[LMB] RE: Lois-Bujold digest, Vol 1 #316 - 19 msgs

Hand Sally hand-sally at dol.gov
Tue, 12 Feb 2002 07:42:58 -0500


As the official lurker from the DC area I can say not only do we get
together bi weekly but if you come to town we will make sure you get "good"
coffee.  It can be on an off week too.

Sally C. Hand
Law Librarian
US Department of Labor
200 Constitution Ave, NW
Washington DC 20210

(202) 693 6615


-----Original Message-----
From: lois-bujold-request at lists.herald.co.uk
[mailto:lois-bujold-request at lists.herald.co.uk]
Sent: Monday, February 11, 2002 8:57 PM
To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk
Subject: Lois-Bujold digest, Vol 1 #316 - 19 msgs


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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: OT: Cat Behavior (Cat Meier)
   2. Re: DI---- NO SPOILERS (Cat Meier)
   3. Re: OT: Cat Behavior (Phyllis LeFevre)
   4. Re: Herm pronouns (was Channel Islands and Axes!) (Peter H. Granzeau)
   5. Re: FW: Betan Technological Superiority. (Damien Raphael)
   6. Re: Chocolate Dogs (WAS: Speaking of Cats OT:) (Kristine Smith)
   7. Re: FW: Betan Technological Superiority (Padget, Scott R)
   8. RE: OT: Going no mail (Nancy Barber)
   9. OT: The tilde in my sig (Michael Bauminger)
  10. Re: DI---- NO SPOILERS (Padget, Scott R)
  11. OT: Famous people (Susan Profit)
  12. More Texas Boyz (was Re: [LMB] DI chapter 6 from
       webscriptions)-- Despoilered (Padget, Scott R)
  13. Re: FW: Betan Technological Superiority. (Damien Raphael)
  14. OT: RE: Famous People (Susan Profit)
  15. Re: OT: List traffic explosion (Michael Bauminger)
  16. Re: DI---- NO SPOILERS (Phyllis LeFevre)
  17. Re: FW: Betan Technological Superiority (Damien Raphael)
  18. Re: BAS uniforms (D Echelbarger)

--__--__--

Message: 1
From: "Cat Meier" <fairestcat at hotmail.com>
To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: [LMB] OT: Cat Behavior
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 19:48:49 -0500
Reply-To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

>From: "Royce Day" <Royce_Day at choicehotels.com>

>Seriously, Max is one empathic cat.  I was sitting on the couch at home
>yesterday, alone, and not feeling very well thanks to an overly greasy Bob
>Evan's breakfast earlier.  Max hops up onto the couch beside me and goes 
>into
>Luv Sl*t mode, wanting to be petted and purring until he was sure *I* felt
>better.

Our family cat back home is like this.  Worthless is 17 years old (we think)

and still a happy healthy s*ut kitty and king of the house.  (He'd like to 
think he's still king of the neighborhood too, but he really can't hold his 
own anymore like when he was younger.)   Wort has always been extremely 
empathetic, if you are sick or unhappy he knows it and feels that it is his 
sworn duty to love you to death until you're better.  Unfortunately, we're 
all asthmatics in my house so half the time if we're sick being mauled by 
the cat is the last thing we need, but just try to explain that to him!

Obbujold, Worthless is such a beloved family member that my brother (a 27 
year old firefighter) informed my mother that before the cat dies he wants 
to freeze a tissue sample so he can possibly clone it someday.  The rest of 
us all agreed that might be going a bit to far, but I think secretly we all 
understand where he's coming from, like my mother always says, Wort is 'one 
awesome cat'.

Cat, who would like to think that, as Cat's go, she's not to bad herself <g>


_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp.

--__--__--

Message: 2
From: "Cat Meier" <fairestcat at hotmail.com>
To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: [LMB] DI---- NO SPOILERS
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 19:58:49 -0500
Reply-To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

>From: "Eric Oppen" <oppen at cnsinternet.com>

>
>You know, we could start our own support group:
>
>"Hi, I'm Eric, and I'm a Bujold-aholic."
>
>I wonder if we could get gourmet coffee for our meetings?

