[LMB] Citizenship? - Oaths and Arde

WILLIAM A WENRICH wawenri at msn.com
Wed Dec 8 15:57:23 GMT 2021

Didn’t Aral and Cordilia regularize the laws about changing districts and counts?

William A Wenrich

  *   A sinner dependent on God’s grace.

From: Lois-Bujold <lois-bujold-bounces at lists.herald.co.uk> on behalf of Elizabeth Holden <alzurite at gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 7, 2021 11:12:03 AM
To: Discussion of the works of Lois McMaster Bujold. <lois-bujold at lists.herald.co.uk>
Subject: [LMB] Citizenship? - Oaths and Arde

On Dec 6, 2021, at 8:52 PM, Raymond Collins <rcrcoll6 at gmail.com> wrote:
> According to the 14th Amendment anyone born in the United States is
> automatically a US citizen. Even children of foreign officials who are
> stationed here.

Speaking as a non-American, this strikes me as vaguely terrifying. But it's
the same in Canada. And if you don't want to be American/Canadian?  I guess
you sort it out with the nationality you do want. I have cousins who were
born in Argentina (of Canadian parents), but grew up in Canada: when they
were in their late teens, they said they were eligible for the draft in
Argentina, and so didn't intend to visit there.

It reminds me of a problem that was occurring in Canada perhaps a decade or
two ago - long since sorted out, I hope.  There was a town, or several
towns, in the prairies not far from the American border. The closest
hospital to the town was on the American side of the border, and it became
routine for women to go there to give birth.

Then - possibly when the babies reached 21, or retirement age, or some
other age of significance to the government, they were told they weren't
Canadian because they weren't born in Canada. (Presumably in earlier times
they had been treated as if they were Canadian, because everyone assumed
they were.)

My father lived through a variation of that. He was born in England, went
with his parents to Newfoundland when he was two, then grew up in Nova
Scotia and Ontario after that. He went yo various schools, joined the navy
in World War II, worked for the civil service for decades. When when it
came time to retire, the government said, "Prove to us that you're
Canadian. Show us your papers."

To which my father replied, "Papers? I was two years old. What would I know
about papers?"

I don't know how he persuaded them he was Canadian, but he did. (Presumably
papers that attested to it existed somewhere in the depths of bureaucracy,
or maybe a notarized statement did it.)

I suspect the system on Beta Colony is like the American system, and that
the Barrayaran system is much less systematic, and depends to some extent
the way the Counts of each area want it to be. Unless Gregor has modernized
(for want of a better word) the laws.

My guess is that Barrayar, Komarr, and Sergyar each have their own
residency/citizenship laws, but that it's all connected at the top by
Barrayaran custom. Oaths would be the important feature on Barrayar;
contracts on Komarr; perhaps a combination of both on Sergyar?

I am wondering how big the population of Sergyar is by the end of
"Gentleman Jole and the Red Queen."


Elizabeth Holden <azurite at azurite.ca>
Lois-Bujold mailing list message sent to wawenri at msn.com
Lois-Bujold at lists.herald.co.uk

More information about the Lois-Bujold mailing list