MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 1889 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: by ScismGenie-+AT+-aol.com 2) Re: handicapped characters by "charlotte distefano" 3) Hello and censored! by Aeon Judgement 4) Re: blindness/censorship by Greg Wooledge 5) Re: handicapped characters by "Janet Bowen" 6) Re: age/disaproval of fantasy by Ingrid 7) braid by "ambermoon starshadow" 8) Re: blindness/censorship by AERDEN-+AT+-delphi.com 9) Re: zodiac by Paige 10) learning about shaych by Becky Cary 11) zodiac by "charlotte distefano" 12) nicknames by "charlotte distefano" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 14:44:16 EST From: ScismGenie-+AT+-aol.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: Message-ID: <24f84ba2.36d6f990-+AT+-aol.com> In a message dated 2/26/99 9:28:21 AM Pacific Standard Time, char_char3-+AT+-hotmail.com writes: << ~~Charlotte, Char, Char-Char, Charlee >> Lottie? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 12:08:01 PST From: "charlotte distefano" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: handicapped characters Message-ID: <19990226200801.28902.qmail-+AT+-hotmail.com> I'm npt too sure, but I think that the mating flight was not quite complete when Falsonsbane shot Hydona. Also, I ad aquestios concerning gryphlets. In on of the winds books, Winds of Change I think, when Falconsbane comes, and the heralds, Darkwind, etc. Wait in hiding so they can attack him, Need is left to protect the gryphlets, and she ends up removing Falconsbane's taint from them. Now, when Elspeth first asks Need to protect the gryphlets, she says there are two girls, and one bow, but later there are only two, Lytha & jerven(I probably spelled those wrong). If anyone can explain this to me, please do. Are there two gryphlets, or three? Thanks Charlotte, Lightsong >From mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Thu Feb 25 22:43:49 1999 >Received: from vanyel (localhost [127.0.0.1]) > by vanyel.herald.co.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id FAA07426 > for ; Fri, 26 Feb 1999 05:39:27 GMT >Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 05:39:27 GMT >Message-Id: <19990226005039.4971.qmail-+AT+-hotmail.com> >Errors-To: lackey-owner-+AT+-herald.co.uk >Reply-To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk >Originator: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk >Sender: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk >Precedence: bulk >From: Alia Rose >To: char_char3-+AT+-hotmail.com >Subject: Re: handicapped characters >X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0c -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas >X-Comment: Mercedes Lackey Mailing List > >handicapped characters....lets see... >Well, Tenel Ka in the Young Jedi Knight's books has only one arm(they're >chessy, but cute), the telekenitic kid in McCaffery's Pegesus in Flight >is paralysied (whoa, my spelling is horrid today)from the neck down, and >one other character in that book is also physically handicapped,there's >a kid in another McCAffery, Dolphins of Pern, he has a club foot, i >believe, umm...thats all i can think of right now. > >speaking of McCaffery, has anyone besides me read her new one, Nimisha's >Ship? i just finished it.email me offlist if you have, i want to know >what others thought of it. > >Obmisty: i asked this question a while ago, but nobody answered, so i >can ask it again. ok, in the first "winds" book, the gryphons are having >a mating flight. it was my understanding that the flight was complete >before falconsbane interrupted. no mention is made again about it. it if >was finished, where are the new gryphlets? somebody PLEASE answer, this >is really starting to bug me. > > >ambermoon, i finished "Bitter Earth"! ill write you soon. >************************************* >Alianora Rose >Friend of Greenfire >icq# 1372207 >************************************* >"Strangly enough, the only thing that went through the mind of >the bowl of petunias was Oh no, not again." > -The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy > > >______________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free Email at http:// ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: 26 Feb 99 19:33:25 EST From: Aeon Judgement To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Hello and censored! Message-ID: <19990227003325.18337.qmail-+AT+-www0a.netaddress.usa.net> Greetings I just wanted to say hello, I just found this list and I totally love Mercedes Lacky so I thought I would join. I have been sitting here for a day or two reading your E-mails and from what I have read so far everone sounds nice so I think i will enjoy this! Oh and about parents censoring what people read, mine never did that, I could read what ever I wanted, but then again I was reading Shakespear before people my age had ever heard of him so I dont hink my parents minded much...Misty books, I have been reading her books for about 5 years now and I never get sick of them! Alos I heard about alberich story but I dont know what book its in but I want to read it. Does anyone know the name of the book? Aeon Shadoow ____________________________________________________________________ Get free e-mail and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 21:40:06 -0500 From: Greg Wooledge To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: blindness/censorship Message-ID: <19990226214006.C7289-+AT+-phoenix.local> Starmane (minmei-+AT+-mail.music.vt.edu) wrote: > Anyways, another two series that have > a physically