MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 1137 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Van 'n Fan / Gwenna / this 'n that by Jennifer Wrenn 2) Re: Van 'n Fan / Gwenna / this 'n that by hmw-+AT+-med.unc.edu 3) Re: Mage Storms Questions by shane b ambrose 4) Re: Van 'n Fan / Gwenna / this 'n that by Ken Hyde 5) "medieval America"/no one, true way by "John and Kara Pekar" 6) Re: Van 'n Fan / Gwenna / this 'n that by Elisiande-+AT+-aol.com 7) Re: Mage Storms Questions by MELVIN NEVERGOLD 8) Valdemar questions by Adams 9) Re: Valdemar questions by YKLance-+AT+-aol.com 10) SOI SPOILER!!!!!!!! by Jennifer Dorn 11) Re: Valdemar questions by "Brian Sizemore" 12) Re: SOI SPOILER!!!!!!!! by cjkocher-+AT+-spectra.net 13) Companion Speed... by cjkocher-+AT+-spectra.net 14) Re: Companion Speed... by Jdsimonds-+AT+-aol.com 15) touched nerves (fluffy)/ marriage /what horses can do by dbackhau-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl 16) Re: Server questions by hmw-+AT+-med.unc.edu 17) SOI by hmw-+AT+-med.unc.edu 18) [Fwd: Re: Valdemar questions (fwd)] (fwd) by MELVIN NEVERGOLD 19) Re: touched nerves (fluffy)/ marriage /what horses can do by Ken Hyde ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 11:47:45 -0500 From: Jennifer Wrenn To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Van 'n Fan / Gwenna / this 'n that Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.19970317164745.006763f4-+AT+-atlonline.com> >Nightsong wrote: > >> I get the feeling that Valdemar is a kind of medieval America. This comes >> mostly from the 'there is no one true way' idea, I guess. > >I didn't kmow there was one (EE avoids massed onslaught by the list's >majority of USofAans - I was kidding, I was kidding - I'm english goddammit, >we're allowed to get lofty about american history, just like the Italians >can with us Brits, and the Egyptians with the Italians, and, and, and - we've >all had our turn of making mud pies while others cooked haute cuisine!) >Honest though, do you mean native american life? I didn't think there was >much european activity in America in mediaeval times - the main immigration >started in the 17th Century didn't it? OK Columbus and Co. arrived in >14-something, but weren't they more southern in their acquisitions? I can >see some faint parallels between the Shinaninnies and native americans, >but Valdemar - nah - don't see it myself. > I KNOW there wasn't a medieval America. What I was trying to say was to take current so-called American ideals (I know, we're NOT perfect, though most of us seem to think that) about equality, no one religion, etc., and place them in a medieval england or whatever setting. I don't know where that impression came from, really, maybe I'm just an idealistic/naive teenager, but I just kinda felt that the valdemarans are like us Americans (and maybe others too, I don't know, never been outside of US). I think I mentioned before, too, how Karal described the Valdemarans as being like a bunch of mongrel pups, there being no single 'type' like the Karsites. If that's not America, I don't know what is. Again, could be other places too, but don't really know. Once immigration really opened up back in the late 1800s, the US got a whole bunch of different cultures to assimilate, leaving us with this huge conglomeration of people. Hmm, that kinda makes me wonder where all the different types of people (aside from the Holderkin, we know pretty much where they came from) came from. I couldn't tell a whole lot about the Empire from the Mage Storms books, but would they have been so diverse that when Baron Valdemar left, he had so many different kinds of people that led to 'current' Valdemaran make-up? Anyways, I don't know if I can really describe my Valdemaran/American link. If I'm blatantly wrong about something, please point it out, if you would. (And I'm quite sure that someone will, but just to ensure...) Zhai'helleva, NightSong jwrenn-+AT+-atlonline.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 13:05:07 -0800 (PST) From: hmw-+AT+-med.unc.edu To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Van 'n Fan / Gwenna / this 'n that Message-ID: <199703171805.NAA07291-+AT+-raven.med.unc.edu> [snip] > I KNOW there wasn't a medieval America. What I was trying to say was to > take current so-called American ideals (I know, we're NOT perfect, though > most of us seem to think that) about equality, no one religion, etc., and > place them in a medieval england or whatever setting. I don't know where > that impression came from, really, maybe I'm just an idealistic/naive > teenager, but I just kinda felt that the valdemarans are like us Americans > (and maybe others too, I don't know, never been outside of US). I think I > mentioned before, too, how Karal described the Valdemarans as being like a > bunch of mongrel pups, there being no single 'type' like the Karsites. If > that's not America, I don't know what is. Again, could be other places too, > but don't really know. Once immigration really opened up back in the late > 1800s, the US got a whole bunch of different cultures to assimilate, leaving > us with this huge conglomeration of people. Hmm, that kinda makes me wonder > where all the different types of people (aside from the Holderkin, we know > pretty much where they came from) came from. I couldn't tell a whole lot > about the Empire