MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 1602

Topics covered in this issue include:

  1) Whats in a name?
	by "Old Nicodmeus" <oldnic-+AT+-city-net.com>
  2) HELLO
	by "Kal'enedral Kalen [OIB]" <95662014-+AT+-mmu.ac.uk>
  3) HELLO
	by AERDEN-+AT+-delphi.com
  4) Jeopardy
	by Christine S <christines-+AT+-mindspring.com>
  5) Van /"Lendel  Van/Stef
	by Christine S <christines-+AT+-mindspring.com>
  6) Re: Van /"Lendel  Van/Stef
	by The Fishers <mr.bob-+AT+-erols.com>
  7) Re: Van /"Lendel  Van/Stef
	by "Elizabeth Tetlow" <etetlow-+AT+-99main.com>
  8) Delurk
	by Cymrey-+AT+-aol.com
  9) Re: Delurk
	by Seasong <seasong-+AT+-nervm.nerdc.ufl.edu>
 10) The rape of Vanyel
	by Kris Frye <kfrye-+AT+-reed.edu>
 11) Fwd: RLCC: DON'T FALL FOR THIS!!!
	by DragonFriend-+AT+-webtv.net

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 02:55:25 -0400
From: "Old Nicodmeus" <oldnic-+AT+-city-net.com>
To: "Mlackeylist" <mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk>
Subject: Whats in a name?
Message-ID: <199805280649.CAA04792-+AT+-dns.city-net.com>

Alright sibs. Ive noticed a lot of you have hmmm...Misty-ish names and
Im familiar with the persona creations for Arrows members. So are
personas only for those members or may I introduce myself offically? <g>

************************************************************************

"With words of mercy in his hand/
he walks the battle fields a wounded man..."

        --"Crime and Passion" Capercaille





------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 09:20:00 +0100
From: "Kal'enedral Kalen [OIB]" <95662014-+AT+-mmu.ac.uk>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: HELLO
Message-ID: <34857197537-+AT+-ghondr.mmu.ac.uk>

Is anybody there? Was the list very quiet yesterday? I only had 5 
messages from it when I got in this morning. I usually have at least 
15-20

Just thought I'd ask.


*****************************************
"To be or not to be
that is the question"
Now the question I have is
"TO BE WHAT?????<look5
Jason Stokes [Fantasy Freak and All round Good Guy
95662014-+AT+-mmu.ac.uk
uthro-+AT+-hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 06:44:52 -0400 (EDT)
From: AERDEN-+AT+-delphi.com
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: HELLO
Message-ID: <01IXK34JCWC08ZR3UG-+AT+-delphi.com>

On 28-MAY-1998 04:41:18.2 mercedes-lackey said to AERDEN
 me>Is anybody there? Was the list very quiet yesterday? I only had 5
 me>messages from it when I got in this morning. I usually have at least
 me>15-20
 me>Just thought I'd ask.


I think on this list, you can just choose what they call a use-name.  I
usually go by either Aerden (a healer who snuck in here from Pern), or as
Joyful Singer (a Tayledras-style use-nme).  Sometimes I even go by Chantal,
my real name.  (g)

 me>*****************************************
 me>"To be or not to be;
 me>that is the question."  --Hamlet

"NOT to be!"
::Thwap!  They play.::
"To a nunnery, my a--!"  --Ophelia

::Hamlet expires.::

     --from _Ophelia's Revenge_


     Chantal

"I'm a doctor, not a counter-insurgent!"  --The HoloDoctor


------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 08:31:48 -0400 (EDT)
From: Christine S <christines-+AT+-mindspring.com>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Jeopardy
Message-ID: <199805281231.IAA10452-+AT+-camel8.mindspring.com>

Yay! I finally got one!
 >Oskar

Who was the innkeeper where Keth and Tarma stayed the first time in 
Oathbreakers.