Well, we already have one in the DC area, there's a group of us that hang 
out most 2nd and 4th Fridays.  I can't speak for the others, but I'd say 
that anyone who proffers gourmet coffee is more than welcome if they happen 
to be in town <g>

Cat



_________________________________________________________________
Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. 
http://www.hotmail.com

--__--__--

Message: 3
From: "Phyllis LeFevre" <plefevre at hotmail.com>
To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: [LMB] OT: Cat Behavior
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 20:04:00 -0500
Reply-To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

>>From: "Royce Day"

>>Max hops up onto the couch beside me and goes into Luv Sl*t mode,
wanting to be petted and purring<

Cat agreed, saying:

>Worthless is 17 years old (we think) and still a happy healthy s*ut
kitty and king of the house. <

That's Buddha too!  Although....."close" personal friends tend to call
him a wh*re.

hehehehe

Phyllis

who can't wait to get home to her favorite sl*t kitty

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~  "..since
no one is perfect, it follows that all great deeds have been accomplished
out of imperfection. Yet they were accomplished, somehow, all the same."
Cordelia Naismith Vorkosigan,  Mirror Dance  by Lois McMaster Bujold

------------------------------------------------------------------------

Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. Click Here

--__--__--

Message: 4
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 18:42:42 -0500
To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk
From: "Peter H. Granzeau" <pgranzeau at cox.net>
Subject: Re: [LMB] Herm pronouns (was Channel Islands and Axes!)
Reply-To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

At 14:25 02/11/2002 -0600, Andrew Lambdin-Abraham wrote:
There's textev in the Webscription chapters for 1).  The background cause 
is not addressed at all though.

I am doing my best to avoid reading the Webscriptions.  I won't be able to 
persuade myself to buy the book in May if I have already read it.  It 
appears the snippets have covered the first quarter of the book, already.

--__--__--

Message: 5
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 17:12:38 -0800
From: Damien Raphael <phoenix at ugcs.caltech.edu>
To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: [LMB] FW: Betan Technological Superiority.
Reply-To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

On Mon, Feb 11, 2002 at 05:31:29PM -0600, Andrew Lambdin-Abraham wrote:
> On Monday, February 11, 2002, at 05:02 PM, Mandos D Shadowspawn Esq 

> > This recalls something that has bugged me for some time. What is
> > the likelyhood of any one location having the edge in technology
> > for over 500 years?
> 
> Well, it depends on what you're looking for.  But I'd say the US has 

And how you define "location".  Western countries have had a tech lead
for the last 500 years.  Japan got a piece of the action; Japan also
spent a lot of effort becoming Western.  19th century China had trouble
admitting inferiority even while being shot at.

And then there's that description of Earth: "...as technologically
advanced as Beta Colony..."

-xx- Damien X-) 

--__--__--

Message: 6
From: "Kristine Smith" <KSmith at sff.net>
To: <lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [LMB] Chocolate Dogs (WAS: Speaking of Cats OT:)
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 19:20:12 -0600
Reply-To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

----- Original Message -----
X-Sybari-Space: 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000
From: <TheOTThug at aol.com>
To: <lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk>
Sent: Monday, February 11, 2002 9:47 AM
Subject: Re: [LMB] Chocolate Dogs (WAS: Speaking of Cats OT:)


> Kristine asked:
>
> <<However, what effect can pure cocoa have?>>
> Approximately 10 times as potent as milk chocolate.  So
> one ounce of cocoa or bitter sweet baking chocolate
> would be the equivalent of 10 oz of milk and a danger to
> a small dog.  Your dog would have to eat about a half
> pound of cocoa power or baking chocolate to be in
> serious trouble.
>
> Jeff Parker

Thanks--this is good to know.

I recall that *years* ago (late 60s-early 70s), Hartz came out with a
product called Doggy Kisses.  My friend Regina and I fed them to our dogs,
and even tried a couple ourselves.  If I recall, they tasted like baking
chocolate.

I wonder if they were carob.  Surely Hartz would have done research into the
effect of chocolate on dogs, but perhaps not, given the times.  I don't
believe the treats were on the market for very long, but I'll admit I didn't
look for them.

Kris


> --
> Lois-Bujold mailing list
> Lois-Bujold at lists.herald.co.uk
> http://lists.herald.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/lois-bujold
>
===============================================
Kristine Smith
Code...Rules...Law of Survival
www.sff.net/people/ksmith
E-4 wants you!

--__--__--

Message: 7
From: "Padget, Scott R" <scott.r.padget at boeing.com>
To: "'Bujold Mailing List'" <lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [LMB] FW: Betan Technological Superiority
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 19:19:51 -0600
Reply-To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

> I'd say the US has 
> maintained a lead in all technological areas I can think of for some 
> hundred years

???  So we were the technological leaders in the 1890's or 19-aughts?  *Not*
Great Britain?