from the Mage Storms books, but would they have been so > diverse that when Baron Valdemar left, he had so many different kinds of > people that led to 'current' Valdemaran make-up? Anyways, I don't know if I > can really describe my Valdemaran/American link. If I'm blatantly wrong > about something, please point it out, if you would. (And I'm quite sure that > someone will, but just to ensure...) > > Zhai'helleva, > NightSong > jwrenn-+AT+-atlonline.com This has generally been my opinion too. There is the rather heterogeneous population of Valdemar who came fleeing "persecution" or whatever - much like immigrants to America. Maybe not so much medieval America - maybe America minus the industrial revolution. Then many of the surrounding peoples seem to be relatively homogeneous with some extremely homogeneous populations like the Shin'a'nin (minus Tarma's clan of course) and the Tayledras. Many of the social structures in those other countries/peoples are reminiscent of social structures (over various time periods) evident in non-American countries. And for the sake of argument I would put that as America=more or less the Western Hemisphere - all of which had been largely populated by immigrants (even most American Indians had originated in Asia - although for some of the populations this is still under debate). (I say this after several South American friends have expressed complaints about the USA obsconding with the term Americans for themselves.) Anyway, in many ways these books seem to be "thought experiments" to use a term of LeGuin's into social structures and the interactions of different cultures. Helen hmw-+AT+-med.unc.edu ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 12:17:22 -0600 From: shane b ambrose To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Mage Storms Questions Message-ID: <332D8AB2.2956E0E8-+AT+-wolverine.cameron.edu> Lonehawk2-+AT+-aol.com wrote: > > Nightsong asked how the mage storms would look on a global scale. > I think Paradox had a good description. Let me try ty simplify it to the bare > basics. > Drop a stone in the water - you get ripples that are pretty violent at the > focal point and smooth out to the edges until they get so insignificant that > they disappear. Now imagine that you caught this whole process on tape, stuck > that tape into the VCR, and hit the rewind button. The waves seem to start > out of nothing and get more and more violent until they converge at the > original point of impact. I think this is what the Mage storms were and how > they looked. The places where they disappeared last were the places they > appeared first in the second Storms. > What my question is, how did this whole thing happen again? They were > saying something about the storms coming back through time and stuff. Why did > the storms rebound to come back so many thousands of years after? I don't > think that this was explained in the book and was wondering if anybody had > any ideas. > > Sincerely, > Lonehawk Well I am delurking. To answer your question it is not like rewinding your tape. A wave no matter what the type starts at a point and when it is reflected comes back to the starting point. Try using a pot of water let it sit until calm then drop a stone in the center the wave starts out like you said but when it hits the side it comes back on itself and works back to the starting point. this is how it works in the books but this sucjest that the universe that is being used is circler and limited. The time it took for the first wave to start and when the first wave came back can tell someone how far the edge is from you. someing else that was not considered was when the wave hits a planet that is not at the edge it will send a wave back starting then. So unless their are no planets in her universe their would have been waves coming back off and on. Something on the grove born. I believe that the grove born are the spirts of the heralds that wanted to come back. the originals are the ones from the gods. I also believe that their is only one god just multible faces, since most of the lands have similar items happening like the fire cats, the star eyes all are helpers. One last thing and I will leave. I am in Lawton, OK at Cameron UN and was wondering if there is any one around that area that likes missy. If so please e-mial me at sbambros-+AT+-wolverine.cameron.edu thank you. (sorry for the spelling). -- Shane Ambrose tele: 405-581-1867 4627 sw H Ave email: sbambros-+AT+-wolverine.cameron.edu Lawton, OK 73505 Have a nice day! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 14:03:03 -0500 (EST) From: Ken Hyde To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Van 'n Fan / Gwenna / this 'n that Message-ID: On Mon, 17 Mar 1997 dbackhau-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl wrote: > Nightsong wrote: > > > I get the feeling that Valdemar is a kind of medieval America. This comes > > mostly from the 'there is no one true way' idea, I guess. > > I didn't kmow there was one You're quite right, of course. There wasn't. European settlement of the New World (discounting any hypothetical vikings) did not start until the Rennaissance. Nor can you really use the term Medieval to describe the Native American cultures that *were* here during the Medieval European period. After all, "medieval" is not just a time period but a period in the development of a