright people who should have a feel for what is and is not fantasy fiction. I'm asking for help right now, because I find myself in Augustine's unenviable position: "If no one asks me, I know; f I want to explain it to someone who does ask me, I do not know." Of course, after this genre-correct but author-vague post, I need an ObMisty: In The Fire Rose, the unicorn-summoning ritual requires a robe not made from any animal-type creature. Cotton is mentioned as a poor-person's option; Jason uses silk. Silk?!?? Unlike the forbidden wool, which generally only inconveniencs the sheep in question for a few minutes, the production of enough silk for Rose's robe involves the destruction of hundreds flittle, living caterpillars. Does anybody see a way to justify this? Heather (the other one -- not What She Said, not the singer, but just me, and totally insignificant :-) --- Although I dwell by choice in realms Ephemeral as phosphor glow It is a life -- it is _my_ life -- As real as aught you know. H. Wegemer ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 00:51:08 -0500 (EST) From: LCM46-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: speech Message-ID: <970124001102_135301443-+AT+-emout18.mail.aol.com> Greetings all---- Just popping in with my .02-----Lady Silvermoon, commenting on speech and pronunciation in the "Raahchester", NY area-----it's quite common in upstate NY, actually----the "Central NY Flat A"---when my sister was in California, people guessed where she was from, simply by the way she pronounced certain words-- Happy Birthday to those celebrating-----I gift you each a small, but useful bottle, it's quite pretty, actually, containing a never-ending supply of all-purpose stain remover---works on all stains/fabrics---------I know, it's nothing fancy, but it is useful. Still searching for SoI---- Jerry--LOVE the bodyguard--if I say I hate braiding, may I, too, acquire same??? Lorraine Goddess of Domesticity/Laundry But I'm not dead yet! MP/Holy Grail ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 10:33:00 GMT From: Melanie Dymond Harper To: mercedes-lackey Subject: ADMIN: Hotmail, again Message-ID: <199701241033.KAA15119-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk> Those of you who use Hotmail for subscriptions to this and other lists should probably check that you're still subscribed (I'm hoping that people will pass this on to Hotmail folks or that the people concerned will read it in the archives). Hotmail seems to have had a spate of bouncing mail yesterday, with the message "-+AT+-hotmail.com: user unknown". This is an "instant death" error for Listproc so if your mail bounced with that error, you will have been removed and you will need to resubscribe. Probably the easiest way to check whether you are subscribed is to send mail to listproc-+AT+-herald.co.uk with a blank subject line and message reading set mercedes-lackey -- which should come back with your current option list if you _are_ subscribed, or with an error if you're not. (Posting test messages to the list is not considered a good way of checking. Asking me is likely to be a slower way of checking.) _Why_ was Hotmail bouncing mail? Beats me. After the 'changing email address' debacle of a couple of weeks back, though, my money's on sheer incompetence. (Yes, okay, Vanyel has his little problems from time to time, but then I'm not pretending to run a mail service for half a million people, or whatever they're claiming these days.) Cheers Mel ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 07:46:56 -0600 From: nme848-+AT+-hecky.acns.nwu.edu (Nina Ehgartner) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Birthday Stuff/Bad People/Gala/Dialects Message-ID: <199701241345.AA087633509-+AT+-hecky.acns.nwu.edu> > "There is something wrong with saying that people do things because 'they >are bad.' It basically takes away any possibility of preventing such things >from happening." > If you ignore the underlying >causes of a behavior, how can you ever hope to change that behavior? "Because >he's bad" just doesn't cut it. I agree. You can't use circular reasoning to explain "bad" behavior (he's doing bad things because he is bad). It just doesn't work. >Jacquelle said, > "I'd like to think that Gala and 'Lendel made up once he joined her in >the Havens, if only for a moment." > > Thank you, Jacquelle! Yes, that's exactly