And of *course* we're the technological leaders nowadays.  That explains why
we all use US-made computers stuffed with US-made chips and why the mileage,
engineering, quality, and low cost of US-made cars are the envy of the
world.  Right?

Not to mention (near and dear to *my* heart) the utter lack of serious
competition the US commercial airplane manufacturers have, right?  Boeing,
McDonnell Douglas, Lockheed:  The Big Three aren't particularly bothered by
that European upstart, right?

Oh, wait.  Lockheed (now Lockheed-Martin) got out of that business, MacDac
is defunct, and Boeing is eyeing the new Airbus superjumbo with
ill-concealed loathing....

I'll grant you, oh, maybe 50 years of broad-based US technological
superiority, from sometime before WWII (though the Germans were ahead of us
in a great many areas of military tech, and radar was a *British* invention)
to around 1980 or thereabouts.  Before that I think Britain was the leader,
and after that the US passed the torch to Japan and Germany--we just haven't
really admitted it yet.

> For that matter, I think the US will continue to lead for the forseeable 
> future.  

We're still the world leader in military tech, and its bastard child space
flight, and perhaps some of the biosciences, but that doesn't really
translate into a broad-based leadership.  Oh, and we have Hollywood.
Whatever *that* might be worth.

Of course, that might potentially describe Beta Colony, too.... (getting us
back on topic)

Pilot Padget--thinking the structure of the US decline is looking a *lot*
like Britain a century ago

--__--__--

Message: 8
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 20:19:59 -0500
To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk
From: Nancy Barber <nancy at dendarii.com>
Subject: RE: [LMB] OT: Going no mail
Reply-To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

At 11:13 PM -0500 2/6/02, Mark A Mandel wrote:
>
>For my future reference, is there a way to manipulate one's subscription
>WITHOUT using the WWW? I have a slow dialup connection -- well, it's
>  nominal 57600 or so (=28.8 kB oneway?), but it's slow and unstable ...

(Sorry for the delay in answering--I got swamped by list mail
while out of town. )

Most of the list commands can be issued via e-mail, and I've
tried to put the instructions in the Administrivia FAQ (which
gets posted once a month, I think).

For example, here's what to do to pause mail:

Send e-mail to lois-bujold-request at lists.herald.co.uk with the
following in the subject line or in the message body:

SET NOMAIL ON <yourlistpassword>

When you get back, reset to normal by sending an e-mail to the same address:

SET NOMAIL OFF <yourlistpassword>

So, save the Administrivia FAQ the next time it gets posted, and also
save that email that Mel sends out periodically that has your password
in it.  You'll need your password to execute most of the list commands.
-- 
Nancy Barber
Send FAQ comments and suggestions to lmb-faq at dendarii.com

--__--__--

Message: 9
From: "Michael Bauminger" <mikebomb at myrealbox.com>
To: "Bujold Mailing List" <lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk>
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 20:22:42 -0500
Subject: [LMB] OT: The tilde in my sig
Reply-To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

I know the meaning of the tilde in logical notation ("approximately").
However, I am signing my name here, not doing math or making a logical
statement. As Casey Allison said, I think it looks better than a plain
hyphen. And it has nothing to do with my ISP, the possibility that
there is an "impostor Michael ", or anything else.

~Michael

--__--__--

Message: 10
From: "Padget, Scott R" <scott.r.padget at boeing.com>
To: "'Bujold Mailing List'" <lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [LMB] DI---- NO SPOILERS
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 19:24:08 -0600
Reply-To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

Nora/Elizabeth pleads:
> Andrew, will you elope with me immediately so that we can get LMB to email

> us the rest of the book?

<finger waggle>  Ah, ah, ah!  No fair jumping to the front.  Go off to the
end of the line and wait your turn at Andrew with the rest of us!

Andrew replies:
> Look at this, I don't even need to go out seeking women to marry, they 
> throw themselves at me.  

A-*HEM*!  <eyebrow raise> *Women*?  I think I'm going to get offended now.
Both for my sake and for Ian's....  <g>  (Well, okay, so we've lowered the
stakes from "marriage" somewhat....)

Pilot Padget--annoyed at linejumpers ever since grammar school, but amused
when he gets called "Ma'am" at the grocery

--__--__--

Message: 11
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 17:24:52 -0800 (PST)
From: Susan Profit <tinne at eskimo.com>
To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk
Subject: [LMB] OT: Famous people
Reply-To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

Andrew,
My alma mater (TESC) was an unusual school. Drew a lot of creative
people, and yes, Matt was one of them. Statistically though, I may
have a slightly higher probability of meeting celebrities - although
only one part is due to my own efforts and Bill puts me to shame.