particular constellation of cultures (European). > I'm english goddammit, we're allowed to get lofty about american > history, No sweetie. It is still rude, regardless of whether you still resent the fact that the Americans refused to submit to the tyrannical buggery of the English crown =P */me sticks out his tongue and yells "How do you like them apples!" at Esme while handing out a individual pecan pies to all the other British people on the list and assuring them that he isn't really going to hold the behavior of James II(?) against them. > can with us Brits, and the Egyptians with the Italians, and, and, and - we've > all had our turn of making mud pies while others cooked haute cuisine!) Ohhhh! Must-try-to-resist--Mustn't-stoop-- Aaaagh! I can't do it! With sheeps to all the people on here who *like* kidney pie and toad in the hole and porridge et cetera, I have to ask this. Esme, when will British culture get their turn? *giggle* I mean, sure kippers aren't mud pies, but how are they an improvement? Especially at breakfast, with the heads on! *dramatic shudder* BTW, Esme, just so you won't feel that I don't love you (even if you do pick on us poor, innocent, defenseless Americans *whimper and bambi eyes*), here is virtual banquet of American goodies: Aperitif: mint juleps Appetizer: Baltimore crab cakes with horseradish mayonnaise Main Course: Vine Smoked Duck with Wild Grape couli Side Dish: Pilaf of Wild Rice and Caramelized Squash Custards with Corn Pickle relish Desert: Cherry Cobbler with Extra-sharp New York Cheddar Hmmmm. And speaking of food, anyone who is interested in contributing to the Misty List cookbook can do so. I am still maintaining it on my website, so if you wanna get an idea of what is already out there, go to the URL at the bottom of my sig and follow the links. May the seas be your solace and the forests a refuge for your spirit, Cennydd, Kenneth Allen Hyde | No matter how subtle the wizard, a knife Univ. of Delaware | between the shoulder blades will seriously Dept. of Linguistics | cramp his style -- Old Jhereg proverb kenny-+AT+-Udel.Edu | A mind is a terrible toy to waste! -- Me **http://www.udel.edu/kenny/ken.html or .../kenny/green.silences.html** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 14:44:06 -0500 From: "John and Kara Pekar" To: "MISTY" Subject: "medieval America"/no one, true way Message-ID: <199703171948.OAA05677-+AT+-nessie.crosslink.net> >Nightsong wrote: >> I get the feeling that Valdemar is a kind of medieval America. This comes >> mostly from the 'there is no one true way' idea, I guess. and Esmeralda Evensbane responded, >I didn't kmow there was one I think Nightsong was trying to convey the idea of a medieval culture with a USA-style doctrine of acceptance of others' differences. (Actually, we don't succeed in that doctrine as well as we'd like, in part because some people's differences include an intolerance of *other* people's differences.) But this brings up an interesting point. Living a policy of "there is no one, true way" is more difficult in practice than in theory, and that is true in Valdemar as well. Although they try to practice that policy, the Valdemaran government appears willing to pass laws which seem to go against a particular group's beliefs, practices, or lifestyle in order to guarantee the rights of individuals and/or to ensure the stability of the kingdom. Example: In AFlight, Talia is explaining Holderkin customs to Kris, who is horrified. She tells him that when Selenay and the Heraldic Circle found out that a) Holderkin don't tell their children about Companion's Choice, and b) that children who are unhappy in that lifestyle have no way out because they have nowhere to go, the Council passed a law requiring that Heralds have free access to the children in any settlement they enter, "in order that they can be certain that the children of this Kingdom are properly educated in our laws, history, and traditions." This allows the Circle to send Thought-sensers into the Holdings, where they can identify any children who are unhappy with their lifestyle. "Anyone willing to sacrifice family ties and standing as I did is free to leave with them, and they make sure the unhappy ones know this." [both quotes from AFlight, ch. 3, p. 287 of SFBC omnibus ed.] In other words, to guarantee the freedom and education of children, the Council and the Heralds are in fact willing to violate the beliefs and practices of the Holderkin, who see their children (particularly female children) as property. Talia is surprised that the Holderkin don't make much fuss about it (they appear willing to be rid of potential troublemakers); *I'm* surprised that *other* groups in the kingdom didn't make a fuss. After all, we're talking about making it possible for underage children to leave their parents -- and the parents have no legal recourse? (I know that Talia was 13 when she left, and therefore "of age" to be married in Holderkin terms; but Talia does not, in telling Kris of this law, mention any age limit. Furthermore, she says "children", which implies younger than marriageable age. And it would be easier to remove them before they were married, rather than afterward.) Even in the USA, traditionally a defender of individual freedoms, there would be public outcry at a law allowing children to leave their parents without a protracted legal battle. (And I'd