MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 1686 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Withen's Library by Amy Trujillo 2) Re: Gunpowder by edrucker-+AT+-ruraltel.net (Ed Rucker) 3) Cataclysm... by Rainbow 4) Re: Braid of many things by Hobbs Tina 5) Re: Gunpowder by Hobbs Tina 6) forbidden books = foolish parents by "Kris Walsh" 7) Re: hair color by Peter Allen 8) Re: Braid of many things by Peter Allen 9) Re: mothers, music, literature & a question by Kris Frye 10) Re: Braid of many things by Greg Wooledge 11) Fwd: New Virus Found NOT A JOKE by Saberdrake-+AT+-aol.com 12) Hello All! by Saberdrake-+AT+-aol.com 13) Re: magic/turning in/hair color by "Rhiannon Shadowsong" 14) Re: reincarnation by "Rhiannon Shadowsong" 15) Re: Fwd: New Virus Found NOT A JOKE by edrucker-+AT+-ruraltel.net (Ed Rucker) 16) Re: magic/turning in/hair color by "Rhiannon Shadowsong" 17) Re: Elements in Misty's books/Braid of Many things/ by "Rhiannon Shadowsong" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 14:18:47 -0500 From: Amy Trujillo To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Withen's Library Message-ID: <35D48D93.785-+AT+-southwind.net> Withen could not read...but Savil, Lissa and Treesa certainly could. Lissa spoiled Van AND made sure that he had an education. Van was well taught for his area of the world, especially in comparison to his parents. If nothing else he would have read the history of Valedmar and you cannot tell me that Van was the first person in the country's history that was openly shaych. Van's family was wealthy, it would probably be a matter of status to at least have some books. And Withen DID have a library!!! If you will remember the time that Van was hiding in his music room/attic, he eavesdropped on his parents' discussion about sending him to Haven from the door in his room that lead to the LIBRARY. A library means books in one form or another. As far as Withen being able to read, he always had some one to write for him and if he was determined enough he could find someone to remove books for him. Father Leren would certainly have cooperated with Withen if no one else would. Amy Ferret Friend Lady of All Things Missing, Especially Socks ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 15:01:56 -0500 From: edrucker-+AT+-ruraltel.net (Ed Rucker) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Gunpowder Message-ID: <35D497B4.A7FCA909-+AT+-ruraltel.net> Rhiannon wrote: Misty-ake: Something that has always bothered me from Arrows: When Kris gives Talia the friendship ring, he tells her that it goes on the right hand, that the left hand is for another ring. But, at the lifebond ceremony with Dirk there is a line about some people tearing up because Talia moved the ring to make room for the wedding band. (Sorry no textevd). Anyone else catch it? WTTW Minstrel Clarienne ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 21:34:20 +0100 From: Rainbow To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Cataclysm... Message-ID: I was thinking... When Ma'ar and Urtho 'messed up' with the weapons as it were, is it poosible that the gods/goddesses couldn't see the future as in storms? Because I was wondering what'd happen if they HAD stepped in and stopped the cataclysm... I mean no Empire + no Tayledras = No Valdemar = No Vanyel = no Elspeth = no stopping Ma'ar... any thoughts? 'If you want the Rainbow, _.-~-._ 'I ain't flawed, I'm just a you gotta put up with _.~ _ ~~~ _ ~._ diamond cut in a unique way.' the rain.' ,~ _ ~ -~- ~ _ ~, / /~ /~ RAINBOW ~\ ~\ \ ~Dolly Parton | | | |/-~-\| | | | ~ Tristan 'I don't take offence... I take revenge!' ~ M'lady (Wishbone) ZHAI'HELLEVA! ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 16:30:08 -0500 (EST) From: Hobbs Tina To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Braid of many things Message-ID: I happened to come out of the shadows long enough to catch the tread about reading, and forced studies in HS. The remark was that The growth of book stores indicate a growth in the reader population. Actually the reading population is *SHRINKING*, but the remaining are buying more books, which gives the impression of growth. tina :-) Merry meet, merry part, merry meet, again. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 16:33:30 -0500 (EST) From: Hobbs Tina To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Gunpowder Message-ID: I think what people were "tearing up" for was because she moved Kris's ring to the finger "next to her ring finger" and because she was so thin from her ordeal. Just what I remember :-) > > > Rhiannon wrote: > > But, the gods/goddesses let Urtho and Ma'ar develop all of their weapons which did as much if not more damage than an atomic bomb. They may guide us to try and stop horrific things, but they don't step in and stop they game like the mother of some unruly toddlers who aren't playing nice. > > Misty-ake: Something that has always bothered me from Arrows: When Kris > gives Talia the friendship ring, he tells her that it goes on the right hand, that the left hand is for another ring. But, at the lifebond ceremony with Dirk there is a line about some people tearing up because Talia moved the ring to make room for the wedding band. (Sorry no textevd). Anyone else catch it? > > WTTW > Minstrel Clarienne > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 15:51:18 PDT From: "Kris Walsh" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: forbidden books = foolish parents Message-ID: <19980814225122.15966.qmail-+AT+-hotmail.com> 'lo! Someone asked what forbidden books were-and I figured I'd give my definition for the fun of complaining. My parents forbid