why I was bothered by Gala's >absence in Sorrows. The only reason I can come up with for this is that it was Stef's and not 'Lendel's icnarnation that was with Van in Sorrows. Best wishes to all of those celebrating birthdays in January. I give each of you a bit of sunshine to brighten the gloomy winter days. Nina Ehgartner Admissions Assistant-Office of Admissions and Financial Aid J.L. Kellogg Graduate School of Management email: nme848-+AT+-hecky.acns.nwu.edu Phone: (847) 491-3308 Fax: (847) 491-4960 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 11:11:11 est From: vrondi-+AT+-juno.com (Chrys A Dean) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: birthing days/Chantel|Aerden Message-ID: <19970124.115520.9687.1.vrondi-+AT+-juno.com> umm, iffen I haven't posted it before, My bithday is June 21. _____________________________________________________ Welcome to Chantel/Aerden! Are you one person with two names or two people with one e-mail addy? Welcome anyway! _____________________________________________________ -Vrondi (Bard of Amber and Marigold) "Here he comes across the lake. He's comin' for his birthday cake. Sing 'Happy Birthday, Dragon Don,' And watch him blow the candles. . . on." -Shel Silverstein(Falling Up) http://edweb.concord.wvnet.edu/~deanca/book ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 11:16:11 est From: vrondi-+AT+-juno.com (Chrys A Dean) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Midori Snyder Question(off-Topic with apologies) Message-ID: <19970124.115520.9687.2.vrondi-+AT+-juno.com> Has _Anyone_ heard of or read anyhting by Midori Snyder? Please!!!! I have had a novel called "Sadar's Keep" by her for a few years. But there was no mention of it being part of any series on or in the book. Then, lo and behold in a used bookstore a while ago, there sits a book by Midori Snyder. I'd never seen anything else by her. It's called "New Moon" And appears to be the first in a series! It has some of the exact same characters as "Sadar's Keep" and I was astonished! So, is anyone else familiar with these? Does anyone know the other titles? Or anything else by this woman for that matter? If any of you happen across these, _Read Them_. They are good. (Sorry for the long off-topic) -Vrondi (Bard of Amber and Marigold) "Here he comes across the lake. He's comin' for his birthday cake. Sing 'Happy Birthday, Dragon Don,' And watch him blow the candles. . . on." -Shel Silverstein(Falling Up) http://edweb.concord.wvnet.edu/~deanca/book ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 11:31:03 +0000 From: Eugene McDougall To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Emotional Tolkien Message-ID: <01IELL3M72AA000LM2-+AT+-DANSAS.USASK.CA> Hi all, Okay, I've been off the list for a long time, but I just couldn't let this one slip by. I love Misty's stuff, especially the LHM series, but to say that Tolkien doesn't have "anything like that" (referring to suicide and death) I can't agree with. Yes, the LotR doesn't have a lot of tragedy in it but if one reads the Silmarillion or Unfinished Tales there is more than enough. As soon as I read the quotes below I thought, doesn't anyone remember Hurin, Turin, Morwen and Nienor. I mean talk about someone with a tragic life, yes, Turin is hot-tempered to say the least but nothing ever seems to go right for this guy (accidentally kills his best friend and ends up committing suicide). Well, a little more than two cents and hopefully people aren't too fed up with us Tolkien fans, Gene > >> If Tolkien doesn't write emotions well why do I cry whenever I > >> read about Theoden king dying? Or when Gimli sings of the old > >> days of Khazad-dum? > > > >How about the most emotional scene of all in LoTR, IMHO? The one > >where Gandalf sacrifices himself so that the others can flee from > >the Balrog. I was stunned for days over that. > These scenes were sad some what but I mean I knew that the whole > thing would turn out and that Gandalf would come back. Her books > seem to always have something sad in them. The first book of the > Vanyel trilogy you see a death, or suicide more accurately. The > other books you see stuff like that. The constant state in which > Vanyel feels that his family can't trust him around the children. > Tolkien never had anything like that in his books. email : gene-+AT+-irg.usask.ca office: (306) 966-6452 