I grew up in two state capitols that had populations of under 20,000
(visiting national politicians and state level politicians). My
grandmother danced and taught for years with the Chicago Ballet and we
visited her every summer. Our best friend's mother is the Hungarian
consul (international celebrities in the arts and sciences). I volunteer
with two civic arts groups and for one of them I am in charge of the
Art Show (two from last summer had national reputations, several had
regional reputations.) I also interview between 1-3 authors a month
for the Talking Book and Braille Library - some for my weekly radio
show and some simple author interviews, including Christine Smith and
Herself. 

Now, if you are in the Seattle area, can enunciate clearly and are
willing to volunteer, I can arrange for an audition. If you pass, they
may offer you a chance to meet and interview authors yourself. Got an
extra four hours a week?

Bill? He has it all over me though. As a stagehand he's worked shows
from Kathy Mattea to Elton John to the Stones to Cirque D' Soleil to
the Indigo Girls to Korn to The London Symphony Orchestra to Bill
Gates' product rollouts to Boeing rollouts to Herb Alpert to Glen
Yarborough to Glen Campbell to  the Nitty Gritty Dirt Band to you name
it. I can't hold a candle to him. 

(Well maybe when I bit Adlai Stevenson as a presidential candidate but
he patted my head without permission or Maestro Solti at the ballet,
but then I have odd tastes.) I am sure there are other people on the
list who have a higher statistical probability than either he or I at
meeting celebrities. Besides, Lisa wasn't the celebrity, her father
who wasn't speaking to her was.

Susan Profit

--__--__--

Message: 12
From: "Padget, Scott R" <scott.r.padget at boeing.com>
To: "'Bujold Mailing List'" <lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk>
Subject: More Texas Boyz (was Re: [LMB] DI chapter 6 from
  webscriptions)-- Despoilered
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 19:26:13 -0600
Reply-To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

Despoilered DI quote:
> > skin-fitting ship knits made splendid with glitter.

Andrew:
> Does this mean we need to make Ian into a <spoiler> for next Con?

Now *that*, I wanna see!!  :-)

> Me too.  I'm not even an Engineer.  But I'm afraid to see what the Pilot 
> will dance like.

Thhhhbbbbtt!  Now I'm all intimidated and insecure.  I'll have to bone up on
the tango befoe the gathering.  Somehow.  Sometime.  <"Doing...the Masochism
Tango!">

Laura G. comes to my defense:
> Well, the one time I actually got to meet the Pilot in person, we did
> take him to an SCA dance practice.  For general socialization only, as
> IIRC he was recovering from a foot or leg injury, so I didn't get to
> dance with him.  Pout.  I'm sure he would have been a lovely partner.

That was less than a week after spraining my ankle.  I was still walking
with a cane.  Though I *did* limp on out to do a simple bransle or two, as I
remember.  Stupid of me, I know, but there you have it.

Pilot Padget--who needs to get home and study *sailing* sometime soon, not
dance

--__--__--

Message: 13
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 17:29:22 -0800
From: Damien Raphael <phoenix at ugcs.caltech.edu>
To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: [LMB] FW: Betan Technological Superiority.
Reply-To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

On Tue, Feb 12, 2002 at 01:22:06PM +1300, Mandos D Shadowspawn Esq wrote:

> I would have thought the only area's that the US is ahead in are Weapons
> Tech, GE Grain Technologies and some pharmacuticals.
 
How many computer chip companies aren't American?  AMD, Intel, HP, and
IBM are all American.  

Or there's airplanes, though that gives us Boeing vs. Airbus.  

Even back in the 1980s, when people were afraid Japan was going to buy
up the United States, the complaint wasn't that we just sucked, but that
we'd invent stuff but Japanese companies would bring it to market.

And US research universities seem a cut above the rest of the world, or
are at least considered to be so.

> Not wanting to argue the technological leads of individual nations it just
> seems a little simplisticly defined in LMB's books that Beta is ahead at
> just about everything and makes most of their export monies from
> technological export.