fantasy/sci-fi books they considered "adult". Sharon Green books and the like mostly. Once day in our weekly devotion at the book store I picked up Magic's Pawn and asked mom if she thought it'd be good-cover looked nice and the story sounded good. I'd never heard of Mercedes Lackey but I trusted my mom's advice. She said "I read it, it umm ... wasn't that good." The "umm" gave her away. If my mother truly didn't like a book she'd complain about what was wrong loudly when reading it-it sounded more like she just didn't want me to read it! I spent my weeks allowance and bought it when she went to the bathroom facilities. Of course I fell in love with the characters and setting. Eventually I bought the other two and a week later found the trilogy hidden in my parents room (I found it when looking for something they told me to get-I wasn't snooping Christmas was a ways off). Man I was ticked-at that time I got $5 a week and I'd blown almost an entire month when it was right upstairs!! Grr...this doesn't seem to have much to do with "forbidden" does it. I did have a point about that but I got side tracked. My point was simply that as soon as anyone-especially a preteen/teenager is told not to read something "for your own good" its irresistable! (Ya know I should probably try and find my parents trilogy-my set is worn to pieces...) Okay I rambled-sorry-I'm still psyched about finding people who like to get anal retentive about books too. (Not meant as an insult). I don't want to be mean to people up here but they think Mercedes Lackey is some new fancy car! (The library up here is pitifull, I've donated some books but frankly there's no way they are getting any good stuff like Misty from me). I wonder if there is any way too encourage the library to spend a little on sci-fi/fantasy? Dunno... okay I've filled up enough space so I'll go play Diablo now. Later, Kris ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 19:10:55 -0400 From: Peter Allen To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: hair color Message-ID: <35D4C3FF.F0ADAD1E-+AT+-frontiernet.net> Gryphonestorm wrote: > Wintershard said that Van died his hair black but i don't remember when > that happened i don't remember Elspeth dying her hair either could you > tell me which books they died their hair in. people keep saying Elspeth > and Vanyel didn't live near a heartstone but they did Valdemar has a > heartstone remember. Ahem *blush*... As many people have pointed out, neither of them dyed their hair *g*.. Okay I was wrong... But, but it ~looked~ died in the text... really.. *g* Bright be thy day, Wintershard Councillor of Mist ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 19:07:13 -0400 From: Peter Allen To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Braid of many things Message-ID: <35D4C321.BFF66941-+AT+-frontiernet.net> > I understand that this is how some people feel, and it is this attitude > that I think needs to be changed. so many people these days think that it is > an incredible imposition to be TOLD to do anything, yet in life we are > constantly being told to do things, by parents, by superiors at work, by > spouses/partners; we are all independent people, yes, but we are also > members of a society. That society sometimes places demands upon us that may > seem difficult at the outset, but it is imcumbent upon to to carry out those > demands. Why is it incumbent for us to do so, so that we may carry on with the society as it is? I agree that there are things that people do not like to do (as in going to war) that are necessary to extend the life of the society. For a moment, let me just talk about America. If people did as they were told to do, because it was for the good of society, you find both the good and the bad coming out. Yes, America's involvement helped in the major world wars of our time. If it weren't for those who went 'for the good of society', then we'd still be on the defensive (imo). However, as Cennydd pointed out, we would also not have had the American Revolution, nor the Civil War, both of which were caused by people who desired for change, and both of which made us whom we are today. This leads me to the next point about society. It is not society which feels that it should change, and demands people to do something about it. It is the people in that society that change it. There are differences in how to change a society, of course, from the drastics of war to the subtelties of technology. ~Many~ people of today do not share the beliefs of their forefathers. That is just how society changes. > If we can't learn to do it, without complaint, with a graciousness > of spirit, in high school, then how can we be expected to do things far more > difficult and demanding later on in life? Actually, throughout my entire academic career (read k-14), I bitched and moaned constantly about the work that I had to do *shrug*. I was difficult, I admit it completely. Hell, a lot of people would say that I still am as difficult as I was before. Now, my reasons for being difficult were different, though. For some people, being difficult is saying, "TS, I'm not doing it," while for others, it is difficult in that they ask "Why?" I happened to be a big supporter of the latter (well okay, when I get ~really~ stubborn I'll do the former some *g*). If I were to do what I did in my whole lifetime without complaining, what would I be? A total product of my environment. And when my 'learning years' were over, what would happen? Simple, someone would tell me what I was supposed to do for the rest of my life, and I would do that without complaint. It's total human nature to complain, because it's a form of