home : (306) 653-5568 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 15:29:03 EST From: rozanm-+AT+-juno.com (Cat Person) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Midori Snyder Question(off-Topic with apologies) Message-ID: <19970124.143018.4342.2.rozanm-+AT+-juno.com> Vrondi asked: >Has _Anyone_ heard of or read anyhting by Midori Snyder? >Please!!!! I have had a novel called "Sadar's Keep" by her for a few >years. But there was no mention of it being part of any series on or >in the book. oh you poor thing. It's part of a Trilogy! hang on and let me go dig them out. Book 1 _New Moon_ Midori Snyder, ISBN 0-441-57179-4 Book 2 _Sadar's Keep_ ISBN 0-812-50912-9 Book 3 _Beldan's Fire_ ISBN 0-812-50913-7 plus _Soulstring_ ISBN 0-441-77591-8 this one may be out of print the copyright date is 1987. _the Flight of Michael McBride_ ISBN 0-812-52271-0 copyright 1994 (which has redcaps in it, Mel Redcap ) > Does anyone know the other titles? Or anything else by this >woman for that matter? If any of you happen across these, >_Read Them_. They are good. she is right, they are v-e-r-y good. in fact, Charles de Lint said this "Any new book by Midori Snyder immediately tops my must read list." And HTH, Kushner recommends her, too. /-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/ Firemist rozanm-+AT+-juno.com Lore-Mistress of the Cat People Goddess of Made From Scratch Foods She Who is Hip-deep in Kleenex ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 15:41:18 -0600 (CST) From: myktshr-+AT+-ldd.net (miyako hirao) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Unsubbing temporarily Message-ID: <199701242141.PAA19582-+AT+-cdale3.midwest.net> Hey y'all! I have to unsub temporarily because I'm leaving for Japan this Sunday (Jan 26), and I will be gone for two weeks. Since I'm moving to Japan in 2 months, I have to take a pre-entrance admission exam for a high school there. Anyhow, I will be back in February, and I'll probably a semi-newbie by the time I get back! I'll "talk" to y'all when I get back, and wish me luck!!! Love & Logic, Summersong & Spiffy the Cat Love & Logic, Summersong the Goddess of Country Twang and Cowgirl Boots, and her ever-faithful sidekick Spiffy the Cat Knightress of the Order of Amber and Marigold ******************************** Akiko Hirao "Cowboys and angels, leather and lace, Salt of the earth, meets heavenly grace" -- "Cowboys & Angels" by Garth Brooks ******************************** ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 16:10:27 CST From: "JAIME HATHAWAY" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Birthday Stuff/Bad People/Gala/Dialects Message-ID: <2FBF55711-+AT+-future.judson.edu> > >Jacquelle said, > > "I'd like to think that Gala and 'Lendel made up once he joined her in > >the Havens, if only for a moment." > > > > Thank you, Jacquelle! Yes, that's exactly why I was bothered by Gala's > >absence in Sorrows. > > The only reason I can come up with for this is that it was Stef's and not > 'Lendel's icnarnation that was with Van in Sorrows. But wasn't there somewhere where Stef says that his hair can't decide whether to be blond or red? Wouldn't that imply that Lendel was somehow in Sorrows too? I guess that would make sense--Stef and Lendel are the same soul, so after life, how could they NOT be in the same place, as the same spirit? How could a spirit be divided into two seperate entities? I would guess, based on Misty's evd, that in her world, reinced spirits appear as their last incarnation. Which, if I would pay attention, I would see was exactly what the last person said. It's been a long week....happy TGIF, everyone! :) Jacquelle "You broke your little ships." Lily to Picard Star Trek: First Contact ------------------------------ Date: 24 Jan 1997 23:43:40 -0000 From: "Shy Kraytman" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Fire Rose and silk robes Message-ID: <19970124234340.8232.qmail-+AT+-hotmail.com> H. Wegemer wrote: "In The Fire Rose, the unicorn-summoning ritual requires a robe not made from any animal-type creature. Cotton is mentioned as a poor-person's option; Jason uses silk. Silk?!?? Unlike the forbidden wool, which generally only inconveniencs the sheep in question for a few minutes, the production of enough silk for Rose's robe involves the destruction of hundreds flittle, living caterpillars. Does anybody see a way to justify this?" I'm not an expert on silk weaving and so am probably not at all in any way qualified to talk about this, but I have always thought that the silk is collected as the caterpillars spin it. Not that the caterpillars are scrificed by the thousands to weave silk. Of course, I am operating under an assumption and could be very off the mark. 