[LMB] Citizenship? - Oaths and Arde

Edith khoreutees at yahoo.com
Sat Dec 4 18:06:30 GMT 2021


On 03/12/2021 14:20, Howard Brazee wrote:
>
>> On Dec 2, 2021, at 11:51 PM, Matija Grabnar via Lois-Bujold <lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>> On 03/12/2021 04:32, Howard Brazee wrote:
>>> Passport citizenship is dependent upon the land people are born in.   But Barrayar’s loyalty is to the lords.
>> Not always. US, and other immigrant built countries grant citizenship to anyone born there, but that was not always/everywhere the norm. I remember reading that in Germany children of guest workers could not get citizenship.
>>
>> I just checked, and it says that in Germany, for a child to gain citizenship, one of the parents has to be a German citizen, or a legal resident of Germany for eight years or more. I think the "legal resident" part is new, I seem to recall that it used to be just "one of the parents was a citizen”.
> Different levels of citizenship.

No, not in this case. At least, as far as I can see, birth in Germany to 
a legal resident gives the child citizenship automatically and by right. 
That may have been added to German law as a protection against 
statelessness. A number of countries that generally have ius sanguinis 
rules have some kind of eligibility for ius soli either like this based 
on parental residence or for the second generation born in the country 
(as well as the safeguards for a child who would otherwise be stateless 
born in the country)

Some (but by no means all) countries distinguish between birthright 
citizens and naturalised citizens in some respects, including grounds on 
which citizenship can be lost. There are also some that maintain 
different categories of citizenship, which is...often problematic (look 
up Myanmar's citizenship issues sometime if you really want to know how 
toxic that approach can be).

>    Legal residents still need passports somehow.
Usually legal residents do not get passports from their country of 
residence, but from their country of citizenship. I can't think of 
examples where legal residents are issued with passports (other 
documents and forms of identification sure, but not passports). Even 
refugees and stateless persons are normally issued with travel documents 
that are pointedly not passports.


More information about the Lois-Bujold mailing list