asking the question Why. You just have to see it as such. In my opinion, the best students are the ones that will complain about what they are going through, because two things happen. One, it offers for a great deal of conversation (which is why I loved my Ethics course in college... talk about debates...), and two, the student, if it rubs them enough, they will want to change the way that it is done. Wanting to change the way that something is done first requires that you understand it, which requires more learning than the normal pass-by would. Not only that, but our society is what it is today (for all the good and bad) because someone wanted to change something. > Will you also tell your boss that > his demands on you "grate you the wrong way?" If we all did or read only the > things that were comfortable for us, we would be a poor group of people, > indeed. To tell you the truth, I do complain about what goes on in my workday. I work with computers all day long, and I just got done with a huge project that required us to transform about 4000 double-sided pages of hard-copy into text on the screen... in two languages. Mind you, I've been complaining. But what has happened because of it? We at work found out a better way to do the scanning, and also were able to let of some steam, which ~really~ helps when you are staring at a language that you don't know, and trying to type it in the right way, the same word, the same lines, for 8 hours a day, for over a month, because the software won't recognize it... The way we do it now helps bunches in that, and the next time that we have to scan something in, it will be easier because of our complaining and fixing the complaints. > Well, I'm sorry you don't like the cannon of accepted literature, but > it's there for a reason. I, on the other hand, know many people who have > "endured" the force-feeding of these works and still love reading to this > day. In fact, a large percentage of the reading population have gone through > such trials and tribulations and emerged unscathed. Whereas I myself have not gone through it at all. The closest that I have been to Mark Twain's Huck Finn is that I was in a musical during college. I've never read any of Shakespeare (while I have watched bits of Hamlet in drama class, both versions), nor have I done most other 'Great American Literature' books. *shrug* I didn'a wanna. I ~have~ however, read, and am still reading, The Illiad, reason being because I love the topic, and was able to choose it myself. It really had nothing to do with the fact that it is a major literary piece of western civilization. Now, on the same note, I have read bits of The Art of War, a chinese book by I can't remember, and love that as well, and you hardly ever hear of it in our society. Not to mention, of course, the amount of fantasy that I have read ;). Now, do those facts make me an uneducated American who cannot participate in learned discussion of literature? I think not. > Frankly, according to studies on how the mind develops, the love of > reading is engendered early in childhood, and should be so strong that the > reading of a few unfavored books will not destroy it. The negative attitudes > towards reading don't come from classes - the "cannon" approach has been > used for a very long time, after all. The real problem comes from children > who are exposed far too much to television and video games and far too > little to books. Nay, now here I have to disagree with you. There is television and then there is television, which I am sure that you can agree to. Not only that, but there is also the parent factor, and how parents talk to their children (if they do) in regards to television and video games. As for television, I was an avid watcher of Mr. Rogers and Sesame Street while growing up... I also really liked Transformers and GI Joe *grin*. It wasn't the media that made me who I am (well, maybe slightly, also making me point to the screen, look at my parents, and go, "Why?"), it was my parents and my own personhood. As for video games, if there weren't video games around when I was little, I wouldn't have the job that I do today. Like I said above, I work with computers all day long, and am fairly good at it. I attribute this to A: my teacher in 6 grade, who saw that I liked computers and let me use them, but even more to B: my Nintendo. > Again, check the resentment at the door. I've spent my > entire life in academia - if we abandon the idea that we know best, we just > might learn something. And what happens when we take someone's word for it at all times that they know what is best for us? > You are completely correct. It IS ok not to like a "classic" book. But how > can you decide whether or not you like a book until you've read it? Which is easier to read, a book that piques your curiosity, or a book that is shoved into your hands and forced upon you? > Second, > there are lots of books that WERE written with a point, and "english > teachers" aren't overreacting to demand that we analyze what we read. No, you're right, they aren't overreacting. How we think about our literature, and indeed any form of media in our lives, greatly affects how we are in the society. However, there are also a lot of books that were written for no point other than satirical reasons (these should be read in history class, as someone pointed out, since they apply to a specific time), or entertainment reasons (such as, oh, this should be a good read, where's a pen?). > If you > want to know the truth, then that single point is what separates literature > from ordinary fiction. Literature has subtext. It has hidden meanings, > metaphors, archetypes. It