[LMB] A military question

Harimad harimad2001 at yahoo.com
Tue Sep 6 03:29:15 BST 2011

There are even more types of operations than even these.  The term "operations" gets bandied about very widely.  It could be any number of fields: what you call real-time engaging, the logistical operations you also describe, spy ops, special ops (such as SEALs), operational planning (advance planning for what you call real-time engagements), and on and on.  

The question at hand isn't what does "ops" mean in the US military, it's what does it mean in the Barrayan military.  Which means figuring out what Lois thinks ops means.  As we've discussed a few thousand times before, what Lois means doesn't always follow what the US military does.  Therefore I continue to maintain that Ivan's ops job could be any of the above.  

It'd be an interesting study, pulling together the bits we hear about Ivan's job to learn what it actually is.  It certainly isn't going into the field and shooting things and it certainly isn't the sort of ops that Miles conducts.

- Harimad

--- On Tue, 9/6/11, Paula Lieberman <paal at gis.net> wrote:
> From: Paula Lieberman <paal at gis.net>
> Bah...
> Op[erations] is live, real time military activities
> carrying out military missions...
> It is NOT -planning- in advance for activities,  it is
> NOT research and development, it is NOT administrative
> stuff, it is the real-time engaging in activities carrying
> out military missions.
> "Logistics" is the discipline and activities involved in
> figuring out how to get people and equipment to/from places,
> figuring out how to pre-position people and materiel 
> [yes, that spelling is deliberate, it's "materiel"] and move
> people and materiel around, and figuring out how much
> materiel and how many people are needed for what when and
> where.....
> There are logistics -operations- of airlift, sealift, and
> other transportation activities hauling people and equipment
> around and delivering people and materiel to places and
> locations, the operations, again, are the -activities- of
> actively engaging in transporting the people and material
> around.

> -----Original Message----- From: Harimad
> Sent: Monday, September 05, 2011 10:41 AM
> To: Discussion of the works of Lois McMaster Bujold.
> Subject: Re: [LMB] A military question
> Belatedly...
> Ops definitely means Operations.  The question is,
> what does operations mean?  It could be logistics -
> which are damn important in a modern military.  It's
> said that good leaders worry about tactics, great ones about
> logistics - for example, Gen Eisenhower organizing D-Day.
> Ops could also mean more active operations, such as spy ops
> or counterspy ops.  Using Eisenhower again, the many
> levels of operation to deceive the Nazis about where the
> D-Day invasion was going to happen.
> - Harimad

> --- On Wed, 7/13/11, beatrice_otter at haugensgalleri.com
> <beatrice_otter at haugensgalleri.com>
> wrote:
> > From: beatrice_otter at haugensgalleri.com
> <beatrice_otter at haugensgalleri.com>
> > Subject: Re: [LMB] A military question
> > To: "Discussion of the works of Lois McMaster Bujold."
> <lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk>
> > Date: Wednesday, July 13, 2011, 1:43 AM
> > Ops=Operations=Planning things.
> > All the boring numbers-crunching and
> > war-gaming that has to be done in a modern military to
> keep
> > things running
> > smoothly, make sure all units are where they are
> needed
> > most with the most
> > effective orders, with the people and materiel they
> > need.  Think of it
> > kind of like the Pentagon.
> > 
> > Beatrice Otter
> > 
> > > We all know that Ivan is in Ops.
> > >
> > > Just as a matter of interest, what does Ops
> actually do?
> > >
> > > Gwynne
> = 
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