[LMB] OT: weight & stuff, was Dilbert's creator on science, medicine, and diet -

A. Marina Fournier saffronrose at me.com
Sat Nov 26 08:54:25 GMT 2016


On Nov 23, 2016, at 01:53 PM, Jason Long <sturmvogel66 at gmail.com> wrote:

BMI is for shit. It's a simple system that anyone can use quickly that
takes no account of body-fat percentages and is thus inaccurate for those
people that are seriously fit.

On Wed, Nov 23, 2016 at 3:57 PM, anmar Caver <anmar.mirza at gmail.com> wrote:

I'm only half white but BMI has me at 35.2 at 5'6" and 218#. Or obese.
Now, I grant I am carrying more bodyfat than I want, but most of my mass is
muscle and bone. A lifetime of caving a couple of times a week has given
me very strong core muscles and my bone density is such that I don't float
in water even with a full breath.

amf:
According to Wikipedia, 
>>BMI (developed in the mid-19th C. by a mathematician) was explicitly cited by Ancel Keys, who coined the phrase, as "appropriate for population studies and inappropriate for individual evaluation". Nevertheless, due to its simplicity, it has come to be widely used for preliminary diagnosis. Additional metrics, such as waist circumference, can be more useful.<<
         and further
>>In 1998, the U.S. National Institutes of Health and the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention brought U.S. definitions in line with World Health Organization guidelines, lowering the normal/overweight cut-off from BMI 27.8 to BMI 25. This had the effect of redefining approximately 29 million Americans, previously healthy, to overweight.[28]

This can partially explain the increase in the overweight diagnosis in the past 20 years, and the increase in sales of weight loss products during the same time. WHO also recommends lowering the normal/overweight threshold for South East Asian body types to around BMI 23, and expects further revisions to emerge from clinical studies of different body types.<<

             As Anmar notes,

>>BMI is particularly inaccurate for people who are very fit or athletic, as their high muscle mass can classify them in the overweight category by BMI, even though their body fat percentages frequently fall in the 10–15% category, which is below that of a more sedentary person of average build who has a normal BMI number.

A 2010 study that followed 11,000 subjects for up to eight years concluded that BMI is not a good measure for the risk of heart attack, stroke or death. A better measure was found to be the waist-to-height ratio. A 2011 study that followed 60,000 participants for up to 13 years found that waist–hip ratio was a better predictor of ischaemic heart disease mortality.<<



While I weighed 97 lbs without any anorexia or bulimia once achieving what passes for full height, through the end of college, once I lost space to do any dance workout at home, and then ceased to be able to commute via bicycle, I gained weight. I acknowledge that I have excess adipose tissue. My bones are lighter/smaller than my sister's: I got the matrilineal  Middle-Eastern genes, and she got the patrilineal German/English/Norman farmer genes for skeletal makeup. Even at her least adult weight, after the bariatric surgery and lots of exercise to reduce remaining weight, she still looked heavier than I would at that weight and exercise level.

What I'd really like to know, as I lose weight, is what weight is being lost? Am I losing weight because I'm not sustaining my muscle mass? I don't want that! I don't think I'm losing bone mass, but if there were a system that could easily tell me how much the bones, the fat, and the muscle weighed--and where are organs counted in that?--I'd be better informed for decisions about my diet and exercise regimen.



Anmar:

But, I do try to eat healthy and I exercise a lot. Not because I want to lose weight, but because I enjoy it. I enjoy feeling that my body is strong and I love the physicality of it. I also want to keep my
cardiovascular system as healthy as possible so I can enjoy these things as long as possible in life.



amf: it's a good thing I like as much produce as I do. As I must have mentioned a few times, I am constantly craving fish and seafood (let Weird Al do something with that to Constant Craving! I love that he's a Grammar & Puncutation nerd), which a) are less resource-intensive and b) more in line with the Mediterranean diet. 



Happens I like a lot of those foods, but I just have to plan for them. I didn't grow up with southern or farmer cooking, and we only had meat&potatoes food once our mom remarried. She didn't know how to do deep frying, thus I never developed a taste for much in the way of fried foods. Unfortunately, I married a man whose teens were spent in KY, and whose family had pretty much been PA farming folk. He likes heavier food than I do, and cream sauces and soups over the brothier versions I prefer. While I don't cook them, I really enjoy a variety of Asian cuisines. Poké bars & restaurants are showing up all over the places, and cheaper than the equivalent amount of protein at a sushi restaurant, with more vegetation.



Robin Ellis, the "first (or ska "real") Ross Poldark", has three cookbooks for the diabetic--and those who wish to avoid being one--who wants to eat tasty food. His latest, with his ex-pat US wife Meredith as the photographer (she's also a beekeeper), is centered on some very tasty Mediterranean dishes. I wouldn't know any of this had I not stumbled onto his blog earlier this year.



and US Thanksgiving Day? One midday meal, and dessert a bit later. I filled my plate as if my sister and I were sharing, and could only eat about a third of it. I passed on the cornbread stuffing, as I've never liked it, but piled on the green beans, mushrooms, brussels sprouts, and a modest helping of Moroccan Sweet Potatoes, trying for the 1/2 plant matter, 1/4 grain/starch, and 1/4 protein ratio. She gets the rest of what was on the plate when I can get it to her.



Even though we were all like-minded about the election results, we chose not to discuss them, but focused on more personal topics. I hope those who celebrate US Thanksgiving had a very pleasant day.



Marina


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