- Old Nick... I think alot of us just pick use name we like or fit our 
personalities. I've had mine for a long time. (i used it in D&D gaming )

Btw all... If my address keeps changing I'm not trying to confuse anyone. My 
husband, Uther, is setting up my own computer, e-mail and isp account. : )
So please bear with us.

   Goddess Bless

Stormdancer, Guardian Adept (I mastered the Adept spell finally)
 & Virr, Ki-Rin mage

SIOCHAIN AR TALAMH


------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 09:07:42 -0400 (EDT)
From: Christine S <christines-+AT+-mindspring.com>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Van /"Lendel  Van/Stef
Message-ID: <199805281307.JAA21347-+AT+-dewdrop2.mindspring.com>

Echoes through time! That's it. In thw Winds trio, we're seeing the storms 
echo thru' time.Why not ,as Rainbow said, the situations of Van/'Lendel to 
Van/'Stef. After all, Stef seems to be 'Lendel reincarnated. Only this Time, 
the actions of Van change the outcome. (stopping any further echoes 
???hmmm.) Similarly the actions of the group, and their sacrifices, prevent 
anymore echoes in Storm Breaking.
Any, a great trauma caused 'Lendel's "breakdown", leading to Van's suicide 
attempt. Similarly, Van would experience a great trauma, to trigger Stef. 
With all that Van has seen and experienced, it would have to be something 
physically and mentally breaking...hence the rape.
         Does this make sense to anyone else?

Goddess Bless,
       Stormdancer, Guardian Mage
       & Virr, Ki-Rin mage
          Siochain Ar Talamh


------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:25:09 -0400
From: The Fishers <mr.bob-+AT+-erols.com>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: Van /"Lendel  Van/Stef
Message-ID: <356D81D5.1BF45F0B-+AT+-erols.com>



Christine S wrote:

> Echoes through time! That's it. In thw Winds trio, we're seeing the storms
> echo thru' time.Why not ,as Rainbow said, the situations of Van/'Lendel to
> Van/'Stef. After all, Stef seems to be 'Lendel reincarnated. Only this Time,
> the actions of Van change the outcome. (stopping any further echoes
> ???hmmm.) Similarly the actions of the group, and their sacrifices, prevent
> anymore echoes in Storm Breaking.
> Any, a great trauma caused 'Lendel's "breakdown", leading to Van's suicide
> attempt. Similarly, Van would experience a great trauma, to trigger Stef.
> With all that Van has seen and experienced, it would have to be something
> physically and mentally breaking...hence the rape.
>          Does this make sense to anyone else?
>
> Goddess Bless,
>        Stormdancer, Guardian Mage
>        & Virr, Ki-Rin mage
>           Siochain Ar Talamh

  Heyla everyone! I just joined (finally)... and I guess this is as good a place
to jump in as any.  I very much agree, Christine: "echoes of time", as you so
eloquently put it, does seem to be a subtle story-line that Misty likes. I think
it does well to remember that trite ol'  saying: Those who forget the past are
doomed to repeat it.

Laurel shena Dester'tale
the windborn hawk, chosen of the most beautiful, wonderful, perfect and wise
beyond human comprehension Companion Khamsin,(she makes me say that),  rider of
the infamous warhorse Bob, and sometimes known as Bard Rscana Jalitter of
Dicheer to her friends from the Honors 'zine. (who wonders if any of her
pen-pals from long-ago are still out there and whether or not any of them
remember her?)  >^..^<


------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 May 98 13:54:36 PDT
From: "Elizabeth Tetlow" <etetlow-+AT+-99main.com>
To: "Misty" <mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Van /"Lendel  Van/Stef
Message-ID: <MAPI.Id.0016.007465746c6f77203030303730303037-+AT+-MAPI.to.RFC822>


message received from Stormdancer
----------
> With all that Van has seen and experienced, it would have to be something
> physically and mentally breaking...hence the rape.
>          Does this make sense to anyone else?