be part of it; without Heralds to determine the validity and duration of a child's unhappiness, it would be too easy for a child to choose to leave over trivial things, or simply because, as a child, s/he resents the normal and proper restrictions a parent must set. You know, things like "you have to brush your teeth; you may not run into the street; don't run away from Mommy in the supermarket; you may not stay out past midnight.") I realize that the Valdemaran law requiring that Heralds have free access to all children was put in place to address a specific problem, and that since Heralds are involved, there aren't going to be abuses. Nonetheless, it certainly shows that the doctrine of "there is no one, true way" is only taken so far. And no, I don't advocate leaving children in the intolerable situation that Talia found herself in. I don't advocate it here in the real world, either. But there were no safeguards on the parents' rights to keep their children, and as a mother, that bothers me. The Valdemaran law could have been better written to provide for a Herald-mediated hearing, rather than just allowing Heralds to take the children with them when they leave -- which is the impression I got from Talia's explanation of the law. So -- what do you think? Where does adherence to the doctrine of "no one, true way" have to give way to protection of either individual freedoms or the good of the society as a whole? (I certainly don't see Valdemar supporting the right of a religious group to perform ritual sacrifice of unwilling victims, for example; that would be contrary to the good of the society as a whole.) How well does Valdemar rate in living up to its doctrinal standard? Wind to thy wings, listsibs! Kara Disciple of Textevd "So many books, so little time" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 14:57:56 -0500 (EST) From: Elisiande-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Van 'n Fan / Gwenna / this 'n that Message-ID: <970317145700_953557651-+AT+-emout19.mail.aol.com> Valdemar /America parallel...Hi, EE... I don't think that any one was suggesting that Valdemar is like america literally wa during the mediaeval period, just that the ideals are similar to those America at its best represents, set in a setting that suggests the middle ages.... *** I think that your comments on Van and Yfandes are right on target, tho. The bond between them was certainly what kept Van going all those lonely years. **** Gwenna.... Grove-born or not, she was a young thing, right? and an individual with some tough restraints pu ton her about what she could tell her Herald... must have been hard for her to live up to both sets of responsibilities... *** just me Elisiande ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 15:25:08 -0500 (EST) From: MELVIN NEVERGOLD To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Mage Storms Questions Message-ID: The storms were waves of spells of unbinding. On Mon, 17 Mar 1997, Jennifer Wrenn wrote: > I don't know if this is spoiler material or not, but if you haven't read any > of the Mage Storms trilogy, I'd recommend that you not continue reading this. > > Okay, my question is, exactly what form were the Storms? I know that the > group working on stopping them compared them to ripples of water, or waves > or something. But how did they work? I can understand the Storms from the > Cataclysm, because those began at a central point (or two, rather). But the > Storms-reversed had to have started somewhere, right? I guess I'm just > trying to picture what the Storms would have looked like, say, on a globe of > Velgarth. According to, hmm, several folks in the books, the waves were > traveling east to west, I think. If that's so, how are the waves converging > on the Dhorisha Plains and Lake Evendim? Or was the east/west thing just in > relation to the Empire? My problem here is that if the waves are circular > in form (like the ripples formed by a pebble, as is the analogue in the > books), and Velgarth is a globe, not a flat plane, wouldn't the waves have > to start at a single point and spread outward around the globe to the Plain > and the lake? Like, umm, a hoop almost, that goes around? I hope this is > making some sense to someone, it's very difficult to describe what I'm > thinking here. Chances are that evidence for my questions' answers won't > come from the books, but I'm interested to hear what you listsibs have to > say. My overall question, in case you got lost somewhere back in my attempt > at description, is, what do the Storms look like from a distant (entire > world-emcompassing) perspective? Anyways, hope y'all aren't TOO bored by > all this! > That question was kinda spawned by my rereading of Storm Breaking, and I > realized again just why I love Misty's books so much. I truly enjoyed the > Storms books, and, to be honest, *I* personally rank them up with LHM and > AotQ. Maybe it's because I have fallen in love with Karal (lucky Natoli!), > who is definitely my most favoritest character in that trilogy and possibly > in all of Misty's books. You've probly all been through the favorite > character and why thing before, but I'm still pretty new here, so I haven't > heard much about it. Anyways, Karal had a LOT of depth to him, for all that > he wasn't the focal point of all the action in all the books. I guess I > just appreciate that he was