reaches beyond the story and delves into deeper > places. And fantasy/romance/mystery/etc. books do not do this? > We need to think, for goodness sake. If we just read to be > entertained, then we are indulging in pure decadence. Not so. I read Misty's books for pure enjoyment, but I learned that gay men were just normal people like you and I from it, and it has changed my life completely, and I would say also, for the better. All books are this way, as Cen pointed out. If books to be learned from weren't entertaining, they wouldn't be called litererature, they'd be called text books. > It's not just the literature versus fantasy issue. The real issue here > is whether or not we accept the ability to grow as people. Civilizations > have been stressing education since the beginning of written history, and > that process of education has always demanded that students reach beyond the > normal and the comfortable. We can't learn if we refuse to reach. We may not > like what we grab, and we don't have to. It's only important that we reach, > and in the reaching, discover new paths. Its up to us to accept or reject > these paths. As I have said before, there are times when it is necessary for people to reach when they are not comfortable with it in order to better society, but which is better, to give a book to someone in response to a question that they asked, or to give a book to someone who you know wouldn't read the topic in the first place? Our society has changed. We no longer are all the quiet families on the farm who are trying to establish what our identity is. America's identity is change, and diversification. Isn't it more interesting in a debate to have someone on your team, or the other team, that is coming from a totally different viewpoint than you or your colleagues have? That is what America has and always will be about, and it has become stronger and better because of those opposing viewpoints. If everyone is forced to read the same literature, where is the diversification? Bright be thy day, Wintershard Councillor of Mist ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 17:31:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Kris Frye To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: mothers, music, literature & a question Message-ID: On Thu, 13 Aug 1998, Lady Sunhawk wrote: > It was [the teacher's] > favorite book, so when I tried to support my opinion, she would shoot it > down, just be like "you're wrong". So, it may be that it is forced on > you, but the kind of teacher can make a difference too. I absolutely agree with you here. Teachers/professors shape the class and often your interpretation of the works discussed. If he/she doesn't have an open enough mind to respect a student's opinion, I think he/she is really in the wrong profession. In your case, I hope she was just having a bad day. > As for the > forbidden books--Yes!!! and can anyone please tell me why "A Wrinkle in > Time" has been banned? just curious. I hadn't heard that anyone had banned _A Wrinkle in Time_, but I do know that Madeleine L'Engle had a devil of a time getting it published because publishers thought that children couldn't/shouldn't comprehend or read about the ideas of good and evil. Children are often not given enough credit. ---- Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 11:28:32 +0100 (BST) From: Raven X > Kalistia mentioned something about literature. Well, I think that other > kinds of genre are also nice. Even the classics like Shakespeare and > stuff like those. But one thing I really really DONT like: stories > about space travel, spaceships, and stuff like those. Now those make me > shudder. I used to avoid "hard" scifi like the plague. But I was gradually introduced to some really thoughtful interesting literature that made me reevaluate my opinion. I still avoid stuff like Heinlein (unless I'm in a mood to get really mad about chauvinist men), but now I find myself actually prefering more "techie" writing. I'm sure a lot of that has to do with how my education has shaped me. But try to keep an open mind: you might be pleasantly surprised. ----- Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 14:12:33 +0100 (BST) From: Kristjan Wager > So what I meant, wasn't that everyone > who didn't read other stuff were/are fools, but rather that it was/is > hopeless trying to convince people that they should read other stuff, > than what they know they like, if they don't want to try it. Actually, I think this conversation might have started out as John trying to convince someone to enjoy reading Huck Finn, but it has turned into an interesting conversation on the pros/cons of assigned reading. Questioning established systems is always a good thing, even if it's an argument that has been hashed out before. Arguments get boring if people are just reiterating what has already been said, but I don't think this is the case here. Of course, I don't think I was around for the original argument, but I find this discussion very interesting. > Lots of people have participated in this discussion, and one thing > people always seem to agree on, is that if a book is bad, you shouldn't > really have to read it or like it. I have to question your definition of good and bad here. How do you define a "bad" book? You seem to think that _Animal Farm_ is boring and poorly written. What if I disagree? When can anyone say a book is absolutely good or bad? If instead you are trying to say that the prevalent opinion here is that people shouldn't have to read what they don't find enjoyable, I'd have to disagree with you. It seems like that exact point is the one that is being the most argued