Yes, I believe that the rape was needed to cause...
 and I quote (Magic's Price pg315-paperback)

"Van felt strangely calm-whatever came, he hoped he was ready. He had tried to deal with all his fears alone, and what he had left was resignation and purpose. He hoped it would be enough to carry him through what was to come."

In my experience, resignation and purpose as strong as this comes after having to rebuild yourself. Hence the need for the rape...

Magical Dreams to all...
Nightstar, the Dreamers Guardian
etetlow-+AT+-99main.com


------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 15:18:47 EDT
From: Cymrey-+AT+-aol.com
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Delurk
Message-ID: <bd67e8ec.356db898-+AT+-aol.com>

Heyla all!

I have had to abandon writing emails for a while because of finals at school.
But as of 1:25pm today, its over for another summer!!!!! Only two years left!
oh, wait, thats alot.... oh well.
Anyways, I'm back, whether or not you care or even remember me. <eg>
ObMisty:
I just finished reading Elvenbane, by Misty and Andre Norton.... Is there
anything else along the lines of that book? I really, really enjoyed it. Oh,
yeah, someone mentioned,(it was some time ago, i haven't really thought about
it much), that there was a story out there about Albreich and how he got
Chosen and such. Does anyone else remember that? If so, could ya please send
me the info on the book/anthology? Apreciate it, thanks!

Cymrey
a.k.a. Woodlark
Member of OUH (Hylarr!!!!)
Subject of Devardec in Terris
Clearer of Paths of the Ranger's guild
with her trusty owl Balder
and her familiar white finch Raven

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 16:50:21 -0400
From: Seasong <seasong-+AT+-nervm.nerdc.ufl.edu>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: Delurk
Message-ID: <356DCE0D.C614F4BD-+AT+-nervm.nerdc.ufl.edu>

Cymrey-+AT+-aol.com wrote:

> Heyla all!
>
> I have had to abandon writing emails for a while because
> of finals at school.
> But as of 1:25pm today, its over for another summer!!!!!
> Only two years left!
> oh, wait, thats alot.... oh well.
> Anyways, I'm back, whether or not you care or even
> remember me. <eg>
> ObMisty:
> I just finished reading Elvenbane, by Misty and Andre
> Norton.... Is there
> anything else along the lines of that book? I really,
> really enjoyed it. Oh,
> yeah, someone mentioned,(it was some time ago, i haven't
> really thought about
> it much), that there was a story out there about Albreich
> and how he got
> Chosen and such. Does anyone else remember that? If so,
> could ya please send
> me the info on the book/anthology? Apreciate it, thanks!
>
> Cymrey
> a.k.a. Woodlark
> Member of OUH (Hylarr!!!!)
> Subject of Devardec in Terris
> Clearer of Paths of the Ranger's guild
> with her trusty owl Balder
> and her familiar white finch Raven

Heyla!
Cymrey, there is a second book by Misty and Andre Norton
called Elvenblood that is a sequel to Elvenbane (I kind of
liked Elvenbane the best), and the Alberich story can be
found in HorseFantastic anthology (it's pretty good *gryn*).

Zai'helleva
Seasong, SnowFeather, and Sheba


------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 16:14:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kris Frye <kfrye-+AT+-reed.edu>
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk
Subject: The rape of Vanyel
Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.3.96.980528145854.671A-100000-+AT+-amon.reed.edu>

On Thu, 28 May 1998, Elizabeth Tetlow wrote:

> Christine S. wrote:
> > With all that Van has seen and experienced, it would have to be something
> > physically and mentally breaking...hence the rape.
> 
> Yes, I believe that the rape was needed to cause... and I quote (Magic's
> Price pg315-paperback)
> 
> "Van felt strangely calm-whatever came, he hoped he was ready. He had
> tried to deal with all his fears alone, and what he had left was
> resignation and purpose. He hoped it would be enough to carry him
> through what was to come." 
> 
> In my experience, resignation and purpose as strong as this comes after
> having to rebuild yourself. Hence the need for the rape... 