'hawk --------------------------------------------------------- Get Your *Web-Based* Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com --------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Jan 1997 08:36:45 +0800 (SGT) From: chenchen-+AT+-rgs.edu.sg To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-vanyel.herald.co.uk Subject: Tylendel Message-ID: <199701250036.IAA03827-+AT+-aragorn.sol.com.sg> Since there are so much talk about Gala, I was thinking about Tylendel. Although he was repudiated (?), would he still be given a chance to be reborn as a companion? The Heralds forgave him for his mistake and I believed Gala did too, so is it possible for him to become a Companion? &*&*&*&*&*&*&*&*&*&* Beverly--I have recieved the copy of OathBound, a million thanks for sending it to me! Stormwind ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Learning is a treasure which accompanies its owner everywhere. --Anonymous ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Visit my homepage at "http://members.tripod.com/~eladi/index.html" ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 19:53:59 est From: vrondi-+AT+-juno.com (Chrys A Dean) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Midori/Fire Rose Silk Message-ID: <19970124.195401.8175.1.vrondi-+AT+-juno.com> Many thanks to everyone who wrote to me about Midori Snyder!!!!! I greatly appreciate the info on her book. Thanks to all of you! ______________________________________________________ Shy Kraytman wrote: >I have always thought that the silk is collected as the >caterpillars spin it. Not that the caterpillars are >scrificed by the thousands to weave silk. No, the threads are collected from the catepillars' coccoons. This breaking open of the coccoon kills the caterpillar. -Vrondi (Bard of Amber and Marigold) "Here he comes across the lake. He's comin' for his birthday cake. Sing 'Happy Birthday, Dragon Don,' And watch him blow the candles. . . on." -Shel Silverstein(Falling Up) http://edweb.concord.wvnet.edu/~deanca/book ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 16:08:40 -0500 From: Chris & Sean Talbot To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Tylendel Message-ID: <199701242108.QAA11826-+AT+-relief.idirect.com> At 01:12 AM 1/25/97 GMT, you wrote: >Since there are so much talk about Gala, I was thinking about Tylendel. >Although he was repudiated (?), would he still be given a chance to be >reborn as a companion? The Heralds forgave him for his mistake and I >believed Gala did too, so is it possible for him to become a Companion? I believe what would have happened, since the companions rang the death bell for him was that the god or whatever brings them back would have given him the same choice as any other herald who had died. That is always what I believed and that is how Stefen got brought about. Aistes bonded to Kesta and Wiky ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 18:33:15 -0800 (PST) From: Lee <97jsalaz-+AT+-jasper.uor.edu> To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Norton/Zaleka/Harmful Things/Bad People/Tolkein/SoI Message-ID: Yep, ElvenBlood, etc, was supposed to be a tril.--last I heard (someone announced it on list), Andre Norton was quite sick and in the hospital. I imagine there'll be some delay on the project. (Let's hope it is just a delay and not...=( ) Speaking of Norton, didn't she write a historical fantasy about the Byzantine Empire in which the process of collecting silk was explained? I seem to remember that the silkworms were thrown in boiling water to make their silk spin out in a line all at once. (Sheeps to the squeamish.) ****Zaleka** Zaleka textevd: AFlight p28 "Talia knew every Companion in residence..." ****Harmful Things** Cenny said, "I suppose that, based on my own HS experience, it is plausible that a person like Faye might have the effect of creating a bunch of monsters, though. God knows my group got up to enough extreme things. We just never went in for harmful things (at least, they weren't