about. ----- Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 20:27:18 +0100 (BST) From: Kenneth Allen Hyde > Ah, but here's the thing. I get paid to put up with my boss. I got > nothing in return for putting up with the demands of my HS teachers > besides indemnity from punishment. Which is hardly a fact that is > likely to inspire much beyond resentment. In fact, my education was > pretty much independant of my classes. If something was presented in > class that was interesting, I learned it. If it was not interesting, I > memorized it for the test and then promptly forgot it. Well, call me an idealist, but I think there is merit in reading things that you might not have read otherwise. When I did my homework, I didn't do it because I was trying to escape punishment. I did it because I wanted to learn; I wanted to stretch my mind. This was especially the case in college. There is certainly a lot more choice involved as an undergraduate than as a HS student, but I still encountered material which didn't exactly send me bouncing through the clouds with excitement. But I still buckled down and read the material and feel myself enriched for doing so. My college doesn't emphasize grades and doesn't give them out to students unless they are requested or the student is doing poorly (I still don't know what my GPA in college was), so I certainly didn't read the material just to escape the punishment of bad grades. > What problems are we talking about here? The decline in the reading > public? I don't know the actual figures, but given the growth of > superstores like Borders, Barnes and Noble, B. Dalton's, I really can't > believe that the reading public is diminishing much. In fact, I seem to > recall a number of reports in the news and popular media citing a growth > in book sales and in the size of the publishing market. Mind you, there > are probably contradictory reports out there, too, so I'm not sure what > can be made out of it, but the fact remains that stores like Border's > continue to do a land-office business. It seems to be a common myth that the American public is being less and less educated when in actuality, the opposite is the case. More and more people are not only graduating high school, but going to college. My grandmother didn't go any further than the 8th grade in school. Her education level was pretty typical of women of her age. College was reserved for the wealthy who could afford to indulge. Today that is certainly not the case. Education is emphasized today more than at any other time in our history. I'd like to see some statistics that argue otherwise. > To say that Shakespeare is a great writer, while dismissing contemporary > popular authors (Misty springs to mind) as "ordinary fiction," is to > ignore the simple facts of the matter. Shakespeare is no better nor > worse than Misty, with no more nor less meaning to his texts. I'd have to quibble with you here. I agree with you in that you can't really say whether Ursula LeGuin (I don't really like Shakespeare) or Misty is better or worse. However, I find Ursula's work much more thought provoking than Misty's. This doesn't mean that I don't like Misty, but that I appreciate her for what she is: a very entertaining author. _The Left Hand of Darkness_ by Ursula, on the other hand, completely blew me away, and left me really thinking about it for a long long time. But I am probably never going to read it as many times as I've read the Arrows trilogy or LHM. So comparisons are odious, but different books are meant to touch different parts of your brain. --Laire __________________________________________________________________________ | Kris Frye | "Subvert the Dominant Paradigm!" | | kfrye-+AT+-reed.edu | http://www.reed.edu/~kfrye | ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 21:29:54 -0400 From: Greg Wooledge To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Braid of many things Message-ID: <19980814212954.E902-+AT+-phoenix.local> Kristjan Wager (kristjanwager-+AT+-hotmail.com) wrote: > Oh by the way, what is a forbidden book? It is an alien concept for me. Certain forces (religious and political organizations) try to suppress ideas. One of the ways they do so it by banning/censoring books. Even in the United States in the 20th century there have been times and places where certain books were banned: schools were not allowed to use them, and I think they may even have been pulled from library/bookstore shelves. You'd be surprised at how common this has been. Huck Finn has been on the banned lists! Darwin's works were banned in the "Bible belt" because they wanted to suppress the theory of evolution and force everyone to think that the Judeo-Christian myth is the literal truth. And you can bet that in certain religious institutions, the LHM books would be banned, if the leaders knew that the main character is homosexual. -- "Daddy, why do those people have to | Greg Wooledge use Microsoft Windows?" | wooledge-+AT+-kellnet.com "Don't stare, son; it's not polite." | http://www.kellnet.com/wooledge/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 21:36:03 EDT From: Saberdrake-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Fwd: New Virus Found NOT A JOKE Message-ID: <5c6a0472.35d4e604-+AT+-aol.com> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --part0_903144963_boundary Content-ID: <0_903144963-+AT+-inet_out.mail.aol.com.1> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII --part0_903144963_boundary Content-ID: <0_903144963-+AT+-inet_out.mail.aol.com.2> Content-type: message/rfc822 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Content-disposition: inline Return-Path: Received: from