Simplistically described, Betan culture seems to have research and
discovery, or from another angle information processing, as its central
focus.  Barrayar is focused on the Vor and the military and
terraforming.  Cetaganda is focused on the aesthetic and genetic
concerns of the haut.  Jackson's Whole and Komarr are focused on profit,
in different ways.  Lairouba might be focused on Islam.  A bunch of
"agricultural planets" are focused on scrabbling in the dirt.  Athos is
focused on... I don't know, just getting on with life.

Beta maxes out everyone's education, and has ready access to
information, and heavy public investment in research and exploration,
and a culture of free-wheeling thought and questioning, with few
blinders (and the constraints we've seen don't seem likely to get in the
way of research, except for Ryoval/haut-style stuff.)  It's a giant
social engine for research.

Well, I'm extrapolating somewhat from the text.  But this seems like
reasonable justification.

Earlier there was discussion about the constitutional bounds on the
Betan military.  Never mind that; what about constitutional guarantees
of research and education funding?  The BAS might get more
constitutional text than the BDF.

> That would be more believable as regardless of governmental systems very
few
> environments involving people stay static for very long and staying ahead
> for that long is unlikely :-)

Staying _behind_ for that long is historically likely.  Why not ahead?

-xx- Damien X-) 

--__--__--

Message: 14
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 17:32:45 -0800 (PST)
From: Susan Profit <tinne at eskimo.com>
To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk
Subject: [LMB] OT: RE: Famous People
Reply-To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

The thing about meeting famous folks is that -they- are the ones
people remember. Those I have managed to make a favorable enough
impression to for them to remember -me- even vaguely will be far far
less. I have no doubts that few of the authors I interview remember me
three months later, let alone twenty years later. 

Susan in Seattle

--__--__--

Message: 15
From: "Michael Bauminger" <mikebomb at myrealbox.com>
To: <lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [LMB] OT: List traffic explosion
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 20:37:03 -0500
Reply-To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

I wanted to thank those of you - including Pam Gotcher, Brad DeLong,
Casey Allison, Mark Atwood, and even Robert Parks for your
suggestions, some of which are more applicable to my situation than
others.

I use "Outlook Depressed" and telecommute (work at home). This means
that I have limited sorting/threading functionality and no commuting
time when I can read the list. I have been looking into the
possibility of moving to Eudora for its greater functionality - I
think I am going to get more serious about that.

When I am not working on a tight deadline (and if I am caught up), I
usually have enough time to read each day's traffic that day,
excepting from Friday sundown to an hour after sundown Saturday, when
I cannot compute and must catch up Saturday night and Sunday. When I
have to spend every second on the computer working, I cannot read 100+
posts each day.

I still do not know what I am going to do. I am 635 messages behind as
of this moment, and that does not include the 328 messages in my
"Spoilers" folder.

~Michael

--__--__--

Message: 16
From: "Phyllis LeFevre" <plefevre at hotmail.com>
To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: [LMB] DI---- NO SPOILERS
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 20:46:13 -0500
Reply-To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

>Pilot Padget--but amused when he gets called "Ma'am" at the grocery

I *know* the second part of this reply was posted first, BUT......THIS
made me go HUH??????????????

 

>annoyed at linejumpers ever since grammar school, <

I was out with friends Saturday night (we went to Captiva and then had
dinner on Sanibel Island....after which we were going to the movies to
see Brotherhood of the Wolf).

Anywhooooooooo, I offered to treat for coffee/tea/beverages at the local
Barnes & Noble which has a (swoooooooons) Starbuck's cafe. I stood in
line for OVER 15 minutes and then when I FINALLY got to the register, the
@#$%^&*^%#$%^%$#$% cashier took the order of the woman behind me!!!!!! 
When I spoke up, the cashier replied, "Ohhh, I didn't see you behind the
register". *explodes*  To make matters worse, I became VERY vocal and
VERY LOUD (I was having one of those moments)....and after my beverages
were ordered and paid for, the cashier had the GALL to say to the woman
behind me in line "Thank you for being so patient". 
AAAAAARRRRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!

Needless to say, the bookstore manager got a VERY polite, but curt replay
of the events.

Phyllis
who's friends KNOW not to get between her and her Starbucks coffee!  ;-)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~  "..since
no one is perfect, it follows that all great deeds have been accomplished
out of imperfection. Yet they were accomplished, somehow, all the same."
Cordelia Naismith Vorkosigan,  Mirror Dance  by Lois McMaster Bujold

------------------------------------------------------------------------

MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: Click Here

--__--__--

Message: 17
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 17:53:21 -0800
From: Damien Raphael <phoenix at ugcs.caltech.edu>
To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk
Subject: Re: [LMB] FW: Betan Technological Superiority
Reply-To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

On Mon, Feb 11, 2002 at 07:19:51PM -0600, Padget, Scott R wrote:
> > I'd say the US has 
> > maintained a lead in all technological areas I can think of for some 
> > hundred years
> 
> ???  So we were the technological leaders in the 1890's or 19-aughts?
*Not*
> Great Britain?
 