The phrase "the need for rape" rings off all kinds of extreme warning
bells in my head.  I hope that you are not trying to imply that strength
and purpose comes only after rape.  In most cases, something quite the
contrary happens.  Rape is not something you heal from in a month, or a
year, or a few years, or sometimes ever.. it is an extremely painful long
process that doesn't usually result in a new improved better than ever
person.  Saying that Vanyel wouldn't have been able to save Valdemar had
he not yet first been raped is a pretty vile statement, and I don't think
anyone means this, but it's almost being implied.

Rape is far too often used in movies and other "entertainment" to shock
the viewer.  (Of course, this is usually raping of women.. according to
Hollywood, men never get raped unless they're in prison and being treated
like women)  It seems lately whenever we see a woman being beat up or
otherwise abused, the powers that be throw in a rape or two for good
measure.  The rape is rarely addressed except as just another violent
scene, and the movie goes on.

With respect to Vanyel's situation, I am of a mixed mind about it.  It's
been a few years since I've read the series, so I don't remember the exact
order of events.  However, the rape scene was a particularly vivid one
that few people would forget easily.  For Vanyel to rebound from this is
remarkable.  But rebounding is quite different from being "rebuilt."  He
had to do what he had to do, but this doesn't necessarily mean that he was
healed from it.  I would have to re-read the book, but it seems that Misty
was trying to make Vanyel hit absolute bottom (again) before going off and
saving the day.  I think that she certainly succeeded.  But Vanyel wasn't
really quite sane at the end either.

Could Misty have make the same impact without the rape scene?  Well, I
think you could certainly argue that the rape added shock value that
wouldn't have been there otherwise.  Could Vanyel have still managed to
save the day had he not been raped?  I hope the answer to that is fairly
obvious.  Rape is never necessary, but it's always shocking.

__________________________________________________________________________
|    Kris Frye     |   "These are not the droids we are looking for."    |
| kfrye-+AT+-reed.edu   |           http://www.reed.edu/~kfrye                |
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 




------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 23:43:40 -0500
From: DragonFriend-+AT+-webtv.net
To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk, owner-lastunicorn-+AT+-colossus.net
Subject: Fwd: RLCC: DON'T FALL FOR THIS!!!
Message-ID: <199805290443.VAA24480-+AT+-mailtod-102.iap.bryant.webtv.net>


--WebTV-Mail-852876548-1802
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

A friend sent this to me. It is a warning. Something to look out for.
Better safe than sorry.

Vanisa

--WebTV-Mail-852876548-1802
Content-Type: MESSAGE/RFC822
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

Message-Id: <199805290426.AAA28670-+AT+-hme0.mailrouter01.sprint.ca>
From: "James Lu" <jameslu-+AT+-sprint.ca>
To: <rlcc-+AT+-css.tuu.utas.edu.au>
Subject: RLCC: DON'T FALL FOR THIS!!!
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 21:24:59 -0700
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Priority: 3
X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-rlcc-+AT+-css.tuu.utas.edu.au
Precedence: bulk
Reply-To: "James Lu" <jameslu-+AT+-sprint.ca>

RLCC!  DON'T FALL FOR THIS!!!  READ IMMEDIANTLY!!!  (sorry for the spelling
error)

Cecilia

P.S.  Be careful!  You'll think I'm crazy, but read the thing below:

Attention:    
> 
> If you receive an email titled "WIN A HOLIDAY" DO NOT open
> > > it.
> > > >         It will erase everything on your hard drive. Forward
> this
> > > letter
> > > >         out to as many people as you can. This is a new, very
> > > malicious
> > > >         virus and not many people know about it. This
> information
> > > was
> > > >         announced yesterday morning from Microsoft; please share
> > it
> > > with
> > > >         everyone that might access the internet.
> > > >         Once again, pass this along to everyone in your address
> > book
so
that this may be stopped.

--WebTV-Mail-852876548-1802--

------------------------------

End of MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 1602
**********************************