relay26.mx.aol.com (relay26.mail.aol.com [172.31.109.26]) by air18.mail.aol.com (v47.5) with SMTP; Fri, 14 Aug 1998 02:13:54 2000 Received: from snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net (snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net [207.217.120.62]) by relay26.mx.aol.com (8.8.8/8.8.5/AOL-4.0.0) with ESMTP id CAA13094; Fri, 14 Aug 1998 02:12:24 -0400 (EDT) From: evilpixie-+AT+-earthlink.net Received: from default (pool033-max9.ds8-ca-us.dialup.earthlink.net [209.178.3.83]) by snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA19693; Thu, 13 Aug 1998 23:12:10 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <35D3D5C3.4D39-+AT+-earthlink.net> Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1998 23:14:27 -0700 Reply-To: evilpixie-+AT+-earthlink.net Organization: Admin Kit Investigator X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-NSCP (Win95; U) To: AzSmurf-+AT+-AOL.com CC: bnrspace-+AT+-AOL.com, enthusiasam-+AT+-hotmail.com, imbatman69-+AT+-AOL.com, Sphelps-+AT+-acme.csusb.edu, MrNighttime-+AT+-juno.com, smeredith-+AT+-prodigy.net, timertoo-+AT+-yahoo.com, craigv-+AT+-mc.net, pap_royce-+AT+-earthlink.net, mcmurraj-+AT+-cgs.edu, dabotcher-+AT+-AOL.com, julieqbert-+AT+-AOL.com, kayotic45-+AT+-AOL.com, KBrannan99-+AT+-AOL.com, mickey13-+AT+-AOL.com, betty_20-+AT+-hotmail.com, star4kc-+AT+-AOL.com, lover_36-+AT+-hotmail.com, moni27174-+AT+-AOL.com, rominejrg-+AT+-earthlink.net, lavalais-+AT+-juno.com, dtrain101-+AT+-AOL.com, saberdrake-+AT+-AOL.com, jorellsmnd-+AT+-juno.com, dawnrazer-+AT+-webtv.net, booklad-+AT+-AOL.com, K9DVM2BE-+AT+-AOL.com, jackal-+AT+-qnis.net, WillowFrst-+AT+-AOL.com, ldycat76-+AT+-AOL.com, Glaaki-+AT+-AOL.com, SoyBOMB187-+AT+-AOL.com, kovachy-+AT+-gate.net, silver1surfer-+AT+-hotmail.com, ahidalgo-+AT+-ces-landtec.com Subject: [Fwd: [Fwd: Fw: New Virus Found NOT A JOKE]] Content-Disposition: inline Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Received: from earthlink.net (pool040-max10.ds20-ca-us.dialup.earthlink.net [209.179.18.40]) by avocet.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA06304; Thu, 13 Aug 1998 12:27:30 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <35D34C52.DF742328-+AT+-earthlink.net> Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1998 13:28:02 -0700 From: Dana Maxwell X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Afy , Barbara Case , Jackie Pilcher , Jen & Iver , Jen Barrie , Kris & Steve , Mary Jo , Patty , Sibyl , Trina , Troy Subject: [Fwd: Fw: New Virus Found NOT A JOKE] Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------7DD0633D85271E8DF0C3B8E7" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------7DD0633D85271E8DF0C3B8E7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --------------7DD0633D85271E8DF0C3B8E7 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Received: from alaint (pool039-max1.covina-ca-us.dialup.earthlink.net [207.217.135.39]) by scaup.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA14853; Thu, 6 Aug 1998 14:31:39 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <003401bdc183$b2578a80$2787d9cf-+AT+-alaint> From: "=?iso-8859-1?Q?Alain_Talab=E1?=" To: "Zach McIntyre" , "Tony Rodriguez" , "Toni" , "Scott Maccallum" <105044.2543-+AT+-compuserve.com>, "Robert Chalmers" , "Ravi Bhagat" , "Michelle Jett" , "Max Obra" , "Marcos Mendell" , "Luis A Torres" , "Luana Lopez" , "Kerry Mackey" , "Erica Guntherberg" , "Edith Morales" , "=?iso-8859-1?Q?Eddie_Talab=E1_Sr.?=" , "Dana J Maxwell" , "Chris Pierce" , "Chad Nebel" , "Beth Vissars" Subject: Fw: New Virus Found NOT A JOKE Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 14:46:33 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 -----Original Message----- From: Gay Nau To: Berry Dunham Date: Thursday, July 30, 1998 17:00 Subject: Fw: New Virus Found NOT A JOKE -----Original Message----- From: Glenda, Tara, Debbie To: 'nau-+AT+-socket.net' Date: Thursday, July 30, 1998 6:34 AM Subject: FW: New Virus Found NOT A JOKE > > >---------- >From: Rick & Janet Williams[SMTP:pirate-+AT+-gulftel.com] >Sent: Wednesday, July 29, 1998 4:24 PM >To: Bowman Computer Service; Daniel K Warner; GLENDA HIRST; Janet Williams; Jeremy R Souter; Jerry Clark; Jim Harrison; John E. Walton; Nyitrai; ojs7055-+AT+-transica.sbeach.navy.mil; PICK 789; Robert Barnhart; Shane Finn; SSulcer-+AT+-ix.netcom.com; Staggs, Carol; STAN SULCER; Tom Lowery >Subject: Fw: New Virus Found NOT A JOKE > >> >> VIRUS ALERT!!! >> >>This is a new twist. Someone is sending out a very desirable >> >>screen-saver, the Budweiser Frogs. But if you download it, you will lose >>everything!!! Your hard drive will crash!!! >> >>DON'T DOWNLOAD THIS UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES!!! IT JUST WENT INTO >>CIRCULATION >>YESTERDAY, AS FAR AS WE KNOW....BE >> >>CAREFUL PLEASE DISTRIBUTE THIS TO AS MANY PEOPLE AS POSSIBLE...THANX >> >>BELOW IS WHAT THE SCREENSAVER OFFER WOULD LOOK LIKE! >> >>File: BUDSAVER.EXE (24643 bytes) >> >>DL Time (28800 bps): < 1 minute >> >>If you download some jerk from the internet will get your screen name and >>password! Please send this to any names you can think of and >> >>remember never download BUDDYLST.ZIP This is a new, very malicious virus >>and >>not many people know about it.This information was announced yesterday >>morning from Microsoft. Please share it with everyone that might access the >>internet.Once again, pass this along to EVERYONE in your address book so >>that this may be stopped. >> >> >>Dean Castaldo >>Carolina Connection Internet Service >>System Administrator >>admin-+AT+-carolinaconnect.com >> >> > > > --------------7DD0633D85271E8DF0C3B8E7-- --part0_903144963_boundary-- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 