disabled person [...] And don't forget Stephen R. Donaldson's Thomas Covenant books. Covenant suffers from leprosy, and the effect this has on him and his life is tightly bound into the plot. > About the censorship issue....my parents were sort of divided about > reading. My parents didn't censor my reading. They had some nonfiction books about human sexuality lying around the house, which I read somewhere around age 11. I think they left these books lying about in lieu of having a serious "birds and bees" discussion. I also remember reading a more biological text about reproduction somewhere around age 8, but it didn't really cover sex; and I was a pretty naive kid, so I didn't figure out how sex worked until a few years later. (The book talked about sperm and eggs, cells, embryos, etc., but didn't explain the mechanics.) > I read rather a bit as a child. I was a little nerd. I mostly read math and science books, until I had mastered algebra (long before I took algebra in high school or even "pre-algebra" in junior high, which was laughable since it was taught by one of the physical education teachers, who barely knew the subject). At that point I turned to science fiction, fantasy, and a little bit of horror. Oceania Angels (bastet11-+AT+-hotmail.com) wrote: > I _know_ I vaguely knew that there were shaych > people, but that the main char of a book was one surprised me. A little. I never thought about homosexuality much. I still don't, really. I'm straight, but I can accept differences in others. After all, it doesn't have any effect on me. The first time I really learned what homosexual meant was when my mother made some off-hand comment about the Village People. She was surprised that they were singing the song "Macho Man"; apparently, she assumed that a shaych man wouldn't have that sort of self-image. When I asked her what she meant, she had to explain what it meant to be homosexual. I think I was about 9 at that time; I still didn't understand sex, so she explained it in terms of romance/marriage. Once I learned what sex really was, it was simple enough to deduce what homosexuality really meant. But again, it didn't matter to me -- it was, I think, somewhat akin to discussing the mating habits of some theoretical alien race.[1] It was interesting from a clinical point of view, but not a personal matter. But don't be offended if you're shaych. I don't think you're an alien! :-} ObMisty: Since I didn't read LHM until I was in my upper 20s, and since I'm not shaych myself (see above), the inclusion of a shaych character didn't really affect me too much. But I can understand how it could have a profound impact on someone younger who's just discovering that sexuality isn't always simply boy-meets-girl, or who's been raised in a more restrictive environment. I identify with Talia more than I do with Vanyel, despite the fact that she's female and I'm male. [1] ObBookReference: Piers Anthony, the "Cluster" series. He invents many different alien races and discusses how they reproduce. It's rather creative; I don't think I could've come up with that many different ways.... ;-) -- Greg Wooledge | Distributed.NET http://www.distributed.net/ wooledge-+AT+-kellnet.com | because a CPU is a terrible thing to waste. http://www.kellnet.com/wooledge/ | ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 18:48:40 PST From: "Janet Bowen" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: handicapped characters Message-ID: <19990227024841.1750.qmail-+AT+-hotmail.com> Obmisty: i asked this question a while ago, but nobody answered, so i can ask it again. ok, in the first "winds" book, the gryphons are having a mating flight. it was my understanding that the flight was complete before falconsbane interrupted. no mention is made again about it. it if was finished, where are the new gryphlets? somebody PLEASE answer, this is really starting to bug me. Yes they were finished and there was no mention of new gryphlets. I think that Falconsbane put a cabash on that when he showed up and took the young ones that they already had. Whitedeer aka Wandering Deer Medicine Woman ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 21:09:49 -0600 From: Ingrid To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: age/disaproval of fantasy Message-ID: <36D761FD.7EF3152C-+AT+-sk.sympatico.ca> "Kalen [One In Black]" wrote: > To true. I think that children should start being told about shaych > people [truth not stereotype] around middle school [thats around age > 12 isn't it? ] I wish I had had some discussion about it in my > secondary school [UK starts age 12]. Then maybe I would not have felt > so worthless for so many years and hid the fact that I am shaych until > I was 23. Any other shaych people wish they had read Misty earlier > than they did? *raises hand* Me. I'm bi and so far I've yet to be told about homosexuality in any class. It's a closed book still. Big no no. I read my first Misty book about a year ago, when I was almost fourteen. It was the first Storms book and I was surprised to find that two of the main characters were shaych. I imediatly read all of the LHM books. So although I'm not actually "out" yet, seeing as I'm scared outta my mind that someone'll hurt me when I do *shudders*, reading Misty's books made me comfortable with something that schools still refuse to touch, and I'm in grade nine. Now the age thread. It's impossible to tell when a child will be ready to read a good deal of Misty's works. I know people in my class, 14, 15, 16 year olds, who I still don't think would be mature