a young man with faults who knew that he had > them and was willing to try to overcome them to help others. That kind of > person just doesn't show up that much here on mundane old earth that often. > Well, at least, not in my experience. I envy his friendship with Florian > and his wide range of experiences, and it truly amazes me that he stayed as > 'good' as he did, even through all the evil and corruption. > Okay, methinks I've babbled enough. I seem to do that way too often. > Anyways, wind to thy wings, listsibs! > > NightSong > jwrenn-+AT+-atlonline.com > > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 17:04:55 -0600 From: Adams To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Valdemar questions Message-ID: <1.5.4.16.19970317170629.4327265e-+AT+-deskmedia.com> Hello!!!!!! I come out of lurking to ask a couple of questions. How big is Valdemar? And how far are they from the Eastern Empire? They can't be to far for the Empire to invade Hardorn at the end of Winds of Fury, yet it says "Valdemar had run for years with his people before settling here,.." (Wind of Fury, page 285 in my copy). So how far is it? Please somebody tell me. And How fast can a Companion run? I know nothing of horses, so when it says that Companions run a lot faster than horse, I have no idea how fast that is, since I don't know how fast horse run. Mary Adams tigger-+AT+-deskmedia.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 18:48:54 -0500 (EST) From: YKLance-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Valdemar questions Message-ID: <970317184500_1848515676-+AT+-emout14.mail.aol.com> I don't want to bother everyone, but i tried unsubscribing, and it didn't work, i am still getting the messages. thx YKLance-+AT+-aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 21:23:46 -0600 From: Jennifer Dorn To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: SOI SPOILER!!!!!!!! Message-ID: <199703180227.UAA11886-+AT+-audumla.students.wisc.edu> yea! I just got a copy of _Sword of Ice_.... For some obnoxious reason or other, I had to order it. Go figure. It's been a good week for the orders coming in and a bad week for the pocketbook. (the people down at the gaming store finally found me a copy of _Tales from the Floating Vagabond_, so now I have to go pick that up too.) S W O R D O F I C E S P O I L E R Excuse me if I'm going over previously traversed ground here, but I have a few comments... First off, it really isn't as bad as everyone's making it out to be. The worst things about this book are probably Kellan's sex change and that inane line of Vanyel's ("I'm shay'a'chern. Sometimes I don't have any control over it" p.206 puhleeze. Van would never say something that dumb!) I think what's mostly at fault here is the editing. (hello, Misty? What was that?). If I had one complaint, it was that the stories seemed rather simplistic. I had the impression that a number of people had been handed a formula and been told to run with it. Why is it that _Lammas Night_ had more originality? This being said, I really liked the story "In the forest of sorrows". Van was acting a little more Van-like in that one. I thought "Demon's Den" was at least different from everything else in the anthology. I liked "A Herald's Honor" as well, but it brings up an interesting point. Can marriages be anulled in Valdemar? Do they have divorce? I know Martin wasn't married, but how often do you think marriages get broken because one member of the couple bedcomes lifebonded to another person? Is their some kind of "escape clause" in case a lifebonding does occur? I'd like to know what everyone thinks of this...... SPOILER OVER*SPOILER OVER*SPOILER OVER*SPOILER OVER******* Zhai'helleva, Lady Guenevere Knight-errant of the OAM Witch and Keeper of Gargoyles Mistress of fire-lizards and Dragons "A Freudian slip is when you say one thing and mean your mother"~ anonymous jldorn-+AT+-students.wisc.edu ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 21:20:50 -0500 From: "Brian Sizemore" To: Subject: Re: Valdemar questions Message-ID: <199703180235.VAA08348-+AT+-ais.ais-gwd.com> ---------- Adams asked: > How big is Valdemar? > And how far are they from the Eastern Empire? > They can't be to far for the Empire to invade Hardorn at the end of > Winds of Fury, yet it says "Valdemar had run for years with his people > before settling here,.." (Wind of Fury, page 285 in my copy). > So how far is it? Please somebody tell me. I'm not sure, in terms of miles, but Valdemar was founded roughly 1,400 years ago and it talks about (I'm not sure exactly where) the Empire expanding continuously to the north, south, and east and just recently to the west. So, in Valdemar's time, it probably did take years to get from the Empire as it was to where valdemar is now. > And How fast can a Companion run? > I know nothing of horses, so when it says that Companions run a lot > faster than horse, I have no idea how fast that is, since I don't know how > fast horse run. Hmm, race horses can do 1 1/4 miles in just about a minute and what ... ten seconds? Companions can also use something like fetching to help move them along a little quicker as well, so I would say that companions could probably go the equivalent to 100+ mph when using top speed and fetching. Does anyone have any specifics on this matter? I'm playing mostly on memory and it has been a little too long since I read the books or passages I'm thinking about. Hope this helps a little. Paradox ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Why do they call it the tourist season if we're not allowed to shoot them? # No matter what else you do in life, love another. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 00:39:09 -0500 From: cjkocher-+AT+-spectra.net To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: SOI SPOILER!!!!!!!! Message-ID: <332E2A7D.4166-+AT+-spectra.net> SoI Spoiler Space: Ok ... in regards to the marriage/divorce/annulment comment ... perhaps in Valdemar most cases are what Teren's was like. In AotQ (don't ask for text right now as my book has disappeared ... perhaps someone else can provide exact coordinates?) they were discussing Teren's Choosing. To loosely paraphrase ... he realized he wasn't all that happy with his life, and she was perfectly happy to go back to her family?clan? .... now, a lifebond could be considered along similiar bounds as being Chosen, so I don't think there would be really huge problem. In this case, the two lifebonded were Heralds, so I'm sure any offspring from his previous relationship as well as his former wife would be well taken care of .... on the whole lifebonding subject (don't groan... this isn't like my last question on the subject ) I wonder if lifebonding exists amongst the general population or just among Heralds? I know the book said it was rare among Heralds, and rarer still in the general population, but there's been no evidence that non-Heralds bond like that. Any thoughts? Crystal -- ---------Christopher J. Kocher-------Crystal D. Sarakas-------- ----------------------cjkocher-+AT+-spectra.net--------------------- "Would anybody like to write a song with me now? A line at a time?" - Ray Davies, during a CompuServe chat "It is appallingly clear that our technology has surpassed our humanity." - Albert Einstein -------Ask about ordering information for "Ninth Aspect"------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 00:46:44 -0500 From: cjkocher-+AT+-spectra.net To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Companion Speed... Message-ID: <332E2C44.7302-+AT+-spectra.net> Companions can also use something like fetching to help move them > along a little quicker as well, so I would say that companions could > probably go the equivalent to 100+ mph when using top speed and fetching. Hmmm... I have to disagree with this one. The big reason is that the Companions wouldn't be that blatant about their powers ... a horse moving 100mph would attract a helluva lot of notice in a medieval society ... I'm going to take a wild guess and say your average, quality horse would only go 20-25 mph tops ... (I never clocked while riding) and even then can't sustain that speed for more than a hour or two without suffering serious health problems or death ... a Companion would travel faster, but the big difference is that they can sustain that speed over much longer periods of time, which could make them appear to be much faster. Make sense? As for the Fetching ... Yfandes is the only Companion to ever use that, and the circumstances were bad enough to warrant a little extra something ... I'm not sure that the Fetching/running is a common trait amongst Companions... Crys -- ---------Christopher J. Kocher-------Crystal D. Sarakas-------- ----------------------cjkocher-+AT+-spectra.net--------------------- "Would anybody like to write a song with me now? A line at a time?" - Ray Davies, during a CompuServe chat "It is appallingly clear that our technology has surpassed our humanity." - Albert Einstein -------Ask about ordering information for "Ninth Aspect"------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 00:58:32 -0500 (EST) From: Jdsimonds-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Companion Speed... Message-ID: <970318005830_478079223-+AT+-emout10.mail.aol.com> I concur completely with cyrs ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 97 15:37:00 +0100 From: dbackhau-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: touched nerves (fluffy)/ marriage /what horses can do Message-ID: <9703181437.AA06170-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl> hola, well I should have known better than to cast aspertions at American history, tcha kiddies - I did say I was kidding. :> :> :> :> :> (<- 5!) Cennydd attempted to haul himself onto his high horse (didn't quite make it, all that giggling spoilt the effect ;> ) > >Ohhhh! Must-try-to-resist--Mustn't-stoop-- Aaaagh! I can't do it! With >sheeps to all the people on here who *like* kidney pie and toad in the >hole and porridge et cetera, I have to ask this. Esme, when will British >culture get their turn? *giggle* I mean, sure kippers aren't mud pies, >but how are they an improvement? Especially at breakfast, with the heads >on! *dramatic shudder* Our turn at what? Lording it loftily? Been there, done that - used to have these things called colonies - small backward place, south of Canada used to be one - no use to us so we let 'em think they'd won some sort of independence thingy. It seemed to make them happy. This is a joke Or being lorded over? We've been sliding into history as another of those "they came, they saw, they conquered, they got smug and lazy, they lost it all" places that history books are fairly full of, for ages now. It's just