harmful until AIDS showed up in OK)." Mm, if it was harmful after AIDS showed up, it was probably harmful before, just not for exactly the same reason. ****Bad People** Emimvisible said, "Does anyone feel like Misty's definition of a "bad person" may be flexible? In other words, good people are good, even if they do bad things, but bad people are bad, even if they do good things. It seems like no matter what the bad characters do, there is nothing good in them, even when we get a look inside their heads[snip]" How 'bout this: You're good if you can be persuaded to stop doing Bad Things; if you're not malleable & don't care, *then* you're bad. This seemed to be a little of what Misty was getting at in the dialogue between Tarma & wossname Cleric-who-ended-up-taking-custody-of-Thlkwhateverdemonguy. Emily sigged, "wishes she had brought her mother's collection of Darkover and Bujold to college with her..." Ooh, poor baby! I'd send you Virtual Copies of my (sister's hijacked) Bujold books, but that wouldn't help, would it? Lemme check my bag o' goodies...Wanna chocolate bunny? ****Tolkein** David teh Git (?) said, "If Tolkien doesn't write emotions well why do I cry whenever I read about Theoden king dying? Or when Gimli sings of the old days of Khazad-dum?" and a couple somebodies chimed in with other scenes... Aistes said, "These scenes were sad some what but I mean I knew that the whole thing would turn out and that Gandalf would come back. Plus to me it didn't seem near realistic enough." Well, various authors have different aims; I actually can't imagine Tolkien caring about realism. Tolkein wanted to write an epic; he did, and did it well, I think. He happened to choose the "epic" or "romantic" narrative style , and some people find it extremely affecting; others (like me) don't. Don't ask me to explain why Tolkein is epic & Misty is realist, for me it's like trying to define "fantasy"--but it has something to do with loftiness of narration and how close we get into a pov character's mind. Aistes: "Her books seem to always have something sad in them.[snip]. The constant state in which Vanyel feels that his family can't trust him around the children. Tolkien never had anything like that in his books." I just pictured Frodo's mom saying, "And stay away from Old Baggins! Hobbits like that, you never can tell..." ****y'all** Aimee said, "[snip BtR quote] Folks -- y'all is plural. One person is "you," two or more people are "y'all." It drives me crazy when authors use the word y'all to address just ONE person. It sounds so *wrong*. I have lived most of my life in Georgia, and I have NEVER heard anyone use y'all in the singular. Never." I live in CA and I've heard y'all used as singular. It may not be Georgian usage, but it happens. Think of how Spanish, French, and German all have a singular and plural "you," with the plural form doubling as a formal or distant singular "you" --German, intimate you: du, formal you (how you would address a teacher, perhaps): Sie-- and remember how Hamlet's mother addresses him alternately as "thou" and "you," depending on how she feels? I remember an occasion when I "y'all"ed someone I felt so strongly for that saying "you" made me feel naked...maybe I was just weird (well, I *was* weird), but aside from the personal example, I think a case can be made for a singular usage of "y'all." ****SoI** re Sword of Ice, Jennifer Dorn said, "According to some people, apparantly I'm not missing anything, but I would still like to read it and judge for myself." I'm one of the people carping, and I say Read It. Aside from the fact that people have differing tastes and consequently you can't take anybody's word for it, there's telepathic horses in the book ;) She also said, "While I'm at it, I'd also like to petition for membership in the Order of Amber and Marigold. I love Vanyel and promise to protect him from nasty hard objects." *All* nasty hard objects? You're sure Mr. Ashkevron wouldn't feel...deprived? the Eternally Nourished Lee -97jsalaz-+AT+-uor.edu-Knight of the OAM- www.geocities.com/Athens/4709/-Spreader of Humor-Self Appointed User of 5-point Vocabulary Words Such As "Panegyric"-"I collected my thoughts. Someday I hope to have them all." (Vlad Taltos) ------------------------------ End of MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 1073 **********************************