22:07:14 EDT From: Saberdrake-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Hello All! Message-ID: <7e4a7749.35d4ed53-+AT+-aol.com> Hello all, I'm new to the list. Boy, I can't believe all the e-mail I recieve from this list. Anyway, I just wanted to ad my opinions and questions to the list. First of all, about literature in school. I hope you realize that the purpose of most of the books they made you read was to expose your young minds to different things and ideas. I would never had read Camuus's "The Stranger" if it wasn't required in school (by the way, I know I can't spell). That was a great book. I liked some of the stuff they forced me to read. I didn't like most of the Shakespear stuff except Hamlet. But atleast I was exposed to the different ideas in all the books I was forced to read. Next, about the hair color thing... I'm not entirely sure but didn't the dydle (I don't remember how it's spelled... the stag like creature that Firesong rode on) also white with blue eyes like a companion? That creature could enhance magic like a companion. Darkwing used him in that capacity as well. And one more question... You all know in Valdemar they favor the Lord and Lady... In Shin'an'in it is the Goddess and in Karsite it is the Sunlord. I don't know if this has been discussed before but do you think that they are all the same? I mean the Goddess is the Lady and Sunlord is the Lord? I remember that in the past that the Sunlord had a consort but she disappeared. That's all for now. Saberdrake "You Must Rage Against The Dying Of The Light!" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 19:53:38 PDT From: "Rhiannon Shadowsong" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: magic/turning in/hair color Message-ID: <19980815025339.23687.qmail-+AT+-hotmail.com> >Actually, Valemar doesn't have a Heartstone at the time of Van. It isn't >until the k'Sheyna try to move their Heartstone, that they end up with >one. In fact, the spirit of Van steals it for Valdamar so that they'll >have a powersource to protect them from the Magestorms that are brewing. > >Mike Ok, I've been lurking for two days because Mom hasn't been letting me on the computer and I have an overflowing mailbox. But I had to respond to this. Van CREATED the Heartstone. With Savil and Lissandra and Kilchas. That was a big part of the web thing he did, because it needed a major power source. When Kilchas tries to pick up the crystal he says "sorry, that's a heartstone now. Its fused all the way down to the bed rock". So its definitely a heartstone. It just became weak because all the energy was going to the vrondi and there weren't any mages, so no one was doing anything with it. And it became forgotten and unused... I'm sure about 5 people answered this, but I decided to do it anyway, just in case. Bye until I find something else that I REALLY need to respond to (and be glad I'm trying to stay out of the literature debate. Although the next three or four posts may break my resolve. I'm simply itching to jump in.) Rhiannon Shadowsong ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 20:02:30 PDT From: "Rhiannon Shadowsong" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: reincarnation Message-ID: <19980815030232.18264.qmail-+AT+-hotmail.com> >in the last book of the storms trilogy Florian is killed and his ghost >was of a human. so if companions can be reincarnated as humans why not >reverse. but to counter my own arguement.When tylendel died he was a >herald but he came back as Stephen. > >Confused, > > GryphonStorm I resisted literature, but I wanted this one. Ok, my basic thoughts are that Lendel's death was a mistake. Van eventually finds out it was caused by Leareth, and we all know that THAT certainly screwed up the gods' karmic plans. Something was owed to Vanyel because of the mess made of his life. And Lendel probably wasn't ready to handle being a Herald--the previous experience was rather traumatic. I also think that he needed to be able to devote himself to Vanyel and not have duties to Randale. And I for one am sure that Heralds come back as Companions. It says it straight out in the first few pages of Storm Warning and there are hints in all the other books. Most any way. To finish what I was saying before I babbled, Tylendel was the exception to many rules. He was *repudiated* and he was messed with by Krebain. And my paraniod theory is that Krebain was one of Leareth's minions--we know that Leareth had something to do with Lendel's death, after all. I'm babbling again. Van and Lendel/Stef were exceptions to many rules, so I don't think that they really disprove anything. Maybe Lendel got a choice like Van did, and he chose that because he wasn't ready for Herald-hood, and because of the reasons I already mentioned. I think I'll end this epic here. Wind to thy Wings, Rhiannon Shadowsong Visit the Tower at http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shire/3965 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 22:13:12 -0500 From: edrucker-+AT+-ruraltel.net (Ed Rucker) To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Fwd: New Virus Found NOT A JOKE Message-ID: <35D4FCC7.64ED509B-+AT+-ruraltel.net> I checked Symantec's Antivirus site, and it's a hoax. Check this site about this so-called 'virus': http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/data/buddylst.zip.html If you ever want to check one of these out, go to their anti-virus site, and seach for whatever you've been warned against. http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/index.html Minstrel Clarienne ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 