[LMB] was: Language Now Vat Meat Ethics

M. Haller Yamada thefabmadamem at yahoo.com
Thu Aug 15 08:34:52 BST 2019

From: "M. Haller Yamada" <thefabmadamem at yahoo.com>

Gwynne: Vat meat can't chew cud; does that mean it won't be kosher?
I was wondering the same thing. But it won't have ANY hooves, so?isn't there the chance that vat meat will be classified as a vegetable??
It seems to me I read somewhere about some odd classifications ofcertain foods, either by Jewish people, or possibly by Catholics backwhen they were much pickier about their dietary laws. I can't bring upeven a smidgen of which animals they might have been. #FridayBrainFog.

Gwynne: Meat classed as a vegetable!  My dreams come true!

Btw, what happens with vegans when vat meat is available. Since most
objections are based on the cruelty to animals of eating them, will it be
ok to eat meat when it's from a vat?
Micki: (Shrugs) Every Vegan is Different. My husband's aunt and uncle are
differently abled so must eat with us most of the time, and they don't like
the taste or texture of meat. They'll eat fish, sausages and stewed meat in
curry. Another vegan I knew didn't evangelize, but she also didn't eat any
animal products or use them AFAIK. 

So, if vat meat is really green, I predict many vegans will happily eat it. Some
will not like the taste or texture and feel it's "gaggy" to eat. And, you are going 
to get some meat-eaters who won't eat it because vat meat is "unnatural". 

The nutritional info on vat meat is probably going to be long! Maybe they'll use 
some sort of QR code that provides the personalized info you want as a consumer?

James Bryant later questions the definition of "meat" in vat meat (being a philosopher by
training). Honestly, I think whether it's made by cloning or by printing the matrix with
protein, it's called "meat" mostly for advertising purposes. Maybe in a few centuries, 
the term "meat" will have evolved, but I think the terms "vegan" and "vegetarian"
will also have to evolve.

Howard says: The first vat meat may have come from a (once) living animal.   Heck, that animal may still be living after a biopsy pulled out the meat grown in a vat.

Micki: Oooh, Henrietta Lacks-like once-in-a-million lab mutation meat!
(I do hope it'll be more ethically sourced and maintained, though.) 

Caroline Tabach brings up the "can you have dairy with vat meat" complication. 

Micki: My goodness. Meat without a mother, and if they do vat milk, milk without a kid. 
What's the deal with mixing synthetic fibers? Does that have any bearing, or is
shatnez specific enough that it causes no problems? 

The more I think about it, the more I think they'll just choose a different name for
vat meat besides "meat". Especially at the beginning, it won't be completely 
meaty, and I can provide anecdata that calling something "X" can ruin it if
it isn't like "X" -- uncanny valley X. For example, I used to dislike Japanese 
pickles for a long time because they were called "pickles" in English. They
are nothing like my beloved vinegar/brine dill pickles and I resented them
for not living up to the name of "pickles". But call them "tsukemono" and I
am generally fine with them, and even enjoy them at times. 

So, don't call it vat beef. Call it Starry Skies Protein Substitute (eventually
shortens to Stars or SkyzP or something). Or form the vat protein into 
foam balls and call them something nonsensical like "Bibblz for kids! The
fun way to get your daily dozen!" 



More information about the Lois-Bujold mailing list