enough to read books with shaych heroes or sex without giggling stupidly. Although I personally didn't read Misty till lately, I read other books that dealt with similar subjects without sniggering or giggling or being warped. I started reading Greek mythology in grade 5, which can involve a lot of sex and death. My parents never censored my reading either. My dad doesn't read much but my mom was glad that I read something. She doesn't really care what I read. She's bought me Piers Anthony's Xanth books (The Colour of her Panties caused a bit of a surprise) and Terry Pratchett's Discworld books. Anyone who's seen some of those covers knows why there might be a bit of an objection. My mom doesn't care, she knows I'm mature enough to deal with almost anything. The only thing she won't let me do is whatch a movie called "All the Jazz" But I'll live. Maple leaf shaped sheep to all, Ingrid Blythe, Head of the CfWD, and her familiar Xave aka Starflame k'T'more and her bondbird Kysh http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dreamworld/4205/ -- "Coincidences can be frightening and dangerous things." - Dirk Gently ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 21:38:17 PST From: "ambermoon starshadow" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: braid Message-ID: <19990227053818.19237.qmail-+AT+-hotmail.com> Heyla, For everyone that's been talking about the mining story in Sword_of_Ice, called "The Demon's Den", as an example of Misty's portrayal of disabled characters, she didn't write it. Sorry, but Sword_of_Ice is an anthology written by other people, basically legal fan-fic. "The Demon's Den" is by Tanya Huff. (which reminds me, I want to read her stuff but don't know what the order is. can anyone advise?) On the old issue of censorship (I know I already gave my 2 cents, but I have some spare change), my parents never censored my reading, although they did give me books. As for keeping me away from fantasy, they started me on it. I would have found it on my own, but they helped. My mother is not happy, however, that at present I read nothing but fantasy and sci-fi. She makes a number of unsubtle remarks about reading other things also. I know she's right, but at the moment I can't bring myself to do it. That might change though; I just read a fascinating book for a school project and am going to hunt some more along similar lines (US history, no less.) For fantasy vs sci-fi, I tend to lump them together for the sake of convenience. I prefer fantasy, but some sci-fi is very good. I've been lectured by my uncle on reading more straight sci-fi, and my teacher, so I think I'll go hunt some. (I was very good last year and read Stranger_In_A_Strange_Land, the uncut version) Whoever mentioned Pern, I love that series, and I think Dragonsdawn is the best blending of the two genres. I have been blessed with some very good teachers, and my English teacher last year was very interested in LHM when I started linking it to books we were studying last year (and the year before, I had her twice in a row). She's also one of the faculty advisors of our GSA, so she was doubly interested. On reading, I am one of those people who reads every second I get. I was thorougly bored in elementary school and read all through it. I swear I never heard one lecture by my fifth grade teacher. If I was ever caught the book was taken away. I would have continued this habit through middle and high school, but the classes are smaller so the teacher sees you, and thank the gods they're more interesting. People have never understood why I read all the time (and don't watch any tv), and even more so b/c it's fantasy and sci-fi. However, I feel the verbal SAT is fitting revenge for years of nasty names and odd looks and everything. So easy for me, so hard for stupid people who wouldn't know what to do with a book if they were ever given one (yes, I'm mean. but so are they, and they were first) I am proud of myself for getting four people into Misty, and those have gotten two more. I love winning converts! Star Trek? Someone mentioned Star Trek? Trekker here! TOS is awful, I always root for the guy fighting Kirk; TNG is wonderful, awesome, insert-your-own superlative-here; DS9 is good but I never get a chance to see it; Voyager is a sorry exuse for a Star Trek show. *bounces up and down* how long do you think until the first DS9 movie? Someone mentioned Darkover; I've only read one book, I want to read more but don't know the order. can someone advise? oops. that was long. sorry. I'll try to be better next time, really I will. -Ambermoon Singer of Fire ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 01:06:22 -0500 (EST) From: AERDEN-+AT+-delphi.com To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: blindness/censorship Message-ID: <01J87XFVGEMW9CA7Y1-+AT+-delphi.com> Re sex...What drove me nuts for the longest time was that all the books I read mentioned 'fertilization,' but they never would explain what 'fertilization' was or how it happened. And of course, I didn't want to ASK, or I'd reveal to everyone how clueless I was. I thought I simply wasn't understanding something that everyone else (I figured) found perfectly obvious. This is why I didn't ask my parents to explain it. I thought that if I just reread the books enough, I'd figure it out, eventually. I never lived around a farm and never saw my pet cat mate. I didn't learn what it meant until I found a book about how to explain sex to children once at a B. Dalton store. It had a picture. ::chuckle:: I remember staring wide-eyed at the illustration and thinking, "But that's _gross!