[LMB] OT: Evolution, WAS verging on forbidden territory: GOP attitudes about science

JenL jenl1625 at gmail.com
Sat Sep 10 15:00:00 BST 2011

On Sat, Sep 10, 2011 at 6:54 AM, Bear Master <bearmaster0 at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Fri, Sep 9, 2011 at 4:23 AM, mtraber251 <mtraber251 at earthlink.net>
> wrote:
> > On 9/8/2011 11:55 AM, Claire Nollet wrote:
> >
> >> Yeah, my BOSS believes that the earth is 6000 years old, because some
> >> preacher came to her church and explained how that whole carbon-14
> >> business
> >> is nonsense, etc.
> >>
> >> I have issues with some applications of carbon 14 testing, but it is a
> > materials handling issue ...
> >
> > Look - when you are testing a textile that has both gone through a
> *major*
> > fire, with commensurate damage, *and* spent centuries hung in buildings
> lit
> > by flames, censored with incense, wafted through environments filled with
> > tobacco smoke in various forms, and breathed upon by numerous handlers
> there
> > *is* going to be *contamination* no matter how you look at it.
> >
> > I am not claiming that the Shroud of Turin is real, or not. I am just
> > saying  that the test may have been screwed. I find that there is
> reasonable
> > doubt as to the accuracy of that particular test.
> >
> >
> None of those issues were raised before the test.
> Particulates remain on the surface of the fibers, not incorporated into
> them, and care is taken to remove them.  To skew the results that badly,
> they  would have had to outweigh the material.  The linen would have been
> contaminating the soot.

This got me interested enough to go back and look at a few of those links.
 Apparently, a few years back, someone advanced further (reasonably
significant) evidence for the argument that the location all three samples
were taken from (one corner of the shroud) was actually a "patch" that was
added to fix the effects of wear accumulated over the years.  Which means,
arguably, that the samples were accurately carbon-dated yet not
representative of the rest of the cloth.

A few years back, someone apparently came up with a way to carbon-date
entire objects without damage to them (by placing them in a specific gas for
a while, then dating the gas).  That could theoretically be used to
carbon-date the entire shroud without damaging it, but it's not like the
folks in control of the shroud are going to believe that easily...


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