20:13:12 PDT From: "Rhiannon Shadowsong" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: magic/turning in/hair color Message-ID: <19980815031314.834.qmail-+AT+-hotmail.com> >> Actually, Valemar doesn't have a Heartstone at the time of Van. It isn't >> until the k'Sheyna try to move their Heartstone, that they end up with >> one. In fact, the spirit of Van steals it for Valdamar > >Or rather, Vanyel creates the Heartstone in his time (he comments, to >Lissandra or Kilchas, that s/he can't take her/his mage's focus because >it's become part of the heartstone). Further, I believe it's mentioned >that he'd been adding ley-lines to the node underneath Haven, with an >aside to the effect that one needs to be a Hawkbrother or have trained >with them to create nodes. This needent affect argument against Van's >not going fully silver because he's not around a heartstone, because he >only does this partway into _Price_, near the end of the trilogy, after >he's begun to bleach, after he's been practicing magic for, what, about >20 years. > >What actually intrigues me about the whole bleaching thing is that it >works more like natural graying than like sun-bleaching. Though at some >point the process is described as being due to the tremendous energies >of the nodes, consistenly our heroes silver by the thumbwidth and the >lock: the change implements from the root, not the ends. > >Yours while I wait for a firecat, >Jenni. > > This made me think of the most interesting theory! OOOHH! I'm excited about this one. I have a friend and her family (on her mother's side) is extremely psychic. My friend and I have gotten into all kinds of messes....we used to be the Spooky Squad, until we got the !-+AT+-$ scared out of us. Anyway, everyone in her family goes prematurely gray. Is this triggering anything?!?!?! My mother also went a little grey in her 20s, and she thinks I will too. And I found a pure white hair in this friends head a few months before she moved. I shoud add that we are 16. This has all sorts of interesting possibilities. Please everbody! Respond! Your questions and criticisms may make this into a viable theory, and goodness knows I'll need an interwesting science fair for Mr John.... Rhiannon Shadowsong ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1998 20:25:35 PDT From: "Rhiannon Shadowsong" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Elements in Misty's books/Braid of Many things/ Message-ID: <19980815032538.16028.qmail-+AT+-hotmail.com> >Oooer, chain chain! > >> John E. Morris wrote: "The difficulty being, give twenty fairly ticked >> off peasants some flintlocks and hide them behind a hill and even >> Falconsbane wouldn't stand a chance. Bloodmage or no, he's going to >> have a tough time reacting to something moving as fast as a musket ball. >> Takes almost no training, can't see it quickly enough to block. >> Gunpowder could put an end to mages, period." > >> And, here's a thought, what's the physics of a mage-bolt anyway? I've >> always conceptualized them as energy. A correlary to this would be that >> they move at the speed of light, wouldn't they? > >Unhuh. ;) As a wise person once said to me. Magic is just the answer to a >physics problem not yet asked. Since, as Misty goes to obvious, at least to me, >pains to make a 'Magic' cycle as such. [Nodes, and the Mage Storms, and >dispersals, i.e, someone casting magic putting it back into the 'air' for it to >drain back down into ley lines] then it gives Magic physical properties. Now, if >mages have the ability to *shield*, *create*, and *channel* energy that requires >lightining quick thought because it *DOES* travel at light speed, due to it being >[for sake of discussion], a photon based emission [Photons - A Particle/Wave >conceptuality of light that have no mass], I have always assumed that in a mage >duel it was more the 'feel' of the energies being woven that the mages reacted >to, rather than the physical manifestations of the magic. Now, if all that's >true. And Mages are used to reacting 'at the speed of light.' Then what the >*HECK* is a poor man with a musket going to be able to do. Muskets don't go >*that* fast. ;) ::sigh:: It's such bliss to be on this list. Thank you Wintershard. for proving that people can get away with these thoughts. i tried to open a discussion of the physics-is-magick topic at school once, and you'd have thought I was a Satanic demon-loving I don't know what. Which is weird, because there is a large Wiccan population art my school, and its pretty open minded, considering I live in a huge ghetto. aka Galveston TX. I've got to refer to Arthur C Clarke. he annoys me sometimes but he hit this concept right on the nose. He said something along tht lines of "To less developed civilizations, technology seems like magick." Its correlary is about how magick is just superior technology that we don't fully understand yet. Woohoo! If I like physics this year (I'm only in high school, so I haven't taken any til now) I may just change my major and see if I can't research this. Its been a goal in my life for a few years now. (If I could figure out how to Gate, that would really be awesome, especially if I can figure out how to gate to a place I've never really been--Valdemar, that is!) I think it would make a fantastic thesis, and a Nobel prize or two might be in the offing if something this momentous was proved to the satisfaction of the majority of the population. Um, ObMisty.....uh....I think ... Um, nevermind. Rhiannon Shadowsong ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ End of MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 1686 **********************************