_" ObMisty: I'd hate to think how Holderkin (if they even bother) explain sex to their children. Chantal ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 09:40:40 -0500 From: Paige To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: Re: zodiac Message-ID: <36D803E8.304D-+AT+-sympatico.ca> Nelson Greenslade wrote: > < somewhere that, according to my sign, I am supposed to be peaceful, kind, > and most at ease in the company of others. (Whereas I have at least two > days a week where I go around muttering 'get away from me or I'll slit your > throat'.)>> > *snorts* It's amazing how off-base some of this stuff can be. I'm the > same, although I could probably get away with putting it down to puberty. > Actually, people try to piss me off. Really. I could write a book. > It also depends n your birthday. People born 3 days before or after the chaning of the sign are on "the cusp" and so, could possibly be the "other" sign. Take me, My birthdays Nov 23, making me a Sag/Scorp. I have bits of both in me. I know this might not be the case for everyone who's personality doesn't match, but it might help some of you. -- Paige GO LEAFS!!! proud to be Outlandish I didn't fight my way to the top of the food chain to be a vegetarian. (to e-mail double the p and take out the "reston") ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 12:51:55 -0500 (EST) From: Becky Cary To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: learning about shaych Message-ID: People have been sharing their "I first learned about homosexuality when..." experiences, so I thought I'd jump in with mine. Believe it or not, I was about eight and looking through the TV Guide one night, when I saw an episode of "The Golden Girls" described as one of the women finding out that a good friend was a lesbian. My mom was out that night, and I'd never seen the word before, so I asked the babysitter. She first looked surprised, then uncomfortable (explaining sexual terms and orientations not being covered in Babysitting 101), and finally told me that a lesbian was a woman who fell in love with other women instead of with men. My reaction was basically, "Oh, ok." I'm still glad that my first explanation of the subject was straightforward and non-judgmental; it really helped set the pattern for how I think and feel about that. On the subject of parental book censorship, I think that the initial question was based more on what books the writer (sorry, deleted that message already) should _encourage_ her kid to read. Gently steering a kid toward interesting, fun, maturity-level-appropriate books is a Very Good Thing, and very different from outright forbidding reading other, less appropriate books. The "steering" idea generally worked on me; some of those books (Robin McKinley!) are still among my favorites. The out-and-out forbidding never did; I simply read the book behind my mom's back instead. (It was always my mom who tried to curtail my reading matter. And it was occasionally my grandmother who helped me get around it.) The first book that I was ever told I couldn't read: On a Pale Horse, by Piers Anthony. I was maybe eight or nine, and my mom felt it was inappropriate (don't remember why). So of course I read it when she wasn't home, instead. Second was The Mummy, by Anne Rice, which I read at the library. (That one, my mother had actually bought to give me for Christmas and loaned to my aunt in late November, who returned it with every single sexual passage bookmarked and the suggestion that I shouldn't be given it, after all.) A repeat of a question I asked once before, but got no takers on -- anybody know where the phrase "Curse of the Pink Wand" comes from? Cennydd? Raven? Anybody? Okay, a quick ObMisty....... it's Misty trivia time! (Apologies to whoever originated this game.) Here's the way it works: I give you the name of a Companion, you mail me privately (not on-list) the name of that Companion's Chosen, and the book(s) in which they appear/are mentioned. Then I announce the winners to the list, and you get the undying admiration of your peers. This week's Companion: Steladar Come on, it's fun! You know you want to! Becky, Goddess of Oversleeping and Snide Comments -------------- In general, France is a safe travel destination, though travelers are advised that, from time to time, it is invaded by Germany. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:16:36 PST From: "charlotte distefano" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: zodiac Message-ID: <19990227181636.13918.qmail-+AT+-hotmail.com> Nelson- Libras are not nessecerily (I can't spell. Sorry) peaceful, kind and at ease in the company of others. Actually, Libras are very much into balance. They want their worldt to be harmonious and beautiful. This can actually cause some discord when you are with other people, because they can disturb the workings of your world. Okay, that's my thoughts on the motter. Hope it helps. Oh, you also might want to look at your moon sign, or rising sign. They might be more accurate. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:21:17 PST From: "charlotte distefano" To: mercedes-lackey-+AT+-herald.co.uk Subject: nicknames Message-ID: <19990227182117.2780.qmail-+AT+-hotmail.com> Lottie isn't one of the most common, I think I only have one friend that calls me that (she also calls me lolita) but you can call me that if you like. ~~Lott ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ End of MERCEDES-LACKEY Digest 1889 **********************************