that there's some haven't realised it yet. (I'm relying on my fellow Brits to read this in the spirit in which it was written, :) Oh, and anyone who prescribes "Caramelized Squash Custards" as a side dish with "Vine Smoked Duck with Wild Grape couli" (a) deserves indigestion, and (b) has no business getting snitty about kippers for breakfast. Incidentally, you ever had a proper kipper? Betcha haven't, else you'd realise how totally yummy they are. (As is my Mum's Toad-in-the-Hole for that matter; and her steak-and-kidney pie is something to die for. I was raised on Toad. Our standard Saturday lunch was Toad, taties, greens 'n gravy. I grew to 5'11" on it, so it must've had some good in it!) =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Lady Guenevere asked: > Is their some kind of "escape clause" in case a lifebonding does occur? Well, if your average starry eyed Valdemaran is anything like your average starry eyed westerner, they'll think that this is the one, and not be prepared to face that fact that there may be another out there who your beloved could love more than they love you. So no, there won't be a clause, there'll be the usual grief, pain, betrayal, loss, guilt etc etc that goes with any other relationship that declared itself to be "forever" and lasts a little less. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Crys wrote: > As for the Fetching ... Yfandes is the only Companion to ever use that, and > the circumstances were bad enough to warrant a little extra something I accept that Yfandes is the only one we hear of doing this, but doesn't she also do it at the beginning of Magic 2 or 3, when Van is crawling back to Haven, totally knackered, on an equally knackered 'Fandes? Doesn't he suddenly find they're at the gate or soemthing, (books in London, me in Holland)? Then the circumstances were simply that they were both cold, tired to the bone and wanting to be home. Oh, and on the subject of horses, ages back (Jan 96), AliFarr (long gone I think) sent in a mail about what horses can and can't do, and, as an aspiring writer about fantasy lands where folk use horses, I kept it. So: > Ok, I can answer these (and would various and sundry fantasy writers check > them out, because I am tired of those beasts of burden that often seem > capable of extraordinary feats...:) ) > > Walk: On level ground should cover about 4 -5 miles per hour > Trot: Covers 7-10 miles per hour > Canter: 8-12 miles per hour > Flat out gallop: racehorses can make close to 40 miles an hour - for a mile. > Realistically we are talking about a 15-20 mph pace, which is generally not > sustainable for more than about 30 minutes at a time. Endurance horses > complete 100 mile rides over all types of terrain in less than 24 hours, to > give an example of the ability of the top echelon . > > I am guessing that the traditional coach and four could make about 15 mph on > good roads that were reasonably flat, and horses that were changed every few > hours. > > "Backing" a horse is the process of training a horse to be ridden, as opposed > to training a horse to "drive" or pull a carriage. While it is necessary to > stregthen a horse's back muscles to carry a rider for long periods of time > (and is part of the training process) a ten year old companion in good shape > should be quite capable of carrying a rider through the battle and beyond - > although he might have a few sore muscles to show for it the next day. So now you know. Another of my all-reaction-no-action mails, still, I managed to rattle a few cages yesterday, EE manages a Mutley like snigger, (that dates me! Who had the dog Mutley, with a wheezy snigger? He flew an aeroplane, I think, (the character, not the dog) - Dastardly something??? Any helpers??) ciao ciao, Esmeralda ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 10:22:05 -0800 (PST) From: hmw-+AT+-med.unc.edu To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Server questions Message-ID: <199703181522.KAA25404-+AT+-raven.med.unc.edu> > From: YKLance-+AT+-aol.com > Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 00:17:26 GMT > Subject: Re: Valdemar questions > To: hmw-+AT+-med.unc.edu > Reply-To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk > > I don't want to bother everyone, but i tried unsubscribing, and it didn't > work, i am still getting the messages. > > thx > YKLance-+AT+-aol.com > I've had some problems too when I've tried sending commands to switch to digest. Helen hmw-+AT+-med.unc.edu ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 10:24:03 -0800 (PST) From: hmw-+AT+-med.unc.edu To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: SOI Message-ID: <199703181524.KAA25634-+AT+-raven.med.unc.edu> Is Sword of Ice available in paperback in the US yet? Helen hmw-+AT+-med.unc.edu > > yea! I just got a copy of _Sword of Ice_.... For some obnoxious reason or > other, I had to order it. Go figure. It's been a good week for the orders > coming in and a bad week for the pocketbook. (the people down at the gaming > store finally found me a copy of _Tales from the Floating Vagabond_, so now > I have to go pick that up too.) [snipped spoilers] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 10:23:03 -0500 (EST) From: MELVIN NEVERGOLD To: misty group Subject: [Fwd: Re: Valdemar questions (fwd)] (fwd) Message-ID: This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text, while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools. Send mail to mime-+AT+-docserver.cac.washington.edu for more info. ---559023410-758783491-858698583=:8129 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII ---559023410-758783491-858698583=:8129 Content-Type: MESSAGE/RFC822 Content-ID: Message-ID: <332EAA28.3BA6-+AT+-geocities.com> Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 09:43:52 -0500 From: Melvin Nevergold X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Valdemar questions (fwd) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MELVIN NEVERGOLD wrote: > > Postage paid by: [Image] > > --------------------------------------------------------------- > I'd say about half the size of texas or approx size of neveda. > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 23:46:25 GMT > From: Adams > Subject: Valdemar questions > How big is Valdemar? > And how far are they from the Eastern Empire? > They can't be to far for the Empire to invade Hardorn at the end of > Winds of Fury, yet it says "Valdemar had run for years with his people > before settling here,.." (Wind of Fury, page 285 in my copy). > So how far is it? Please somebody tell me. > > Mary Adams > tigger-+AT+-deskmedia.com ---559023410-758783491-858698583=:8129-- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 11:49:48 -0500 (EST) From: Ken Hyde To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: touched nerves (fluffy)/ marriage /what horses can do Message-ID: On Tue, 18 Mar 1997 dbackhau-+AT+-isou10.estec.esa.nl wrote: > well I should have known better than to cast aspertions at American > history, tcha kiddies - I did say I was kidding. :> :> :> :> :> (<- 5!) Of course you did, sweetie darling. =) And I believed you (this can be deduced from the remarkable lack of incendiary devices and things being delivered in plain packaging to your addy--I am nothing if not vindictive when it comes to the honor of my home *grin*). > Our turn at what? /me picks up the sad, dust-clad little form of his joke from where it fell on flat on the floor and cuddles it, brushing away the dust and soothing it with little mrrrping noises (what? you didn't know that jokes are remarkably like kittens?). "I wonder if I should try this again?" No, no need to belabor a point that was probably in poor *taste* anyway. =) > Or being lorded over? We've been sliding into history as another of > those "they came, they saw, they conquered, they got smug and lazy, > they lost it all" places that history books are fairly full of, for > ages now. You know, my father's one foray into history writing was an essay entitled "How Spain became a Puff of Dust on the Road to History" and was an analysis of the results of the reign of Ferdinand and Isabella. Admittedly, Spain didn't so much get smug and lazy, but they did make some startlingly bad policy decisions, from which they are only now recovering. > Oh, and anyone who prescribes "Caramelized Squash Custards" as a side dish > with "Vine Smoked Duck with Wild Grape couli" (a) deserves indigestion, and > (b) has no business getting snitty about kippers for breakfast. Cherie, have you ever *had* my cooking? No-one gets indigestion from my meals. Trust me, the squash (roasted winter squash that is pureed, bound with just a hint of eggs and cream and then baked in a bain-marie 'til set) is the perfect, lightly sweet foil to the rich woodsy taste of the duck (scalded and dried to prevent it from being fatty, then smoked over a grapevine fire, sliced and served with a scant saucing of a reduced preparation of tart wild grapes). Perfect balance of rich vs. light, dark vs. bright flavors. So there, Phhhhpt! =) BTW, no, I have never had kipper (it doesn't grow in the US--something about the climate, maybe?) And from a personal viewpoint, I am witholding final judgement until I can get my hands on a kipper and try it myself. Them and figgins! =) Oh, and haggis! (Okay, I know it isn't English, but I still want to make it and try it). Hmmmm, now I need and ObMisty. Oh, I finally read SGryphin and I kinda liked it, although the characters were terribly one-dimensional in places. But one of the things that I found rather interesting was the fact that Misty, who is so active on behalf of endangered birds, didn't seem to have any qualms about writing a story in which a unique, intelligent species is extinquished. And ironically, the wyrsa in the story didn't even seem terribly "evil" (which might presumably have justified wiping them out completely). They reacted to the presence of large strange carnivores in their territory in what seemed to me to be a very natural way. They only really starting getting nasty after they had been injured. And in the end, they all were killed and the "heroes" were happy. Sort of an odd ending from a writer who is big into conservation efforts. May the seas be your solace and the forests a refuge for your spirit, Cennydd, Kenneth Allen Hyde | No matter how subtle the wizard, a knife Univ. of Delaware | between the shoulder blades will seriously Dept. of Linguistics | cramp his style -- Old Jhereg proverb kenny-+AT+-Udel.Edu | A mind is a terrible toy to waste! -- Me **http://www.udel.edu/kenny/ken.html or .../kenny/green.silences.html** ------------------------------ End of MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 1137 **********************************