In chemistry I think Germany led.  And the best zeppelins came from
there, not the US or Britain.  Of course the plane got invented here.
But the jet plane... well, Germany had the first jet fighters, and the
rockets.  But we had the A-bomb.  Earlier we had Edison and Bell and
lots of agriscience research...

I find myself too ignorant to really compare the US and Britain of the
time, though.

> And of *course* we're the technological leaders nowadays.  That explains
why
> we all use US-made computers stuffed with US-made chips and why the
mileage,

I think you're looking at location of manufacturing, not location of
design.  I'll give you the cars, though.

Yes, I'm arguing both sides of the fence.  It doesn't really affect my
University Republic of Beta idea (not named as such before).

> competition the US commercial airplane manufacturers have, right?  Boeing,
> McDonnell Douglas, Lockheed:  The Big Three aren't particularly bothered
by
> that European upstart, right?
 
Airbus gets direct subsidies from the EU countries, Boeing gets military
contracts as subsidies.  I have seen analyses claiming that if all the
governments had stayed out Boeing would dominate, if only from the
advantage of selling to a larger market.

> is defunct, and Boeing is eyeing the new Airbus superjumbo with
> ill-concealed loathing....
 
Last I heard, in the Wall Street Journal, Airbus was gambling on a new
really big plane (800+ seats, double-decker), while Boeing was
deliberately rejecting that approach in favor of extending the 747 a
bit, for much lower research costs.  The article claimed that Boeing had
not designed the 747 to be a Really Big Plane, the way the Concorde was
designed to be Really Fast Plane; the 747 was instead the smallest and
slowest plane which would meet the market niche Boeing perceived.

The final take being Airbus was either more optimistic than Boeing or
making a prestige play; certainly Boeing would be as able to design a
superjumbo if its judgement of the market called for it.

That was a couple of years ago.

> in a great many areas of military tech, and radar was a *British*
invention)

Then there's cryptography, jointly dominated by the US and Britain.

> to around 1980 or thereabouts.  Before that I think Britain was the
leader,
> and after that the US passed the torch to Japan and Germany--we just
haven't
> really admitted it yet.
 
The software torch?  The biotech torch?

As I said, there's the research side, and the manufacturing side, and
there's the fact that trade and communications are much cheaper here
than in the Nexus, and that there are economic units larger than
nation-states which have been dominant for centuries and don't seem likely
to lose place soon.  The US hasn't been around for 500 years, of course,
but Europe and its colonies have led in weapons tech[1] since the cannon.

[1] Does that ever seem odd to anyone?  Peaceful unmilitarized[2] animal
non-eating Beta Colony selling weapons all over the Nexus?

[2] I was going to say Beta's obviously not dis-armament pacifist.  Then
I wondered about investment in arms and defenses.  Remembering
Cordelia's crack about buying Mark a watch factory... it's like the US
in WWII.  You don't need a constant investment in armaments if you can
build them before anyone really hurts you.  Meaning: invest in the arms
factories[3]...

[3] "Tax the rat farms."

-xx- Damien X-) 

--__--__--

Message: 18
From: "D Echelbarger" <diane at dendarii.com>
To: <lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [LMB] BAS uniforms 
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 19:55:27 -0600
Reply-To: lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

> Diane E.:
> > A belt with accessories (canteen, empty stunner holster, pouch
with
> > instant oatmeal and blue cheese dressing inside, folding shovel)
> > would also have the effect of cinching the BDUs in at the waist.

Scott then suggested:
> And there are ways to tuck the shirt into the pants that provide a
smooth,
> quasi-tailored look.
> Short form of the lesson:<SNIP>

Umm.... Scott, given that BDUs have big, bulky pockets below the
waist, I don't think this will result in a very 'smooth' look. <G>

Now for ordinary khaki shirts, yeah. But not for BDUs.

BTW, someone asked off-list. These also come in grey, although they're
harder to find. So you can have a Dendarii Mercenary instead of
Cordelia in the Band, if you like.  :)

Pictures at: http://www.us-army-navy-surplus.com/bdus.htm

Diane E


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